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So I posted this pictures of this rifle before...just thought that I would add more detail to the description.

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Henry Leman Trade Rifle Circa late 1830's.
.50 caliber percussion full stock rifle.
1-60 twist , 42 inch barrel , maple stock , single trigger and a cap box.
Henry Leman made rifles from 1834 -1887 Leman's factory was in Lancaster Pennsylvania.

A note or two about Trade Rifles and Leman rifles...
A Trade Rifle was a rifle made to be used / sold or traded in the fur trade.
These rifles were used as personal rifles by fur traders and trappers as well as being traded to the tribes for furs , hides , horses etc...
Many companies made Trade Rifles J.Henry , Dickert , Fordney , Derringer and many others as well as Leman.

Henry Leman was a prolific rifle maker....But...
He had a factory...so lots of folks actually made Leman rifles...one guy was a stock maker...another guy worked on assembling the locks...someone else made barrels...etc..
It was a true assembly line process.
Also Leman sold parts such as locks and barrels....so just 'cause a rifle has a Leman marked lock or barrel...does not mean that the rifle is a Leman rifle...you gotta look at the whole rifle and see if it fits in with a actual Leman rifle's style.
Leman made two basic Trade Rifles...one with a full stock and one with a half stock.
Both have some basic forms that make for a distinctive Leman look.

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The Ashmore lock..
Originally a flintlock , this lock was converted to percussion...if one look close you can see the brass pins in the screw holes , where the frizzen spring was located.
I think that this lock was converted to percussion , then fitted to this rifle...I do not think that the rifle was a flintlock.
Ashmore was a English Gunmaker from 1827 - 1855...many American rifles used imported English locks.

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The rear and front sights.
18th and 19th century rifle had low sights....much lower than the sights commonly seen on today's replicas , recreations and reproduction rifles.
Why...?
I do not know for sure...
Lots of armchair reasons out there...such as low sights won't snag on brush etc.....
I think it was just style...as in firearm styling and shooting style.
The low sights are quick to align and make for "easy" snap shooting...they do however suffer from "heat mirage"
( becoming blurry) with extended shooting.

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The capbox...used to hold percussion caps or shooting patches.
These come in many styles...the one seen here is very typical of a Leman rifle.

Also note the stripe pattern....its very pretty.
Just like today...folks in the 19th century like a good looking rifle.
Leman knew this and often artificially stripped his rifle stocks....this one is done with stain applied to the stock to simulate natural curl , before the actual finish was done.
Some folks say that he heated a thin metal rod and scorched his stocks....I have never seen a Leman rifle stock that was made that way.

Well I hope y'all enjoyed a little more detailed look at this rifle and that I didn't bore ya too much.
Andy
 
Thanks for the lesson, Andy!
In a glance, the staining does look like quarter sawn or tiger stripe. On closeup, it does look like heat burns. I imagine you have seen where people have inadvertently sanded through this stain?

Thread drift: In a past life, I used to collect Persian rugs. They themselves have a history of makers as well as techniques. One of my favorites is the early 20th century Sarouk rugs. Most of them are red background, but what many people don't know is the red was painted on after the rug was woven. Until they send them out to be washed at a place that doesn't know about Sarouks. The red washes out and the owner is left with a salmon pink rug.
The equivalent in guns is taking naval jelly to a blued gun. Oops.
 
In a glance, the staining does look like quarter sawn or tiger stripe. On closeup, it does look like heat burns. I imagine you have seen where people have inadvertently sanded through this stain?
I have seen antique rifles with a worn finish....and the stained stripe just "disappears" so to speak.
I haven't seen scorch marks on these rifles...I have seen and felt a very slight cut or groove in the stock to help accent the artificial curl....this is the case in my Leman.
Andy
 
I have heard of wrapping a guns stock with cord and slightly burning the wood between cord wraps was one way they made the tiger stripes?
I have heard and read that as well....haven't seen any evidence of that in antique rifles...
I have done that to get the "candy stripes" on ram rods....but again....I do not think that , that was a historic practice...
Andy
 
Oh le-man trade not le-mon trade. Here I thought you started a thread to swap junk rifles.


Awesome rifle btw. Fantastic looking wood!
Well some folks think that these old rifles are junk...:eek: :D

I am sure that Leman made a lemon a time or two...I can see a "Its Friday and I want to get outta here early" rifle or a "OMG , Its Monday morning already" rifle , slipping out the door.

These rifles when new sold for around $12 - $15 dollars in the late 1830's - 1860's....
Andy
 
Lots of bears big and little fell to muzzle loading firearms...
Just like hunting today...you gotta know your firearm and know the critter you are hunting.

Now before someone pipes up with the famous Lewis and Clark story of it took 8 shots including a head shot to kill a grizzly bear...
Some things to think about :
We do not know where those other 7 shots landed...a bad hit is a bad hit , no matter with a muzzle loader or the latest in rifles....
We do not know the loads used in the firearms , in that specific case...
We do not know the shooting or hunting skill of those involved in that case either...

