Let's talk about gun shows

[Boomer50]

I can only speak to shows in Oregon, but the Portland shows are really in a rut of greed. I used to love to go to gun shows back in the 1980's---before the new Expo center in Portland was built and the entry and parking fees soared. The daily cost to attend was reasonable and a family could have a good day. Any fan could afford to have a table and sell stuff reasonably; now the table fees are grotesque, and they even make vendors pay to park! No amateurs need apply---they won't break even! Contrast this to an old-style show like the Albany gunshows and there is no comparison. The Expo shows have priced themselves into no-fun-zone.

I also must state my HATRED for the traffic control at the Expo center! Northbound I-5 traffic can be backed up a half-mile back of the Expo exit, because there is no light or traffic direction at the end of the off-ramp. Cars cannot find a clear spot to ever get OFF the ramp---meanwhile, three or four Portland Police lard-butt cruisers are parked at the bottom of the Expo parking lot, chewing each other's fat and soaking up the overtime, in case terrorism breaks out at the show. One time after FINALLY reaching the show I phoned the Police non-emergency line to ask why the heck those LAZY cops didn't deal with the traffic snarl--- and the dispatcher virtually threatened me with arrest for complaining!

So, I feel Expo shows are a dead end, at least for old-timers who know any better. I'd like to see a low-budget, swap-meet kind of location, with plenty of free parking, like the closed dog-track out at Fairview, or some abandoned supermarket (is there a closed K-mart still available?). Keep table fees low, and maybe charge the big pro vendors much more to keep them out. Maybe have some food carts and some brew-pub samplers with some tables in an outside area. Require that the vendors at least pretend not to be hateful snobs? Maybe a key is to make it a one-long-day at a time event only, maybe eight to eight, so the travelling pros are not attracted, and the vendors that do come are not burned-out covering a whole weekend. People who hate the public should be deterred; let them be greedy somewhere else.

Start out small; see if it can be fun. Build it and they will come.

 

[Dallas Ken]

Things have changed...Expo Show's really suck in my opinion, Too much non related crap and way too much money.
Albany, Rickreall and Canby aren't too bad.(in my opinion)
I believe the cost of Liability Insurance, Security, Rent and such along with Greed have a lot to do with it.

But the weather is sure a pleasure.
Good Day Gent's

 

[albin25]

I usually attend one of the three shows here in Lewiston (next weekend (Mar 13-15).
(I like to check out the Horn-hide-mount competition, $3500 bucks and a couple of Winchesters up for grabs)
Usually there are maybe 10 or so of the 14 local gun stores in our valley (not bad for a local population of maybe 40,000) to keep the usual bunch of traveling dealers from pricing their stuff out of the stratosphere.

 

[PrDubi]

Want to be different? Do a gun show at the range. ..have a tent on one side and on the other side..customers can shoot guns they think they want to buy. I remember attending one as a kid back in Los Angeles.

 

[eldbillbo]

the guy doing that silver dollar trick is my uncle.....

Really, thats awesome this was about 16-18 years ago He had quite a bit of guns at great prices his table was swarming with guys all around it but the whole place was swarming . He was kind of a Ted Nugent looking guy

 

[PrDubi]

he still does the shows...just a little more fat now.

 

[bolus]

ok Joe, Its been 5 days. When is this NWFA gun showtravaganza with shooting and all you can eat crab feed scheduled? You got it all planned out right?

 

[Sgt Nambu]

I'm afraid I'm not much help, Joe. The law requiring background checks killed gun shows for me. Just to much a PITA to me! I go to EXPO shows to buy bulk ammo and usually a knik knak or two and I go to the ARPC shows in Albany twice a year mostly because I'm a member. The little shows at Carson WA are fun but I just go for entertainment with friendly regular folks. If I'm looking to purchase a gun etc I haunt the Classifieds on here.

 

[PrDubi]

why a pita?...Simple background check...Not sounding like a nazi....but can you pass one if your life depended on it?

 

[Trothkin]

I stopped going to the EXPO show. Mostly due to traffic and that it is almost too big if you know what I mean. Prices where always a little high also. I mostly just go to the Hillsboro show when it's in town since it's close and don't have to pay for parking. It's small and usually the same vendors and prices are still high but I like to go and look mostly. There is one guy that I like to buy ammo from, he has decent bulk prices for 40 SW.

 

[oli700]

4. What could be done to improve gun shows, and/or set ourselves apart from others?
Promote it as a 'dealer free' gun show with only private individuals (like you and me) to display their goods.

best idea yet

 

[Sgt Nambu]

why a pita?...Simple background check...Not sounding like a nazi....but can you pass one if your life depended on it?

Trust me, pal. I can pass any check going. Just happens I don't need the goverments nose in my business. They don't need to know what I've got. They don't tell me what they have, either. As far as I'm concerned, as an American citizen, I'm as sovereign as our cheating, lying goverment. They may not like it, you may not like it but tough cookies! - SRG

 

[MountainBear]

From the viewpoint of a small shop owner.

