Long distance shooters and Glass

[Reacher]

Life is short
Buy the best glass you can and shoot the rifling out of your barrel Enjoy every pull of the trigger, be it 10 yards or 2000

 

[Dwesson]

I am not trying to tell anyone how to spend their money...just suggesting other options for good clean clear glass for less money than the options most people give...Hell..even my wifes $100 Bushnell dusk to dawn scope is pretty dang nice...also...some of my comments are not to SK's thread but to other comments made...I understand that he just wanted opinions for better glass as he was having a problem seeing clearly through his Vortex...I gave other options for less money...all of which have lifetime warranties and good glass...but again..choices on a scope really come down to what you are doing so there is no final answer...if you want one that is hard to kill for SHTF or combat use...well...Primary Arms works for less money at the low end and you can go up to $4000 or even more with S&B, IOR, Nightforce ect...but for 300+ yrds for general shooting or hunting any modern scope will do...most all have great glass and even the Chinese stuff including Vortex are catching up or better in quality than the Japanese (Leupold) stuff...and as for LONG RANGE...except for the really serious guys...this is subjective...you say 800 yards...I say that is medium range...others might think that extreme long range....and I have friends that would think that is just play....so the real point from my perspective is...spend as little as you need to accomplish what you want unless you are competing or need a battle scope...then spend as much as you can afford...

Look, I'm not trying to get into a semantic argument with you here because in some ways I agree with your sentiment, I just disagree this is the place for those points to be made.

I am not trying to tell anyone how to spend their money.. .

Yet you literally wrote...

I care because I see it as waste of money for something they really do not need../QUOTE]

These statements are in direct contradiction.

 

[Redeemedson1]

Life is short
Buy the best glass you can and shoot the rifling out of your barrel Enjoy every pull of the trigger, be it 10 yards or 2000

I would normally agree...with one glaring exception....we need to support pro-gun groups more than ever when we have to go against billionaire anti-gun groups...Washington just got kicked in the nuts and they are already planning to make it even worse...Everyone complains when these things happen...but they spend thousands on a rifle and scope and send $40 to the SAA or GOA etc...so there is my biggest point...If I had a million dollars sitting around...GOA and Second Amendment Alliance would get ALL of it...court is not cheap...so buy the scopes, rifles etc that you want...enjoy them..but when they are taken...don't complain if it was more important to buy that $1000 Leupold instead of a $200 scope and send the extra to a pro-gun group fighting to keep your right to that firearm and that scope....what is your FREEDOM worth??? Just saying...you don't have to agree...that is ok...just my thought pattern.

 

[Redeemedson1]

Look, I'm not trying to get into a semantic argument with you here because in some ways I agree with your sentiment, I just disagree this is the place for those points to be made.



Yet you literally wrote...




These statements are in direct contradiction.

Just suggesting a different point of view as most people have for years been giving in to marketing instead of research and reason...

 

[Dwesson]

Anyone have any experience with Steiner rifle scopes? A cop buddy of mine had a set of Steiner Police 10X binos that were unbelievably clear, great at low light and self focusing. I bellied up and dropped the coin for my own set and even got the 10X compact a year later. So now I'm thinking of scoping a 6.5 Creedmoor. I have always liked Leupolds, but that Steiner glass.....

In an effort to get this thread back on track....

Steiner makes good stuff. They aren't well known here in the US as they usually market to LEO and other Gov Agencies, especially their lasers.

I haven't been behind any of their stuff recently (last 3 years or so). It's well built, maybe overbuilt (I recall their whole line being heavy). Back then I recall people had issues getting stuff warrantied or if needed, for repairs. They may be more responsive now.

 

[Redeemedson1]

If you are going to spend good money on a scope...a new company from here in Idaho from guys I believe used to work for Leupold is Zero Compromise Optic...these guys seems to know what they are doing to build tier 1 scopes...

 

[DizzyJ]

Sig optics I believe is made up of ex Leupold engineers?

 

[Redeemedson1]

Sig optics I believe is made up of ex Leupold engineers?

Love those new Sig Tango 6 scopes....for a good Tier 2 scope that is....probably my favorite expensive scope...

 

[Mark Torrence]

Boy you sure got a load on this subject. As to glass. I LOVE Leupold scopes. However I needed a scope with a zero stop and until the last year or two they didn't make one so after some research I bought a NF NXS 5.5 to 22x56mm scope cause I see no reason to pay nearly twice the cost ($2200 vs $4000) for a Swarovski scope that when I looked through them side by side I could not physically see the difference. The NF scope is everything I had hoped and more. Gathers a TON of light in the evening and is as clear as I can see. Solid, repeatable and as durable as you can get. That said currently Leupold makes a comparable scope at a comparable price. If they did that when I bought the NF scope I definitely would have gone for the Leupold. My 2 cents.

