Looking at getting a new scope

[coyoteman5]

Looking into getting a new Leupold 6.5x20x50 scope since my other one was stolen. I see that the new rage is first focal plane over the normal second focal plane. Then there cds vs bdc turrets then mil dot vs moa. I have never used a ffp scope before so I'm not sure how I would like it. I will be putting it on my P.O Ackley .308 win. Will be target shooting with it the most and maybe once a year hunt elk with. If I had to I could always take it off and put on my 4.5x14 vx3 and hunt with that. So could I get your take on this?what should I go with, first focal plane or second focal plane I'm leaning towards Moa over mil dot and not sure if I should go with cds or bdc turrets.
So............?

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[slm9s]

I wouldn't want to hunt elk with 6.5 as the lowest power I could use, dark timber close-up shots would be tough.
I don't like ffp for hunting, lots do, personal preference. When I'm taking a long shot, I want thin crosshairs at max power. When I'm in the dark timber, I want thick crosshairs at a low power. FFP does just the opposite.
Leupold 6.5-20 was a great scope years ago, many other options with a high mag range with a ton of options these days, my personal opinion. My elk rifles wear Leupold VX6 2-12 with long range duplex.
I'm not sure what you exactly mean by target shooting, but to me that means high mag. If I were you, maybe something like a bushnell 4.5-30 would be worth a try, SFP of course.
Good luck.

 

[No_Regerts]

If you have a reticle with some sort of BDC or ranging capability through subtending dots, FFP is the way to go because the value of the BDC and subtentions remain constant.

SFP, to my eye, allows for more precise shooting because the target "grows" and the reticle remains constant. I wouldn't want the reticle to cover up the 8 inch tall gopher. Since I prefer to twist turrets over using BDCs, SFP doesn't bother me that much.

I could probably see how mils are easier than MOA, but my brain is in MOA and mils seem peculiarly metric, which I consider evil and communist. As long as the reticle and adjustmens are the same, should be good to go. Believe it or not, Ive seen several scopes with mil reticles and MOA turrets.

 

[Otter]

You have to try the first focal plane scope to see if you like them. My first experience was at the store and I didn't like it at all. I tried another one at the range a guy had and it confirmed what I thought at the store. Some people love them, so you need to look through one and make up your own mind on the FFP vs SFP. Ideally at the range and not just at the store if you can.

Your 4.5-14x is an excellent long distance elk scope which is what I would use if I was you for game animals. I do a lot of target shooting and have some extreme target scopes and my favorite scope and power is a Sightron SIII 8-32x. Best value I found and if you buy used even a better value. Lots of other good options though and nothing wrong with the Leupold. Burris makes some nice scopes that would fit the bill too.

If you have deep pockets and like the FFP, Nightforce is making a NX8 scope that might interest you. 2.5-20x and 4-32x models. Will set you back a couple grand though.

 

[bsa1917hunter]

First off, how far will you be shooting? Do you really need all that magnification? Personally I wouldn't buy a Leupold. I'd opt for a Nightforce SHV or even a SWFA SS HD 3-9x42, 3-15x42 and it's going to be a very versatile package and offer much better tracking than the Leupold and RTZ and holding zero will be much better... If you are wanting to buy a good scope, now's the time to do it. Get in on some of those fathers day specials. SWFA is offering some of their best scopes at tremendous discounts....

 

[bsa1917hunter]

If you have a reticle with some sort of BDC or ranging capability through subtending dots, FFP is the way to go because the value of the BDC and subtentions remain constant.

SFP, to my eye, allows for more precise shooting because the target "grows" and the reticle remains constant. I wouldn't want the reticle to cover up the 8 inch tall gopher. Since I prefer to twist turrets over using BDCs, SFP doesn't bother me that much.

I could probably see how mils are easier than MOA, but my brain is in MOA and mils seem peculiarly metric, which I consider evil and communist. As long as the reticle and adjustmens are the same, should be good to go. Believe it or not, Ive seen several scopes with mil reticles and MOA turrets.

I agree with you about SFP for hunting. One of the reasons I just bought the SHV for my new rifle... Should be a great combo...