Also...if one were to read the whole journals of Lewis and Clark....they killed many grizzlies , many times with far less dramatic circumstances.

Please note that I am not saying that it is easy to kill a grizzly bear with a muzzle loader or that Lewis and Clark and Co. took hunting them for granted...

Just saying that you can do it and that you are not ready made lunch for a grizzly if you have a muzzle loading firearm.
Andy
 
Well some folks think that these old rifles are junk...:eek: :D

I am sure that Leman made a lemon a time or two...I can see a "Its Friday and I want to get outta here early" rifle or a "OMG , Its Monday morning already" rifle , slipping out the door.

These rifles when new sold for around $12 - $15 dollars in the late 1830's - 1860's....
Andy
Wait, that's it? The good ol' math stones inflation calculator puts $15 in 1830 at ~$400 today. So, a handmade rifle is cheaper than a mass produced plastic fantastic?

Either my math is off or we're paying too much for guns these days...
 
Wait, that's it? The good ol' math stones inflation calculator puts $15 in 1830 at ~$400 today. So, a handmade rifle is cheaper than a mass produced plastic fantastic?

Either my math is off or we're paying too much for guns these days...
Yep...
Well hand made on an assembly line....Leman did not make the rifle per se...
He used ready made parts and assembled a rifle or Trade Gun.
Now some early rifle makers like Dickert , Armstrong , Beck...did indeed , at times make a whole rifle
"Lock Stock and Barrel" as the old saying goes.
Andy
 
Sure it can be done. But if you get it wrong?
It looks like this. :confused:


Well old Hugh , did survive and the bear was driven off with muzzle loading rifle fire.
Again a much heard about and dramatic event....

And again....many more grizzlies were killed by muzzle loaders....yet not made into bad movies...'cause the bear died and no one injured.
Andy
 
Yep...
Well hand made on an assembly line....Leman did not make the rifle per se...
He used ready made parts and assembled a rifle or Trade Gun.
Now some early rifle makers like Dicket , Armstrong , Beck...did indeed , at times make a whole rifle
"Lock Stock and Barrel" as the old saying goes.
Andy
Okay, so hand-made...ish...my Dan Wesson is hand made...ish...at about 3x the cost...
 
One thing to remember is that most late period ( 1830's - 1870's ) Trade Rifles were in large calibers...
Usually .50 on up , they were meant for the taking of large and or dangerous game...Animals like Buffalo and Grizzly.

Now again , I ain't saying it was easy or not dangerous...
I am saying that it was done...often and with far less dramatic circumstances than the many accounts that capture our attention.
Andy
 
In my collection the rifle calibers vary between .32 and .58
The average being .47 caliber.

For the "Plains Rifles " / "Mountain Rifles" / Western Fur Trade Rifles , in my collection the calibers are :
.45 takes a .454 round ball / .50 ( x3 ) takes a .490 round ball / .53 takes a .520 round ball / .58 take a .570 round ball
I do have a St. Louis rifle made by a company associated with the Western Fur Trade in .32 caliber...
It was probably made for the local trade...and not meant as Plains or Mountain rifle.
Andy
 
Well old Hugh , did survive and the bear was driven off with muzzle loading rifle fire.
Again a much heard about and dramatic event....

And again....many more grizzlies were killed by muzzle loaders....yet not made into bad movies...'cause the bear died and no one injured.
Andy



Bad Movies?

I bet you can spot everything wrong with there portrayer of the times?

I know. I spot all kinds of things when I watch some shows.

And don't get me wrong. I'm not saying there is anything the matter with a flintlock or cap and ball.
They were state of the art. And any man armed with one back then was truly at the top of the food chain!

What I meant to say, is those men were amazing! They took what we may think of today as primitive. And made it work. And work well.
The fact they went up against animals like grizzly. Only proves there skill..

I just admire how tuff they were. And their faith in there ability.

Ability they proved to themselves many times over.


I only used the bear attack scene to show the risk they knew the faced.
And still they did it! And most always came out on top.
 
Bad Movies?

I bet you can spot everything wrong with there portrayer of the times?

I know. I spot all kinds of things when I watch some shows.

And don't get me wrong. I'm not saying there is anything the matter with a flintlock or cap and ball.
They were state of the art. And any man armed with one back then was truly at the top of the food chain!

What I meant to say, is those men were amazing! They took what we may think of today as primitive. And made it work. And work well.
The fact they went up against animals like grizzly. Only proves there skill..

I just admire how tuff they were. And their faith in there ability.

Ability they proved to themselves many times over.


I only used the bear attack scene to show the risk they knew the faced.
And still they did it! And most always came out on top.
I hear ya there on how tough they were....
I love to play a "Mountain Man on the weekends or during the summer at various rendezvous , even during hunting season....but actually living it...Well lets just think bout that for a minute or two...:D
Andy
 

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