 

[Goosebrown]

Fair enough. For that type of shooting.

For distances at "300+ yards" I think maximum magnification is just going to hinder light transmission and magnify shaking. I didn't see where the OP was asking about precision shooting with a custom action rifle at extreme distance.

He was more general and I shared knowledge of a portion of what long range might be. Randy and you really fall a lot more into the practical/tactical side of it and those observations are important for a better view of all the long range options out there.

I value and respect your input.

FWIW my rifle is a stock Savage with a cheapish replacement barrel.

 

[Flopsweat]

...
Also note that half the shooters use Berger bullets.
...

Is it true that Berger is developing an economy line called Cheese Berger?

 

[IceAxRiflRvlvr]

SWFA 10x, 12x, 16x

 

[Otter]

Rarely is Sightron mentioned on this website for some reason but it has a strong following on the Accurate Shooter website. The SIII models are some of the best scopes for the money. My long range scopes include a 15-55x NF Competition, 15-60x Vortex Golden Eagle, Sightron SIII 10-50x and two Sightron SIII 8-32x. At double the price, the NF is only slightly better than the 10-50x Sightron. One of the Sightron 8-32x scopes has glass that matches the NF. I have not been overwhelmed by the Golden Eagle and am considering selling it, which sells for about 50% more than the Sightrons. I do like the reticle of the GE though.

Yes, the NF 15-55x is comparable to a spotting scope. I never would have thought I needed that much power, but now I would never go back. I use it at max power at 100-300 yards target shooting, and it currently sits on a 20 VarTarg sage rat rifle. Granted I don't use it often at max power while sage rat hunting, but it sure is nice to have when I want to zoom in. Fun to watch buddies exploding a rat with it on max power!

 

[Jarhead 0311]

I've used several different brands in the Military and as a PFC, and I'll stick with mid priced Leupold for scopes any time. There are more expensive and some have better glass, but Leupold is a good all around. I've go 3 of them in different powers for different calibers. My go to RDS is aimpoint for out to 200 yds and CQB and Acog for 2-500 yds. Just keeps thing simple and consistant. Keep an eye on ebay for some killer deals. Remember your trigger is just as important as the glass.
S-F

 

[bsa1917hunter]

Life is short
Buy the best glass you can and shoot the rifling out of your barrel Enjoy every pull of the trigger, be it 10 yards or 2000

Amen

 

[11Charlie]

One thing I didn't mention, but have you adjusted the eyepiece into focus for YOUR eyes?

Yes of course. I am starting to think it was just one of those days at the range for me. I normally don't have that kind of trouble with my Vortex.

 

[Kruel J]

Just to get this back on track, I do agree that Leupold is clearer and better glass than Vortex.

Steiner, SWFA, Nightforce, etc aren't really fair comparisons. Well, maybe kind of. But only apples to apples with a VERY few certain models.

 

[Kruel J]

Yes of course. I am starting to think it was just one of those days at the range for me. I normally don't have that kind of trouble with my Vortex.

Oddly enough, I have experienced EXACTLY what you described with my Viper PST. Like, some days its good, and some days....not so much. Weird.

And no, it wasn't ambient mirage or a hot barrel for you keyboard cowboys.

 

[bsa1917hunter]

Yes of course. I am starting to think it was just one of those days at the range for me. I normally don't have that kind of trouble with my Vortex.

I have 2 friends that have totally given up on vortex optics. Both of them tried the viper PST and both had different issues. One was not clear and didnt track well, the other just recently had to send his back because it wouldnt stay zeroed and when you looked through it, you could see the inside walls of the scope tube. I looked through it and it was really distracting. He ended up buying a leupold vx6 hd 4-24x52 illuminated CDS. The glass on that one is freeking brilliant. Generally i dont like leupold, but after looking through that scope, i thought about buying one myself. However, at that price i'd rather buy a Nightforce. I once heard someone say they would give up a little glass quality and clarity for a more mechanical precise rifle scope. I have to admit, im in that boat as well. One of the reasons i use a SWFA SS rifle scope on my dedicated "longrange" rifle.

 

[oli700]

lots of good stuff in this thread. I own some high end glass and it makes a difference if you have the fundamentals , on the other hand I shoot a 556 SPR 600 yards with a PA 1-6x ACSS on a regular basis and it hits plenty effective, no fundamentals needed other than trigger control