Lamenting a .223 bolt barrel with 1:12 twist

[LuckySG]

I have a remington 700 in .223 that may need a new barrel with a twist rate faster than 1:12. I understand that slower rate means a lighter round, but buying 39 grain bullets make me feel less than satisfied (more than $1/round cost annoyance mostly).

Looking for lessons learned from anyone that has slogged down this path already. I see two paths:

1. Find ammo that gets the most out of the gun and has a stabilized flight for good groups
2. buy a barrel with a faster twist (already eyeballed the offerings at Christensen Arms)

Open to any practical suggestions. It actually shot 75 grain sierra match kings well, but they would tumble.

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[No_Regerts]

I'd be tempted just to punch it AI and shoot 55gr bullets a little faster without suffering brass stretch. Then shoot the crap out it.

That is, unless, you plan to shoot beyond 400 yards. Then I'd rebarrel to an 8 twist and shoot 68gr or heavier bullets. Maybe still punch it AI.

 

[No_Regerts]

if the rebarrel is gonna cost you more than $350, Id just spring for a Tikka T3 with an 8 twist. Thats what I did. Now my 12 twist 700 sits in the safe or used as a loaner. My T3 goes out to play.

 

[LuckySG]

I'd be tempted just to punch it AI and shoot 55gr bullets a little faster without suffering brass stretch. Then shoot the crap out it.

That is, unless, you plan to shoot beyond 400 yards. Then I'd rebarrel to an 8 twist and shoot 68gr or heavier bullets. Maybe still punch it AI.

It has a few bigger brothers, so I think shots over 400 yards would be a pass for me at this caliber. What do you think about trying a shorter bullet?

 

[LuckySG]

if the rebarrel is gonna cost you more than $350, Id just spring for a Tikka T3 with an 8 twist. Thats what I did. Now my 12 twist 700 sits in the safe or used as a loaner. My T3 goes out to play.

If I told you want I have sunk into this rifle so far... Only the action and barrel came in the first box.

 

[No_Regerts]

It has a few bigger brothers, so I think shots over 400 yards would be a pass for me at this caliber. What do you think about trying a shorter bullet?

A shorter bullet will stabilize just fine. I shoot 50gr Vmax out of my 12 twist just fine. I'd stick to flat base bullets to give you a little more lattitude with OAL while having enough neck tension.

 

[LuckySG]

The barrel that is tempting me is of course wrapped in carbon fiber and runs $700 when it is in stock. Because carbon fiber makes hyper cars look better and go faster, why wouldn't it instantly make me a better shooter?

 

[No_Regerts]

The barrel that is tempting me is of course wrapped in carbon fiber and runs $700 when it is in stock. Because carbon fiber makes hyper cars look better and go faster, why wouldn't it instantly make me a better shooter?

Just like how PF Flyers make you faster and Jordans make you jump higher?

 

[LuckySG]

Just like how PF Flyers make you faster and Jordans make you jump higher?

Yep! My high school track coach screamed at me for wearing Nike waffle runners in the 400m, said I should have put on spikes. (I also ran the 800m) I smiled and replied they are brand new, I will win.

 

[Ura-Ki]

Get a new 1/8 twist tube of choice short chambered and have @Velzey finish chamber and ream to Wylde specs! While your in there, have the bolt gone through and trued and have the front receiver ring turned dead true! If your gonna do up a Remmy 700, that's the way to do it! Really wanna make it trick, and the envy of all your friends, have the stock tensioned to the barrel, works to dampen the harmonics quite well, and now its on you to equal the rifles mechanical abilities!

 

[pharmseller]

What's you goal?
What do you plan on shooting with the rifle? Marmots, sage rats, yotes?
How far will you be shooting?




P

 

[2ndtimer]

Your 1 in 12" twist barrel should work fine for bullets that weigh 60 grains or less. Chances are you will see best accuracy with those that weigh less than 55 grains. For affordable factory ammo that has shot exceptionally well in my 26" barrel, you might try Fiocchi Extrema V-MAX ammo in the 40 gr and 50 gr weights. It has shot some really good (for this shooter, at least) groups in my 700 SPS Varmint. Usually 5 shots in 3/4 of an inch or smaller at 100 yards from the bench. Fiocchi .223 Rem Ammunition – Per 50 : Cabela's. If you order more than $50.00 worth, you get free shipping with the code they show.
Another affordable ammo that has performed well for me is the Federal American Eagle Tipped Varmint 50 gr ammo. It also runs around .50 per round on sale. You might find some if you look around, I have heard it has been discontinued by Federal. ( a shame, since it performed very well, even in 1 in 8" twist AR's)
Before you abandon the 1 in 12" twist barrel, think hard about the distance you plan to shoot. If it is less than 300 yards, the lightweight bullets can actually be pushed faster in the slower twist barrel without coming apart. That Fiocchi 40 gr V-MAX load chronographed an honest 3650 fps out of my 26" barrel, but lost 200 fps out of a 24" 1 in 8 twist. Of course, either one works great on ground squirrels or prairie dogs. And I have chronographed handloads with 40 gr Nosler Ballistic Tips or Hornady V-MAX bullets at 3800 fps out of that 26" tube. I like my slow twist .223 Remington!

