Man holding suspected shoplifters at gunpoint is fatally shot by off-duty cop;

[RicInOR]

Your toter's permit is not a Batman badge.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1407020248268742663

Man holding suspected shoplifters at gunpoint is fatally shot by off-duty cop; investigation underway - Breaking911

WARNING: The attached video may contain strong language as well as graphic images which may be disturbing to some people. Viewer discretion is advised. ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information...

breaking911.com

ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information related to an officer-involved shooting (OIS) which occurred on June 3rd, 2021, in the area of 15th Avenue and Camelback Road.

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[bbbass]

And that's why CHL holders usually don't want to get involved in other's circus.

Rule # whatever: Don't draw your weapon unless you are shooting.

Axiom # whatever: There are no brownie points for being a dead good guy/Samaritan.

 

[Alexx1401]

Very sad indeed but, maybe some others who carry will see this and THINK, when they are out. Guy chased the shoplifters to another area and then jumped out to hold them at gun point. Over shoplifting. Having the ability to carry does NOT turn people into a Cop. If the Police had arrested the theft people they would have been promptly turned loose. So what the hell is the point of trying to take them down at gun point?
Not to mention a LOT of the scum who steal are armed. If they had pulled a gun to fire at the "good guy" what happens when some person walking by gets hit by either the "good guy" or the scum? Again over a shoplift. People who chose to carry need to use their damn brain.

 

[bbbass]

Point: In Seattle are shoplifters even harrassed by cops? In SF they just passed and ordnance that any shoplifting up to $925 is legal, ie a "civil matter" rather than a criminal infraction. At the same time, Walmart managers and employees are told not to approach shoplifters... just let em go... the store absorbs the cost.... uh, no the paying customers do in higher prices.

 

[Alexx1401]

Point: In Seattle are shoplifters even harrassed by cops? In SF they just passed and ordnance that any shoplifting up to $925 is legal, ie a "civil matter" rather than a criminal infraction. At the same time, Walmart managers and employees are told not to approach shoplifters... just let em go... the store absorbs the cost.... uh, no the paying customers do in higher prices.

And this just burns my butt BIG time too. I have to pay for the scum who steal because voters "feel sorry" for the scum.
Every time I work long extra hours I think about the lazy worthless, will not work who have become entitled to my money

 

[American123]

Hence why I DGAF about shoplifting as our society currently sits, all I can do is lose by intervening.

 

[SrMachoSolo]

I am all about looking out and preventing crime in my 'hood, but I know that using a firearm in many circumstances like that, the odds are not in my favor (especially in this current legal climate).

On that note, I've followed a shop lifter, discretely. I was in the parking lot of a store, about to shop, and saw a short scuffle with what looked like a guy trying to steal a woman's backpack. Bystanders did nothing but stare as he walked away. I decided to follow him from a distance, and watched as he shed his sweatshirt, and then hid in a quickie mart down the block. I was on the phone with dispatch the whole time giving them status updates, up until then time police made contact (and an arrest). I never got near the guy or let him see me.

Officer shook my hand and said, "couldn't have done it without you." Turns out the woman who tried to stop the guy at entrance of the store was a loss prevention employee, and there's not much they can do (legally) once the thief is out of the building. I know they roll the cost of shoplifting into the price consumers pay, and was hoping to help mitigate that... plus, less one peice of trash roaming around is better for myself and family.

-Robert

 

[Certaindeaf]

Your toter's permit is not a Batman badge.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1407020248268742663

Man holding suspected shoplifters at gunpoint is fatally shot by off-duty cop; investigation underway - Breaking911

WARNING: The attached video may contain strong language as well as graphic images which may be disturbing to some people. Viewer discretion is advised. ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information...

breaking911.com

ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information related to an officer-involved shooting (OIS) which occurred on June 3rd, 2021, in the area of 15th Avenue and Camelback Road.

Your toter's permit is not a Batman badge.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1407020248268742663

Man holding suspected shoplifters at gunpoint is fatally shot by off-duty cop; investigation underway - Breaking911

WARNING: The attached video may contain strong language as well as graphic images which may be disturbing to some people. Viewer discretion is advised. ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information...

breaking911.com

ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information related to an officer-involved shooting (OIS) which occurred on June 3rd, 2021, in the area of 15th Avenue and Camelback Road.

Clicked and it was uviewable.
This might be a cleaner link..

 

[Soli]

Sad tale. Everyone above is spot on.

Philosophising here, with no thought to morals or ethics. (I think those are why most don't do bad things. Not the law.)

Making any crime a "civil matter" is worse than simply making it legal. The only folks who respect civil matters are those with something to lose. That plays into real crime as well of course - life is all risk/reward even for those to stupid to know it. Making theft a civil offense creates a two tier society; for those with resources the cost of doing it is too high to justify. Those without, well, why not? It's without cost.

Almost as if someone wants to make society more divided... Hmmmm...

 

[ilikegunspdx]

Your toter's permit is not a Batman badge.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1407020248268742663

Man holding suspected shoplifters at gunpoint is fatally shot by off-duty cop; investigation underway - Breaking911

WARNING: The attached video may contain strong language as well as graphic images which may be disturbing to some people. Viewer discretion is advised. ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information...

breaking911.com

ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information related to an officer-involved shooting (OIS) which occurred on June 3rd, 2021, in the area of 15th Avenue and Camelback Road.

