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M16 Auto Bolt Carrier Group in a semi auto AR-15 rifle

Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by ikari2_2000, Feb 19, 2010.

  1. ikari2_2000

    ikari2_2000 Seattle, WA Member

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    What are the pros and cons?
    Will it be legal or illegal?
    Will I need upgrades to compensate the heavier bolt?
     
  2. MountainBear

    MountainBear Sweet Home, OR Well-Known Member

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    The benefits are more mass to the carrier and a fuller round profile to travel through the round receiver. Not many cons I can think of if you already have one. Otherwise, cost of buying another BCG might be an con.

    Its legal. The part of the AR system that makes it a full auto would be the auto sear. Short of that, the bolt is completely legal. This was recently (within the last few years) clarified by the ATF.

    You shouldn't need to do anything further to compensate for the heavier bolt...
     
  3. gtslow

    gtslow Issaquah New Member

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    I think the legality is somewhat questionable in WA state as there are a lot of out of state dealers that will not sell this part to WA residents. I still think that Colt rifles come with them but I can't be sure.
     
  4. the4thshake

    the4thshake Portland Active Member

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    Is this thread refering to an M16 bolt carrier in an AR15?

    A heavier carrier will slow the cycling of the action slightly just like a heavier buffer will. I use heavier buffers in all my ARs with carbine length gas systems. Other then the extra weight, an M16 carrier has no other function in a semi auto rifle.
     
  5. ikari2_2000

    ikari2_2000 Seattle, WA Member

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    Yes, I've found on http://www.centerfiresystems.com/about-us.aspx, they state "Washington State - No M-16 Bolts". That is the only website that I could find that says that.

    and yes, I was referring to the M16 Auto BCG in a semi auto AR-15. whoops. :D
     
  6. .45's and .38's

    .45's and .38's Happy Valley OR Well-Known Member

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    whoops I thought WA could own M16 bolts....I just deleted a link I posted for a M16 bolt
     
  7. Humpyslayer

    Humpyslayer Kent Member

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    You can own them in this state as far as I know but it's illegal to have them in your gun according to the LE people I've talked to because it's considered a "machine gun part" and that's a no no in your gun in this state, even though you don't have a full auto sear.
     
  8. MountainBear

    MountainBear Sweet Home, OR Well-Known Member

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    Must suck to live in Washington...
     
  9. Bruce

    Bruce Jefferson County, Wa Member

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    The bolt is not the problem, it is the bolt carrier. The full auto bolt carrier contacts the sear trip which keeps the full auto gun from firing out of battery wich makes it a no no part. Every semi-auto bolt carrier I have seen is designed not to contact the sear trip. I dont think it is just a Washington thing I think it is a Fed thing.

    Bruce.
     
  10. MountainBear

    MountainBear Sweet Home, OR Well-Known Member

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    No, its a Washington thing apparently. I believe its legal in Oregon...
     
  11. Bruce

    Bruce Jefferson County, Wa Member

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    I would check into it before I used one. When a parts company sells bolt groups they always specify M-16 or Ar-15 and the only difference is the bolt carrier. I dont think it is a Washington state issue.

    Bruce.
     
  12. MountainBear

    MountainBear Sweet Home, OR Well-Known Member

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    I just checked. Its legal in Oregon. I checked with a local AR manufacturer...
     
  13. JAFO

    JAFO OR, USA Silver Supporter Silver Supporter

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    If you want the extra weight of an M16 carrier but want a carrier that won't trip an auto sear (to be safe from violating RCW 9.41.220) then get an Olympic Arms carrier. They are full circle but the length of the sear engagement area is too short to function in a machine gun.
     
  14. spengo

    spengo GLORIOUS CASCADIA Active Member

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    Sorry to necropost, but I can't seem to find much info on this apart from this thread and one on TFL forum. I am considering moving up to WA to be closer to work and stumbled across this. Does this mean that whenever I bring my AR-15 with a full auto carrier into WA I am committing a crime? D: The only law I can find is:
    RCW 9.41.220: Unlawful firearms and parts contraband.
    M16 bolt carrier is not SOLELY AND EXCLUSIVELY intended for use in a machine gun as far as I know. Smells like bs to me.

    I also found:
     
  15. Celtic Armory

    Celtic Armory Port Orchard, WA Member

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    If you install in a drop in auto sear, they are usually designed to work with the M16 bolt carrier. The bottom cut on an M16 bolt carrier is different than an AR15 bolt carrier. Some AR15 carriers are even cut all the way to the back. The back part of the carrier is where it engages the auto sear. Even though it is not in and of itself enough to make a rifle full auto, neither is the hammer or the safety, but having them in your AR15 COULD pose some legal issues, particularly in WA. In order to turn an AR15 into an M16 you have to have ALL of the combined parts, an auto-sear is not enough on it's own. You have to also have the right safety, trigger, disconnector, hammer and bolt carrier. In WA you can't have ANY part used to make a firearm full auto, even if that part on it's own could not make it full auto.
     
  16. huntpotter

    huntpotter SW WA Negotiator Bronze Supporter

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    Fact: Colt comes with a M16 bolt carrier from the factory. They sell them in WA to anybody. I think Colt would not do that, if it was illegal.

    I'ld trust wichaka's post, that it is legal to own a full auto bolt carrier, in WA. He is involved with enforcing the laws of Washington state, so I'ld take his word for it. As long as you don't have any of the other full auto parts, then it won't be able to shoot full auto.

    Lots of BS floating around the net. But bottom line is a M16 bolt carrier will not make your gun shoot full auto. It only ads weight (a tiny bit) to the reciprocating bolt assembly, so some people say it helps increase lock time, which may increase accuracy. Ever seen a Young Mfg Match bolt carrier? It looks like a chrome plated M16 carrier. They advertise it as "more mass" for increased lock time and reliability.
     
  17. coctailer

    coctailer Portland, OR/Hastings, MI/Vancouver,WA I run with scissors.

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    Absolutely nothing illegal about a full-auto bolt carrier.
     
  18. sgtrocko1

    sgtrocko1 forest grove New Member

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    I may be wrong but the wa law states that any part of a machine gun is a machine gun. So if they wanted to they could get you for a m-16 sling swivel if you had it. Does not need to be on the rifle( if they wanted to of course)
     
  19. coctailer

    coctailer Portland, OR/Hastings, MI/Vancouver,WA I run with scissors.

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    :thumbup:
     
  20. sgtrocko1

    sgtrocko1 forest grove New Member

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    if you think i'm wrong check the law, or see what they did to BIG AL(about 20 years ago)