 

[LuckySG]

What's you goal?
What do you plan on shooting with the rifle? Marmots, sage rats, yotes?
How far will you be shooting?




P

The goal is small, respectable groups with ammo less expensive than what I feed my .308. 200-300-ish would be ideal and if the opportunity arose to use it for varmints, but mostly it will be to offer newer shooters a gentle and accurate rifle to "try out" that will have a positive influence on their attitude with shooting.

 

[pharmseller]

Sounds like ammo cost is driving the bulk of the decision.

Find the cheapest, most reliable ammo and match the twist to the ammo. New shooters will probably focus on 200 yards, and finding respectable accuracy should be easy. I'm betting 1-8" is your huckleberry.

Although, as a Tikka homer, I prefer No Regerts' solution.




P

 

[Member 34319]

Keep it and buy or load the lighter bullets.

I too thought heavier is better in 223. That's what the internet said! My favorite loads are 40-55 grain bullets. Yes even out to 500 yards. Mostly 100-250 though.

Hornady and Nosler sell factory ammo with these weights that do very well too if you aren't looking to load.

 

[crossbow5]

I have a Ruger No. 3 with a 20 inch 1 in 12 twist barrel. It shoots 52 grain Hornady match bullets very well. I have also shot factory loaded 55 grain loads that are acceptable. I generally shoot at 100 yards. I agree with Reno 911, "Keep it and buy or load lighter bullets".

 

[2ndtimer]

Sounds like ammo cost is driving the bulk of the decision.

Find the cheapest, most reliable ammo and match the twist to the ammo. New shooters will probably focus on 200 yards, and finding respectable accuracy should be easy.

I would be surprised to find any ammo that can beat the Fiocchi V-MAX ammo for price ($24.95 for a box of 50 rounds), or accuracy and performance on critters. Of course, each rifle is unique in what ammo it prefers, but the Fiocchi V-MAX ammo has worked well in my Remington 700 SPS Varmint, my Weatherby Vanguard Varmint Special, as well as 3 different AR-15's.
I admit that I shoot handloads most of the time, but I have a good supply of the Fiocchi ammo, just in case.

 

[DLS]

The original twist rate for the M16 was 1:14 which did not always stabilize the 55gr. round the U.S. had adopted for the rifle. So after study the twist was increase to 1:12 which proved to be about ideal for a 55gr. bullet.

The twist remained there until the 62 gr. SS109 / M855 round came into use. This new ball cartridge required a new companion tracer round, the M856. The tracer round weighs just under 65 gr. and the bullet is quite a bit longer than the companion ball round. A 1:12 twist was not able to stabilize this round in cold weather due to reduced velocity upon firing and the denser air masses that cold weather brings. It was due to this tracer round that the military steepened the twist to a 1:7 ensuring this tracer would stabilize in all atmospheric conditions, all the way down to artic temperatures.

Your 1:12 is ideal for 55 gr. bullets, and I'd challenge you to see a difference in stability in anything from 60gr. and lighter. I really like the Sierra 60gr. HP in the 1:12 twist. It's inexpensive and very accurate in the rifles where I have seen it used.

There are a ton of match grade bullets in the 45 - 55 gr. range available as components or loaded ammo. It will not be difficult to find an accurate load.

As already mentioned, if you want to shoot even lighter bullets (the 40 - 45 gr. range) a fast twist barrel may be too much for the bullet, and cause it to break apart in flight.

So, based on your intended use, count me as another one who votes you keep the barrel, find a good load and go shoot the heck out of it. You can buy a lot of ammo for the price of a new barrel.

Cheers!

 

[orygun]

If I told you want I have sunk into this rifle so far... Only the action and barrel came in the first box.

Then it shouldn't be a question. Rebarrel it. If you're in over your head already and all it would take to finish the job is a new tube, bite the bullet and get it over with. You won't be happy with it if you don't.

 

[mkwerx]

Rebarrel with a 1:8, or just buy a Tikka or Ruger American... or do all 3.