Kent, WA - biz owner kills 1 burglar with shotgun, other burglar arrested

[dmv9]

Based on the article, the owner confronted the men. If the owner went looking for the bad guys, I doubt he's going to be in the right. If they don't find guns or knifes or some kind of weapon, it's going to be hard to justify that he was "defending" himself.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

The owner lives on the property and became aware of something going on in the office of the business that didn’t seem right

There was a case in Walla Walla where the owner lived in his business and kept a .25 pistol near the register, therefore it was reasonable for him to believe that the robber (who was found unarmed) could have had that weapon on him. The grand jury concluded that the business owner was justified in standing in his broken doorway and pumping five rounds of #4 buckshot into the robber as he fled. This shooting is much less severe.

 

[oknow]

Based on the article, the owner confronted the men. If the owner went looking for the bad guys, I doubt he's going to be in the right. If they don't find guns or knifes or some kind of weapon, it's going to be hard to justify that he was "defending" himself.

2 against 1;.
unless they were little girls or the owner was hulk hogan there doesn't need to be a weapon.

 

[Stomper]

Based on the article, the owner confronted the men. If the owner went looking for the bad guys, I doubt he's going to be in the right. If they don't find guns or knifes or some kind of weapon, it's going to be hard to justify that he was "defending" himself.

I'm amazed some folks think that just because a perpetrator winds up not being armed and gets killed during the commission of a potentially violent crime, or that a victim can get into trouble for GOING TOWARDS and CONFRONTING perpetrators committing burglary/robbery.



Fact:
It is reasonable to assume that an individual(s) willing to break into a building/dwelling to either commit robbery and/or burglary is also willing to commit an act of violence upon anyone who may be in that building at the time.

Fact:
"Disparity of force", (Hulk Hogan vs Whimpy, a knife vs gun, two against one, etc) COULD be a factor for an ambitious DA to pursue charges, but the overall circumstances of the action have a bearing on the case, and it STILL has to get past a Grand Jury... If you were in fear of your life, they have to PROVE you really weren't... Two burglars (with priors), one property owner... Good luck on getting a conviction.

Fact:
"Going towards, or seeking out burglars/robbers" during the commission of a crime DOES NOT put you in the wrong. It is well established case law (in free States) that a person has NO DUTY TO RETREAT. We have the legal right to prevent others from stealing our property, and defend our (and others') lives from physical harm and/or death. It is also established case law that the State has no legal obligation to defend you, or your property.

I actually understand the sentiments of not wanting to slot someone over stealing a few cheap possessions. One very foggy morning at about 3AM I (almost) caught someone in the act of stealing some expensive nitrogen purged (refrigeration grade) copper pipe off my work truck parked on the street. I ran out into the street with my Glock-30 aimed at the guy riding off on a bicycle into the fog with my $120 20' stick of copper pipe...

As pissed off as I was I could've shot him but didn't, because it was foggy and I could have hurt one of my neighbors or damaged their property, and my life wasn't truly in danger at that point... had all this transpired ON my property or had the circumstances been in closer proximity to each other, it may well have transpired differently...

If that is what you feel you have to do to be "safe" then fine, but as for "barricading myself in a room" during a robbery/burglary... Mmmm... not too likely unless there's no other recourse, but then again I have always been of the mindset to "take it to the enemy fast and first". Violence of action... When justified.

 

[dmv9]

@stomper
I'm just saying that it's going to be really hard to defend a position where you have a weapon and perpetrator doesn't have one. Also, you going and looking for trouble is also not going to look like you are defending yourself. You make the 911 call first and sit tight. Yeah it sucks! But if you go out looking for the trouble, you are NOT defending yourself. Now if you here something downstairs and your wife and kids are upstairs, they yeah, you need to investigate because they could come upstairs. I just don't THINK this guy was in that position.

 

[mortar maggot]

Being outnumbered will be justifiable for me because I am not physically able to fight anymore. They come onto my property to try & take what I worked hard for they will only get lead & lots of it!!!

I agree with you but I will take it farther, sure 2:1 is a disparity of force, but getting into a physical confrontation with JUST 1 bad guy can easily spell doom.

Say you are the 30 year old fit, strong and healthy 6 footer weighs in at 190 and all bone and muscle, are you SURE you can kick anyone's *** you get into a fight with?

What if they are an MMA fighter, some Kung Foo 4th degree black belt, before going 1:1 it very well be time to shoot. This of course depends on many circumstances, in your home, or out on the street etc.

 

[Caveman Jim]

How right you are MM, thanks for expounding. I am one who will defend my life and property against anyone.
I know that some people want to run & hide that's fine, but remember this, if you flee and a family member gets hurt or killed, you will have to live with that for the rest of your life. I can live with shooting a dirtbag but not with them hurting my family!!!

 

[Will_Power]

No update on the dead assailant yet. I'm quite certain that he was just turning his life around though . . .

Of course!

Funny how they're always turning their lives around, eh?

Poor little Tyrell. He was into the wrong crowd and spent some time in jail, but was starting to turn his life around right when the cop shot him after pulling a gun on the police.

Poor Marvin. He had a history of arrests, but was just turning things around when he got shot after breaking into some guy's house.

 

[j4545]

I agree with you but I will take it farther, sure 2:1 is a disparity of force, but getting into a physical confrontation with JUST 1 bad guy can easily spell doom.

Say you are the 30 year old fit, strong and healthy 6 footer weighs in at 190 and all bone and muscle, are you SURE you can kick anyone's *** you get into a fight with?

What if they are an MMA fighter, some Kung Foo 4th degree black belt, before going 1:1 it very well be time to shoot. This of course depends on many circumstances, in your home, or out on the street etc.

Great point. I've trained numerous martial arts since I was a kid and still do to this day. You'd be surprised that little old 5' man can Judo throw you with the quickness. Come to find out he's some former Pan-Am games gold medalist.

 

[Flopsweat]

Of course!

Funny how they're always turning their lives around, eh?

Poor little Tyrell. He was into the wrong crowd and spent some time in jail, but was starting to turn his life around right when the cop shot him after pulling a gun on the police.

Poor Marvin. He had a history of arrests, but was just turning things around when he got shot after breaking into some guy's house.

See, this is what gives me hope for the future. With so many young people in the process of turning their lives around, it's just a matter of time before we are the most productive, peaceful, well adjusted, kindest society on the face of the earth. Right?

 

[RVTECH]

if heroin were legal none of this stuff would happen and the economy would flourish!

Yes and according to the new guy moving from China giving them methadone and 'food stamps' will prevent them from breaking into houses........

 

[BoonDocks36]

@ general ~legalize~ drugs comments.... Meh.

I know someone, whose defense ~line~ Against his "actions" was, "I had drank too many espresso's", I KID you NOT!!!

He was remanded, and later ordered to ~Stay Away From COFFEE~ it was a B&E he had done, sat there for hours, trying to break open the Locked Box, cut himself, (leaving behind DNA, already in LE data base) With a DVR video going the whole time!!!!!

Must have been some ~Good~ StarBuck's, Aye What ????

Criminal's do not Need a Reason, it has been postulated, studied, theoried, and ?proven? Genetic Malformation in Cranium.

Oh, Yeah. May I Re-Enter, "the twinkie defense", I rest my case.

philip,
I am not a lawyer in the BoonDocks, but my bed was a lumpy as the one I slept on, at that Motel I stayed in once....