Gunshows aren't dead. But they are frustrating, even for a small dealer like me. The gunshows I grew up with were, like most have mentioned, vastly different than what they have become. Wes and Marla have pretty much taken over the scene and will let anyone who pays have a table. That has lead to having to wade through too many tables of beef jerky and beanie babies, cheap electronics, and offers to steam clean my glasses. Much of the rest of the show has gone the way of mega-dealers such as Keith. I always enjoyed shows for finding used items and weird stuff. I went to my LGS's in Bend for new guns. There are still shows that I find enjoyable, but they are almost always smaller shows. Rickreall is usually pretty good, as is Willamette Valley Arms Collectors in Eugene. Central Oregon Gun and Custom Knife Show (the new Redmond show) had a good opening show, and will hopefully continue to grow. The Klamath and Lakeview shows are still good as well. I'm sure there are still good shows in Portland, but they aren't the ones at the Expo center. I can't stomach $8 for parking, then entry fee. It's $20 to go look at beef jerky and beanie babies. Some of these shows have collectors who just like the shows for show and tell. Its always good as I always learn something new. Every show has the tables run by who my friends and I have always referred to as the museum curators. All their guns are in glass display cases and are priced like they'd just assume keep them. They're easy to spot and easy to avoid.

I don't table at shows, except the new Redmond show. In the interest of full disclosure, I know and am friends with the lady who runs that show. Their show is small, but there aren't as many mega dealers, and all tables have to be gun and knife only. Vendors are asked to remove any offending items. It made for a good, small, but chock-full show, which is part of the reason I have decided to table there. I do not table at other shows, as I don't like closing my shop or removing most of my inventory for weekends. Being closed on Sundays, I still attend a few shows, mostly those in the Central Willamette Valley, such as Eugene, Albany, and Rickreall. I still find some decent parts, but very rarely am I looking for a gun.

I think it would be very difficult for NWFA to start a show, at least in Oregon. Most desirable dates are already scooped up by the other shows. If there were an NWFA show, I would think somewhere like Salem, Keizer, or Woodburn would be pretty centralized. A policy of what can be had on the tables goes a long way. It could include the prepper gear others have mentioned, but hopefully would keep the others crap out. Keeping dealers out is an idea. Not sure how I feel about it, being a small dealer myself.

The other ideas have been great. Voter registrations booths. Invite the NRA, the 2nd Amendment Foundation, OFF, and the rest. Put up a united front. Have sign ups for volunteer clean-ups. Don't just have concessions, but have somewhere to sit down and BS with other people. Have an instructor give free gun safety talks. Get Eddie Eagle or something for the kids.

Good luck with whatever NWFA decides.

 

[Mongo1]

I like the idea of centralized location. Portland is not central.

 

[huthuthike]

1. Do you think gun shows still have their place, or do you consider them a thing of the past? It seems the only time I hear about a good gun show it starts with "30 years ago..."
2. What do you like best about gun shows you've attended in the past two years? I generally get to see what I am looking for, as long as it's common. I'm not looking for unicorns for my collection at this point.

3. What do you like least about gun shows you've attended in the past two years? Paying admission/parking - I honestly don't get it. The sellers should be paying for the facility. The stuff I purchased most recently would have been cheaper online if I had factored in the admission fee.

4. What could be done to improve gun shows, and/or set ourselves apart from others? Gun Shows have to realize they are not competing against the other shops in town. They are competing against the whole country on price, selection and service. Show me something interesting, or help me pay less.

 

[Outrider]

1. Do you think gun shows still have their place, or do you consider them a thing of the past?

Gun shows do have a purpose but they have to adapt to remain relevant.

Currently, gun shows are little more than local dealers getting together in one spot to allow potential customers to browse the inventories of multiple shops in one trip.

Before the internet, this was very helpful to the customer. With the internet, this formula is stale.

2. What do you like best about gun shows you've attended in the past two years?

The best things about the gun show have always been the ability to handle a firearm or firearm related gear one is interested in acquiring and being able to purchase it without a lot of complications or added expense (i.e. no interstate transfers or shipping costs).

Having most of the local dealers in one place makes it somewhat convenient.

3. What do you like least about gun shows you've attended in the past two years?

Honestly, the cost of attending gun shows has made them unattractive to many people. Admission and parking at the Portland Expo, is roughly $20. So whatever "deal" a person might find seems like less of a deal when adding what amounts to a $20 cover charge to go to the show.

4. What could be done to improve gun shows, and/or set ourselves apart from others?

As previously mentioned by others, typically there is not much of a "show" at a gun show. Occasionally, there is a display of military vehicles but usually it's just a dealer's room. As such, people are reluctant to spend money to enter even though having many of the area's dealers in one location is providing the customer with convenience.

