Measles outbreak in Pacific Northwest

[bbbass]

As a father of a once very medically fragile daughter, when a common cold would send her to the childrens hospital for a month long stay where she would be npo and on tpn, a bug like measles could have killed her. Some parents have the choice to not vaccinate their healthy children, and would rather take that risk of getting sick. Unfortunately their potentially minor sickness could be a death sentence for others in the community.

I hope she's doing very well! And I agree with you.

 

[G8rHunter]

Vaccines don't cause autism. That's medical quackery! Vaccines typically protect from widespread epidemics. The one's who suffer are the young, the old, and those who have comorbidities. Google comorbidity if you can't figure it out. Now, no one would refuse to get a vaccine if they thought doing so would protect their elderly parents or small children from dying. The flu can cause a young child or the elderly to lose a lot of body fluids and become dehydrated. Dehydration can lead to major organ failure and death. I have seen many patients lose their life because of the carelessness of others! I have been healthy as a ox, and I could rightly argue I don't need the flu shot. Many people reason in such a manner, not realizing getting the flu shot is to protect the vulnerable from catching the flu from them!

 

[bbbass]

I have a litany of medical issues. Some result in a compromised immune system and poor overall health. I've had pneumonia a few times... not only can the flu kill me, and a host of other elderly, but a simple URV of the type that seems to go around endlessly can do the same. Not a good feeling when people are acting irresponsibly.

 

[Carbon]

I hope she's doing very well! And I agree with you.

Thanks, she is doing well now, in preschool and handling colds like a champ. Shes been through more medically in her few years than I would see in lifetimes, but its made her incredibly strong, you can ask the 4 nurses plus me it takes to hold her still"ish" for an iv.

 

[G8rHunter]

I have a litany of medical issues. Some result in a compromised immune system and poor overall health. I've had pneumonia a few times... not only can the flu kill me, and a host of other elderly, but a simple URV of the type that seems to go around endlessly can do the same. Not a good feeling when people are acting irresponsibly.

Probably the biggest frustration of the medical community is seeing innocent people die when it could have been easily avoidable! We have a responsibility to protect the very young, those like yourself, BBBass with medical issues, and the fragile elderly through proper vaccination.

 

[MikeInOr]

Helmet laws, seat belt laws, vaccination laws, soft drink cup size laws... they all are a balance between government legislating safety vs personal freedoms.

I think that parents who do not vaccinate their children are nuts and doing their children a huge disservice by exposing their children to risks of dieing or being mamed by easily preventable diseases.

We should really just pass a law that everyone should have to think exactly how I think and this would put an end to all these stupid irrational fears!

 

[Carbon]

This also reminds me of a documentary I recently saw about a mountain man in the 1830s, his wife and kids lived in St. Louis, he ended up being quite well off from his trading over the years and went into politics. But 10 of his 13 children died before the age of 8 due to now preventable illnesses. Thats what a non vaccinated world is like.

 

[Papa]

The issue with vaccines, as I understand it, is the multiple vaccines that are combined together and the preservative used that's mercury based... only single dose, single purpose vaccines for my youngen...

Yeah I know it's a meme... meme's are awesome.

 

[Cavedweller]

Some vaccines are more effective than others. Small pox and polio seem to have been successes. That doesn't mean all vaccines are effective or worth the risk. For several reasons, in any given year the flu vaccine may offer no protection, but always carries some risk.

The flu vaccine is typically made to protect against 3 or 4 strains of flu. But, the flu virus mutates very rapidly and no one can tell which strain of flu will cause disease in the US in any given year. It is generally believed that last year's flu in Asia will be this year's flu in N. America. So, flu vaccines are prepared using 3 or 4 strains isolated in Asia in the previous year. The vaccine may or may not be effective because:
1) The wrong strains were chosen.
2) The virus mutated before it got here.
3) Some other unknown reason.
So, it's a bit of a crap shoot.

From the CDC website:
"...recent studies show that flu vaccination reduces the risk of flu illness by between 40% and 60% among the overall population during seasons when most circulating flu viruses are well-matched to the flu vaccine."

"How well the flu vaccine works (or its ability to prevent flu illness) can vary from season to season... During years when the flu vaccine is not well matched to circulating influenza viruses, it is possible that little or no benefit from flu vaccination may be observed."