Wow, talk about a bonehead maneuver. Gun carriers need to ID ahead of time what situations we will get involved in and which to run away from or observe and report. Too many people nowadays are ready to show or point a gun when it's not needed. I understand wanting to do something about the criminals, but pointing a gun for this situation is just not smart. It immediately escalates things to a life or death level. Why incur such a risk over shoplifting? Save it for a time when it is absolutely needed, like protecting loved ones, stopping a mass shooter, protecting a child, etc, or whatever is on your list for when you would step in and put your life on the line (or risk getting shot by some third party mistaking you for the bad guy).

 

[RVTECH]

This is an interesting thread with regard to a very similar one on another forum that I got ABSOLUTELY dammed to HeII for my (what I considered to be a pragmatic approach) to being a one who is carrying in a ACTIVE SHOOTER situation.

I attempted to explain if one is present during an active shooting situation he/she should try to secure themselves and family and find a clear route of escape, and not even CONSIDER any bravado such as engaging the shooter - UNLESS YOU ARE CORNERED and have no other choice.

The responses were this was an act of 'cowardice' and that one has an 'obligation' to give your life for another - regardless of the complexity of the situation.

I attempted to explain how engaging could result in say, you not knowing who the 'shooter' is - and it could be another 'good guy with a gun' - OR might be an LEO - or YOU could be seen as the shooter in this case.

I also cited a recent situation where a guy ran to his vehicle to obtain a rifle and on his return was killed by the active shooter.

Heck even in MY OWN home break in a couple years ago I secured my house and headed outside and TOOK COVER in the woods and waited till the Cavalry arrived !

 

[Alexx1401]

This is an interesting thread with regard to a very similar one on another forum that I got ABSOLUTELY dammed to HeII for my (what I considered to be a pragmatic approach) to being a one who is carrying in a ACTIVE SHOOTER situation.

I attempted to explain if one is present during an active shooting situation he/she should try to secure themselves and family and find a clear route of escape, and not even CONSIDER any bravado such as engaging the shooter - UNLESS YOU ARE CORNERED and have no other choice.

The responses were this was an act of 'cowardice' and that one has an 'obligation' to give your life for another - regardless of the complexity of the situation.

I attempted to explain how engaging could result in say, you not knowing who the 'shooter' is - and it could be another 'good guy with a gun' - OR might be an LEO - or YOU could be seen as the shooter in this case.

I also cited a recent situation where a guy ran to his vehicle to obtain a rifle and on his return was killed by the active shooter.

Heck even in MY OWN home break in a couple years ago I secured my house and headed outside and TOOK COVER in the woods and waited till the Cavalry arrived !

I have had the exact same argument many times. Once was over bank heist. Many keyboard cowboy were saying they would draw and take out the robber. I said this was begging for a bad outcome. Get a gunfight going who gets hit? Good guys come in see you who gets shot? I said unless they start trying to herd me to the back? Let them have the money and get out.

 

[titsonritz]

The dude either had brass balls or no brain cells, not just for playing Batman but doing so with a Lorcin pistol.

 

[ilikegunspdx]

The dude either had brass balls or no brain cells, not just for playing Batman but doing so with a Lorcin pistol.

Lorcin! Holy crap! He probably died of self inflicted gunshot via UD. I think Lorcin went bankrupt due to the number of deaths and injures from those total pieces of garbage.

 

[RVTECH]

Many keyboard cowboy were saying they would draw and take out the robber. I said this was begging for a bad outcome.

Yea the forum I mentioned seems to have a few religious 'zealots' on it and they seem to have a strangely 'uncaring' attitude about their own safety, or do not consider the potential outcome of becoming 'involved' . Kind of weird actually.

 

[Melman]

Off duty cop should be treated like any private citizen. They aren't exempt

 

[po18guy]

Your toter's permit is not a Batman badge.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1407020248268742663

Man holding suspected shoplifters at gunpoint is fatally shot by off-duty cop; investigation underway - Breaking911

WARNING: The attached video may contain strong language as well as graphic images which may be disturbing to some people. Viewer discretion is advised. ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information...

breaking911.com

ARIZONA – (PPD) – The Phoenix Police Department released a Critical Incident Briefing (CIB) video that includes audio, visuals and information related to an officer-involved shooting (OIS) which occurred on June 3rd, 2021, in the area of 15th Avenue and Camelback Road.

The only thing missing is that an on-duty cop didn't shoot the off-duty.

 

[BDA.45]

And that's why CHL holders usually don't want to get involved in other's circus.

Rule # whatever: Don't draw your weapon unless you are shooting.

Axiom # whatever: There are no brownie points for being a dead good guy/Samaritan.

THIS!!!

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

Not my circus, not my monkeys.

I was erring on the citizens side until I saw that he was carrying a Lorcen.

 

[Cosmoline]

This is gonna stir up Antifa, I'm sure. Especially because he assumed he was a robbery suspect...

I can't imagine why he'd intervene, honestly. What if they were armed? When I worked retail as a kid my boss said "let them take it. Would you be willing to die over some guy running a cart full of whatever out the door?" He also illustrated that they could be armed, and on many occasions, were. We had an LP guy tackle a thief in the parking lot, guy pulled a knife and both guys got cut up pretty bad. Turns out the thief had aids and passed that right onto our LP, as well as cutting him up.