To improve or set a new gun show apart from the others, it probably would be helpful to look at the convention model instead of the classic gun show.

When done right, conventions provide an experience to the attendees. "308" already hit on this but there probably should be speakers who do presentations or training on topics gun owners care about. Obviously, it would be impossible to satisfy everyone at every show but if qualified professionals made presentations or provided useful training, there would be more of a reason to attend the show.

Plenty of people could benefit from a short presentation about use of force and pertinent state specific law, how to conceal carry properly, or how to render first aid for a gunshot wound. One would imagine that land navigation, camping, prepping, etc. would also be of interest.

Perhaps something to consider as a way to increase attendance is that any attendee who buys a firearm or makes a significant purchase at the show qualifies for his or her admission fee to be refunded. In the alternative, it might be worth giving people a free pass to a future show if they do make a significant purchase at a show. These two might not drive sales but they may remove the "cost" excuse people use to skip shows.

 

[Mikej]

Something that just occurred to me. If gun shows got so popular as the NW Sportsman's Show I'd only go once a year, if that, where now I go twice, maybe three times if I'm looking for something specific. That's a dilemma!

I don't see the price as too terrible when you consider where else are you going to go for three whole hours, or more, and spend less for two?

It would be nice if there were some better prices, but you know what would happen if there were a bunch of "Good" deals at the shows? The place would be over-run with "Scalpers" grabbing the good deals to then put on line, or in their shops, to sell the kind of people that bought all the insanely priced AR's and .22lr after Sandy Hook!

 

[Liberty97045]

Guns show, like many things have been fundamentally changed by the transition from the industrial age to the connected age. If price is the only consideration then people will go to a gun store or gun show, shop the item(s) and then look for a better price on-line.

Anyone who wishes to get and keep customers in this new economy MUST differentiate themselves from the market by adding value as you suggest.
Here are some thoughts to mull over:

• Relationships are important. People do business with people they like and like people like them.
• Recognition is a big motivator. You give a bronze membership for collecting shooting trash.
• Exclusivity, Just look at Cabelas and their branded items for how effective this could be.

I like the club idea if it is legal. It would be more convenient and would be a finger in the eye of anti freedom law makers.

Add value by bringing in speakers / teachers.

Gun appraisal for $5 each

Add exclusivity by having NWFA branded items (guns, sportswear, etc)

No admission, no parking fee but add a transaction fee (5% on guns, 10% on everything else) I hate it that I spend $25 before for the privilege of shopping.

 

[mjbskwim]

I've entertained the idea of Northwest Firearms hosted gun shows for almost as long as the site has existed. With our Volunteer Program taking off I'm evaluating other sources of income, to support it and our other endeavors. I'd like to get some input from the community to see if looking into it further is worthwhile. An important note, if we can't do it better than what's out there now, we won't be doing it.

I'll ask a couple of questions, but feel free to add whatever input you have

1. Do you think gun shows still have their place, or do you consider them a thing of the past?
2. What do you like best about gun shows you've attended in the past two years?
3. What do you like least about gun shows you've attended in the past two years?
4. What could be done to improve gun shows, and/or set ourselves apart from others?

#1I think gun shows will always have their place,but as you are saying,with some changes
#2What I like about the gunshows was the social aspect of the shows.Small town shows bring some bad players in but also have the locals . When I did shows in Port Angeles and Sequim,our table was as much of a place to stop and BS as to buy stuff.
#3 The vendors that ruin the shows because they have everything price 20% higher than it should be.
Keeps new people from coming and lowers the traffic count of real buyers
#4 Make the "gun shows" gun "shows" more than sales events. Keep the guys out that have the same guns on there tables they have had for 4 years
Maybe have a section for people to just display,show and tell their favorite guns.

I'm going to try to hit a few shows over here.If they turn out like the WAC,Falcon and Knowdel? shows,I'll likely not bother the time.

 

[Cliph]

I've entertained the idea of Northwest Firearms hosted gun shows for almost as long as the site has existed. With our Volunteer Program taking off I'm evaluating other sources of income, to support it and our other endeavors. I'd like to get some input from the community to see if looking into it further is worthwhile. An important note, if we can't do it better than what's out there now, we won't be doing it.

I'll ask a couple of questions, but feel free to add whatever input you have

1. Do you think gun shows still have their place, or do you consider them a thing of the past?
2. What do you like best about gun shows you've attended in the past two years?
3. What do you like least about gun shows you've attended in the past two years?
4. What could be done to improve gun shows, and/or set ourselves apart from others?

1. The attendance at overpriced gun shows demonstrates they have a place currently.
2 Good deals
3. Lack of creature comforts: Climate control, ventilation, beverages, sandwiches
4. Offer discounted admission to military retirees, apply admission charge to purchases, offer receipt materials to private sellers to encourage ID recording of ODL or OCCP