Vaccine Effectiveness - How Well Does the Flu Vaccine Work? | CDC

So, while the vaccine may offer some or no protection, depending on the year, it always causes some injury or disease:

"One of the most serious documented influenza vaccine reactions is Guillain-Barre Syndrome (GBS). 1 An immune mediated painful and disabling neurological disorder that can occur after viral infection or vaccination, GBS involves inflammation of the peripheral nervous system and can cause temporary or permanent paralysis that may lead to death. 2"

Can Influenza Vaccine Cause Injury and Death? - NVIC

So for those who want to get it, fine, but know it may or may not work, and it does carry risk. And understand that those who decline to get it do so for very good reasons.

 

[Alexx1401]

S

So for those who want to get it, fine, but know it may or may not work, and it does carry risk. And understand that those who decline to get it do so for very good reasons.

Life is full of risk, the people I work with are in health care. Guess who dies if we come to work and spread flu? The family of the people these workers kill probably will not want to hear how they "had good reason to not get the vaccine. The place I work will let us go without if we jump through a LOT of hoops. Other places flat out say "don't want the protection, you don't work here". I have zero problems with that. Anyone that convinced the vaccine will harm them is welcome to not work around the people they may kill by getting sick.

 

[Cavedweller]

Life is full of risk, the people I work with are in health care. Guess who dies if we come to work and spread flu? The family of the people these workers kill probably will not want to hear how they "had good reason to not get the vaccine. The place I work will let us go without if we jump through a LOT of hoops. Other places flat out say "don't want the protection, you don't work here". I have zero problems with that. Anyone that convinced the vaccine will harm them is welcome to not work around the people they may kill by getting sick.

Might be a good idea for those working in health care to get vaccinated, for their sake and their patient's sake as well. Especially if your job requires it and you want to keep your job. We all have to pay the bills. All I'm saying is vaccination doesn't necessarily mean protection. The flu vaccine is a hit or miss affair, even in a good year.

 

[jordanka16]

Some vaccines are more effective than others. Small pox and polio seem to have been successes. That doesn't mean all vaccines are effective or worth the risk. For several reasons, in any given year the flu vaccine may offer no protection, but always carries some risk.

The flu vaccine is typically made to protect against 3 or 4 strains of flu. But, the flu virus mutates very rapidly and no one can tell which strain of flu will cause disease in the US in any given year. It is generally believed that last year's flu in Asia will be this year's flu in N. America. So, flu vaccines are prepared using 3 or 4 strains isolated in Asia in the previous year. The vaccine may or may not be effective because:
1) The wrong strains were chosen.
2) The virus mutated before it got here.
3) Some other unknown reason.
So, it's a bit of a crap shoot.

From the CDC website:
"...recent studies show that flu vaccination reduces the risk of flu illness by between 40% and 60% among the overall population during seasons when most circulating flu viruses are well-matched to the flu vaccine."

"How well the flu vaccine works (or its ability to prevent flu illness) can vary from season to season... During years when the flu vaccine is not well matched to circulating influenza viruses, it is possible that little or no benefit from flu vaccination may be observed."

Vaccine Effectiveness - How Well Does the Flu Vaccine Work? | CDC

So, while the vaccine may offer some or no protection, depending on the year, it always causes some injury or disease:

"One of the most serious documented influenza vaccine reactions is Guillain-Barre Syndrome (GBS). 1 An immune mediated painful and disabling neurological disorder that can occur after viral infection or vaccination, GBS involves inflammation of the peripheral nervous system and can cause temporary or permanent paralysis that may lead to death. 2"

Can Influenza Vaccine Cause Injury and Death? - NVIC

So for those who want to get it, fine, but know it may or may not work, and it does carry risk. And understand that those who decline to get it do so for very good reasons.

Choosing yourself to not get a flu vaccine is very different than not getting your children vaccinated for an easily preventable and potentially fatal disease. The issue to me is more about parents choosing to not vaccinate their kids, because the kids have no say in the matter. If you work in the healthcare field you should do everything in your power to prevent spreading the flu to people who might not be able to fight it, but if you can stay home and not spread it, eh, don't get a vaccine if you don't want to. I don't think it matters all that much.

 

[jordanka16]

Yeah I know it's a meme... meme's are awesome.View attachment 554788

lol, that chart is not accurate at all, and the website that claims to have done that study is full on crazy. Including an actual article about chemtrails Harvard Scientific Paper Details Entire Geo-Engineering Program Using Jet Aircraft

 

[po18guy]

Couple of points. DW came from El Salvador as the civil war was heating up and bodies were lying in the streets. She had to apply, pay, get medical testing of all sorts, interview with the ambassador and then wait....and wait. But, she brought no disease with her. She claims that she married one. No comment.
Secondly, do we suppose that the upsurge in formerly eradicated diseases is from Canada? AYKM?
Oh, and those e coli problems with our produce? We drive by a farm where we see the workers relieving themselves on that same produce.

