Man killed by Long Beach police was holding a water nozzle

[coop44]

No one is going to admit wanting to shoot some one.

psychopaths and sociopaths do not feel stress, rarely have families. The ones that do get involved in questionable shootings usually make a lateral transfer to somewhere quiet, the public's memory is short.

Also now they have the option of opting out of police work entirely, claiming a mental disability. "I had no idea the job was so dangerous, I can't take it", come on.

The average SoCal cop is on the job for 8 years before moving on to another career, or retiring on a B.S. disability (CHP is rife with this problem). Usually after soaking the taxpayer for as much dough as possible.

 

[Trlsmn]

Just to play devils advocate, if you got out of your car in DT Portland and saw a guy with what you thought was a gun and it was a water nozzle and you shot him, how well do you think the legal process would go for you?

 

[coop44]

Just to play devils advocate, if you got out of your car in DT Portland and saw a guy with what you thought was a gun and it was a water nozzle and you shot him, how well do you think the legal process would go for you?

bingo

 

[Redcap]

Just to play devils advocate, if you got out of your car in DT Portland and saw a guy with what you thought was a gun and it was a water nozzle and you shot him, how well do you think the legal process would go for you?

Exactly. Why should these two tools get a pass?

 

[marty8587]

First I would exersize my right to retreat. The officers don't have that. They will be investigated and if guilty I hope they get what they deserve. I am not willing to try them here and pass judgement.

 

[Martini_Up]

First I would exersize my right to retreat. The officers don't have that.

Sure they do! What kind of BS are you pushing?

 

[MA Duce]

Just to play devils advocate, if you got out of your car in DT Portland and saw a guy with what you thought was a gun and it was a water nozzle and you shot him, how well do you think the legal process would go for you?

Exactly....without having been there and heard and seen what the officers heard and saw from their point of view it is REALLY hard to make an accurate call. But as I see it, the bottom line is anyone with half a brain doesn't point ANYTHING at officers. The standard for a self defense shoot is Opportunity, Ability, and Intent to cause bodily harm. He obviously had opportunity, being close to the officers, there was the appearance of intent by pointing an object; the only thing to be determined is if the officers could have known he did not have the ability. That is an impossible call for anyone not present to make.

 

[Martini_Up]

"The officers had a position of cover...." but chose to expose themselves to getting wet so they could smoke happy drunk holding the water hose

 

[g.i. joe]

i don't buy this. being involved in an OIS is a very stressful, unpleasant experience. your name gets drug through the mud, you're investigated and questioned, your family is harassed, your home is compromised, the citizens are calling for your job if your lucky, sometimes your head.. and if the shoot was at all questionable, you can kiss goodbye any chance at advancement in the department.

i don't think that's the problem at all. but i do think a police-officer sub-culture that views themselves are separate and on defense against the citizens, and very poor communication and weapon training, are largely to blame.

cops should NOT fear defending their own lives- but they should be taught how to not shoot people who aren't threats.

I think the double standard in question is, when a citizen shoots a bad guy in self defense, taxpayer dollars are used against him to prosecute even if justified. The goal being to send a message, that only the City, County, State, Fed corners the market on use of force. The private citizen typically does not have funds to legally defend himself, where as the municipality has lawyers on staff. When a Cop, sometimes wrongfully shoots or kills a citizen, he is fired at worst or at best given time off. The whole time, he is given free legal defense.

 

[mjbskwim]

OK you live in LA county.Long beach CA

Are you just stupid?

Why the @#$% would you point ANYTHING at ANYBODY that may even RESEMBLE a gun?

Too bad but if you live in LaLa land you need to be smarter than that.

 

[RRooster]

Very sad for the Zerby family. I knew them when I was younger and living in that area. I saw Doug out surfing frequently and hung out with his sister. They were nice people.

On the surface, this hardly seems like a justified shooting. I'm sure that many of the critical facts are missing from the story, but I was under the impression that the police are supposed to "protect and serve" the public. No verbal contact coupled with two shots from a shotgun and six from a handgun for a dude holding a hose nozzle is way over the top. It appears, from what is public information, that the only "protecting and serving" are the interests of the LBPD. Because of this, a wife is now a widow and a son has no father. Shameful.

 

[marty8587]

Sure they do! What kind of BS are you pushing?

Just simply they have to respond and we do not.

 

[Martini_Up]

Just simply they have to respond and we do not.

Oh. By what you wrote before seemed to imply that sitting and continuing to observe the guy from behind cover wasn't an option.

I can bet you if the guy had a MG42 mounted behind a wall of sandbags pointed at the cops, they wouldn't have jumped out from behind cover to shoot at him. :winkkiss:

 

[marty8587]

Dude I just don't believe in internet lynch mobs.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

Dude I just don't believe in internet lynch mobs.

I dont believe in giraffes.

YouTube - i dont believe in giraffes

 

[PlayboyPenguin]

Dude I just don't believe in internet lynch mobs.

You don't agree with them or don't believe in them?

Because I can attest that they are real.

 

[marty8587]

I dont believe in giraffes.

YouTube - i dont believe in giraffes

I cry UNCLE!!

 

[Migo]

"Police said they did not have time to make their presence known or to tell Zerby to drop the weapon before opening fire because they believed he was a threat."

If they didn't make their presence known, were they even visibly recognizable to the drunk victim? Maybe the drunk victim was just waving the nozzle around randomly and just happened to point it in the direction of the officers?

Regardless, next year California will probably pass a law requiring hose nozzles to have orange painted tips. Also, only hose nozzles appearing in the new "Roster of Hose Nozzles Certified for Sale" will be allowed for sale in local hardware stores, but only those stores that are over 2000 feet away from schools. You will have to wait 10 days before you can take possession of your hose nozzle. High capacity hose nozzles will be made illegal, and you will need to provide a thumbprint for hose nozzles that can fire a stream of water, instead of the much safer flower sprays. You will probably also see a future law requiring that individuals be licensed to possess a hose nozzle, which could be a problem with some law abiding car washers and gardeners in urban counties because those counties might not issue those licenses as freely as the more rural counties.

 

[BSK1]

It's unfortunate, but if you are holding something that resembles a handgun, and you are holding it like a gun, and pointing it like a gun, and you point it at any legally armed person, especially a trained law enforcement officer, you just might get yourself shot.

A few years ago, I and four other officers conducted a felony car stop on what tunred out to be a journalist holding a small tape recorder with a microphone taped to it. He was interviewing the driver of the vehicle, recording it, while holding it pointed at his head. It was reported as someone holding a gun to a drivers head. If while conducting this stop, that person would have pointed the tape recorder at us, he may have been shot. He followed instructions, and after we determined it was not a gun, they were released to drive away. This was a sunny afternoon, and I could not tell it wasn't a handgun. If the person with the spray nozzle had not been pretending to point a gun at others, he would likely be alive today.

 

[coop44]

First I would exersize my right to retreat. The officers don't have that. They will be investigated and if guilty I hope they get what they deserve. I am not willing to try them here and pass judgement.

Why not? They judged and executed that water nozzle wielding danger to society.