 

[Whisky Tahoe]

The trick to Mil or MOA is to stick with one. "No Regerts" is correct that some scopes combine the two and that requires you to do more math. When looking for a scope, confirm the turrets and reticle use the same system. Like "No Regerts", I prefer Minute of Angle (MOA) and fortunately ballistic calculations support both Mil & MOA equally well. Some scope have a 3rd system called Inches per Yard (IPY). Mil and MOA are Arc measurements and while close aren't exact with inches. 1MOA at 100 yards is 1.047 inches so the farther out you go the more the "remainder" matters. Confirm with your scope manufacturer what system the turrets use.

As for custom turrets (CDS) or any turret that isn't pure Mil or MOA, these attempt to make ranging your impact easier but too often they make assumptions based on the round and tend to be fixed. If you stick with MOA where one full turn of the turret is say 6 MOAs, you can use a ranging table for any bullet and velocity and have the elevation required to hit zero at that range. It's quite easy once you start doing it.

Say you are considering a scope with a bullet drop compensating (BDC) reticle. That reticle only works for specific bullet combinations probably setup for Deer sized game not Elk. I recommend skipping the BDC reticles and custom turrets and learn your round's ballistics at the range.

Using one of the several of the online ballistic calculators like Federal's or Hornady's, you select a round from the menu or input your ballistic coefficient, velocity, weather, altitude etc and you get a very specific amount of "come up" settings. I can be zeroed at 100 yards then go to the 600 yard range and come up 10.2 MOAs and I'm hitting paper at 600 yards. If I want to use a heavier bullet suitable for Elk, your ballistics calculation will provide a different set of "come ups" and your back in business. I find using MOAs and ballistics calculators extremely flexible even if you use factory ammo.

 

[Beta1759]

For hunting purposes go with SFP with a simple reticle (or a firedot type like a VX-6HD or VX-R) and the CDS dials. The clicks will be 1/4 moa regardless. Once you have your ballistics Leupold will custom make you a dial but the clicks will still be 1/4, just the markings will be different on the dial. You aren't going to do much better than a Leupold for hunting. Generally the lightest optic in its class, best performance in low light and glare (which is when animals are most active). And the Leupold has the reputation for being build to take anything you can throw at it. And they are local!

 

[User 1234]

Do you qualify for Vortex's or Leupold's military discount programs? That would boost your options.

 

[coyoteman5]

Do you qualify for Vortex's or Leupold's military discount programs? That would boost your options.

No I don't. At this time I'm going to go with a Leupold 6.5x20x50 moa fine reticle spf. But some changes could happen before buying it

 

[Whisky Tahoe]

No I don't. At this time I'm going to go with a Leupold 6.5x20x50 moa fine reticle spf. But some changes could happen before buying it

That is a fine scope sir!

 

[bsa1917hunter]

For hunting purposes go with SFP with a simple reticle (or a firedot type like a VX-6HD or VX-R) and the CDS dials. The clicks will be 1/4 moa regardless. Once you have your ballistics Leupold will custom make you a dial but the clicks will still be 1/4, just the markings will be different on the dial. You aren't going to do much better than a Leupold for hunting. Generally the lightest optic in its class, best performance in low light and glare (which is when animals are most active). And the Leupold has the reputation for being build to take anything you can throw at it. And they are local!

I urge you to go and check out the threads on 24hourcampfire about Leupold. I see you are from Beaverton and may very well work for Leupold, but to say they "are the best", is a gross overstatement. Their failure rate is beyond comprehension.

 

[Beta1759]

I urge you to go and check out the threads on 24hourcampfire about Leupold. I see you are from Beaverton and may very well work for Leupold, but to say they "are the best", is a gross overstatement. Their failure rate is beyond comprehension.

I never said they are the best. I said they perform best in low light and glare.

If you could provide some links for the threads I would be happy to view them, but I have never had any issues with my Leupold. Vortex on the other hand....never again. That's all I'm gonna say about that.

 

[Aero Denezol]

I've had both SFP and FFP. With FFP you can use the reticle to range things at any magnification. With SFP, the reticle subtensions are only accurate at max magnification. If your turrets are capped, I can't imagine you'll be fussing with adjustments too much.. My limited experience with scopes is, clarity of glass, field of view, and reticle thickness are the most important thing.

 

[coyoteman5]

Are used to have a 6.5x 20 x 40 Leupold scope but someone broke into my trailer and stolen along with some other things. One time Elk hunting as I was crossing the creek I slipped and fell backwards on top of my gun and my scope put a small little ding in the bell so as I compose myself I found a place to check zero it was dead on that scope never let me down and the person whoever stole it im sure it won't let them down either.