 

[Frank RW]

Flu shots though I stay away from after bad experiences in the military.

You might want to revisit getting a flu shot as you get older. A lot has changed since WW2.

 

[Frank RW]

Yeah I know it's a meme... meme's are awesome.View attachment 554788

There's a few misleading things about that meme... not unusual, as most of them have that trait.


Here's a better source for facts VS clever...
Thimerosal and Vaccines


Like, a flu shot has as much mercury as eating a can of tuna. [Which is a whole new debate. ]
We're talking trace amounts (still not good).
But which one will kill you first; the disease or the cure? As a whole, I figure probably the former.

Meanwhile, I don't think it's a HUGE concern, as most immunizations don't have mercury (thimerosal). Even the flu shot has had a mercury-free version that's been available for ~20 years.

 

[bbbass]

So, while the vaccine may offer some or no protection, depending on the year, it always causes some injury or disease:

I take extreme issue with that statement! It's not borne out by my personal experience, nor is it borne out by the facts. You are welcome to your opinion but you don't get to make up your own facts.

From the link you posted:
"Some studies have found a possible small association of injectable flu vaccine with Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS). Overall, these studies estimated the risk for GBS after vaccination as fewer than 1 or 2 cases of GBS per one million people vaccinated. Other studies have not found any association. GBS also, rarely, occurs after flu illness. Even though GBS following flu illness is rare, GBS is more common following flu illness than following flu vaccination. GBS has not been associated with the nasal spray vaccine."

Adult influenza vaccine injury claims are now the leading claim submitted to the federal Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP), with GBS as the leading alleged injury.

Bold type print is my added emphasis. When it comes to vaccine injury, IMO it's all about the hype and the money.

 

[Cavedweller]

I take extreme issue with that statement! It's not borne out by my personal experience, nor is it borne out by the facts. You are welcome to your opinion but you don't get to make up your own facts.

From the link you posted:
"Some studies have found a possible small association of injectable flu vaccine with Guillain-Barré syndrome (GBS). Overall, these studies estimated the risk for GBS after vaccination as fewer than 1 or 2 cases of GBS per one million people vaccinated. Other studies have not found any association. GBS also, rarely, occurs after flu illness. Even though GBS following flu illness is rare, GBS is more common following flu illness than following flu vaccination. GBS has not been associated with the nasal spray vaccine."

Adult influenza vaccine injury claims are now the leading claim submitted to the federal Vaccine Injury Compensation Program (VICP), with GBS as the leading alleged injury.

Bold type print is my added emphasis. When it comes to vaccine injury, IMO it's all about the hype and the money.

OK, my post may have given the impression that GBS is a more serious risk than shown by the stats. If so I apologize. But some people do get adverse reactions every year, whether GBS or something else, and even if a small number, and even if most of them recover.

But that wasn't may main point. The point I was trying to make is that the flu vaccine does not necessarily provide immunity to the disease. By the CDC's own evaluation, in a good year it might provide 50% protection at best. In some years it provides no protection. It's just not that reliable.

There seems to be a general belief that all vaccines are equally effective. I was reacting to those who were saying "If you don't get the flu vaccine you're putting everyone else at risk." Well, you could get the flu vaccine and still get ill and pass it on to someone else and kill them, if that's the way you want to frame the issue.

Anyway, I don't want to die on this hill. Just pointing out that the flu vaccine is not a silver bullet.

 

[bbbass]

OK, my post may have given the impression that GBS is a more serious risk than shown by the stats. If so I apologize. But some people do get adverse reactions every year, whether GBS or something else, and even if a small number, and even if most of them recover.

But that wasn't may main point. The point I was trying to make is that the flu vaccine does not necessarily provide immunity to the disease. By the CDC's own evaluation, in a good year it might provide 50% protection at best. In some years it provides no protection. It's just not that reliable.

There seems to be a general belief that all vaccines are equally effective. I was reacting to those who were saying "If you don't get the flu vaccine you're putting everyone else at risk." Well, you could get the flu vaccine and still get ill and pass it on to someone else and kill them, if that's the way you want to frame the issue.

Anyway, I don't want to die on this hill. Just pointing out that the flu vaccine is not a silver bullet.

Got it! Thx!!!

 

[G8rHunter]

I wonder if all those who disbelieve is vaccinations will pass on the vaccine that prevents 90% of all cancer types?