Just Grind It Off?

[robertvarner]

I've got a question about how to proceed. I'm starting to reload 30-30 now that my "severely abused 30-30" project is completely restored. I've started hand-priming, use a universal decapper for all my brass, and I use a Lee Factory Crimp die whenever it makes sense. I am using a Lee Classic Turret press.

For the Lee 30-30 carbide die set, the decapper rod for the sizing die also serves as the case mouth flare tool. The powder die also does not flare the case mouth as it does with 223, 9mm, 38, and 44 die sets. During the load development, I started with the powder drop station, then the bullet seating die, and finally a light crimp with the FCD. Since the case mouth was not flared, I have to be VERY careful when placing the bullet into the seating die to prevent crushing the edge of the case mouth.

Here's the question. I want to flare the case mouth before I seat the bullet. Is it recommended to "grind" off the decapping portion of the sizing rod to leave just the flaring portion of the rod in place (remember I use a hand primer)? Normally I resist grinding off anything related to reloading equipment since they are machined tools with tight tolerances!

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[Moeca]

If I'm understanding right. Either need to resize/flare before you hand prime or yes knock off decapping pin so you can resize primed brass. I have a few dies I've ground or taken out the pin so I can size after I've decapped and primed.
If it's a lee die you can always pick up another sizing rod cheap on a order from midway or most other places. Hope this helps!

 

[Stomper]

You won't hurt the expander portion by grinding off the recapping pin.

 

[Member 34319]

Most die sets the decapping pin is replaceable. Therefore removable. Why not remove it versus grinding it off?

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

i use a lee universal neck expanding dye for my 30-30 and my 300blk.

 

[RVTECH]

I want to flare the case mouth before I seat the bullet.

Typically after sizing all you need to do is trim then debur and chamfer the case neck.

Flaring is not necessary with .30-30.

 

[robertvarner]

Typically after sizing all you need to do is trim then debur and chamfer the case neck.

Flaring is not necessary with .30-30.

I deburred all of the 30-30 cases as part of prep before starting the reloading steps mentioned.

And since these cases did not come from my rifle, I did what has always been the acceptable practice, I used the sizing die to set the case mouth to specs. That's what created the narrowing of the neck more, which led to crushing the case mouth and deforming the bullet base.

So, for the rest of the cases, I skipped resizing and started with powder drop. It was still a bit tight to fit the bullet into the case, and I had to take it easy when I seated it so I could guide it gingerly into the mouth.

 

[robertvarner]

i use a lee universal neck expanding dye for my 30-30 and my 300blk.

That sounds like a viable option rather than grinding off the top and then having to replace it later. I doubt the Lee would see that as a warranty replacement.

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

That sounds like a viable option rather than grinding off the top and then having to replace it later. I doubt the Lee would see that as a warranty replacement.

the universal expander is pretty inexpensive. id go that route

 

[gmerkt]

Maybe I'm missing something here. Are you using cast bullets in your .30-30 loads? If not, I can't think of any reason for flaring a .30-30 case mouth, or .223 that you also mentioned. To prevent crushing the case mouth when seating a rifle bullet, you chamfer it. That is, you put a little slope on the edge of the inside of the mouth. This allows the bullet to feed into the neck.

For the Lee 30-30 carbide die set, the decapper rod for the sizing die also serves as the case mouth flare tool.

What you are holding in your hand in that picture is not for flaring. That's the neck expander. When you full length resize, that sizes the neck to proper spec. on the upstroke of the press. But it doesn't flare.

To answer your basic question, you don't need to grind anything off that combination neck expander/decapper. If you've already decapped the cases, the expander with it's built-in decapper is just gonna be going through an empty hole.

If, when sizing rifle brass, you leave the expander out completely, yes you are gonna crush case necks when you attempt to seat a bullet. Because just using only the sizing die body alone sizes the neck down overly; the expander pulls the neck back out to "true" size.

RCBS rifle dies use an expander as well, it looks a little different than the Lee design. It's a rod with a "ball" or similar sizer on it, then the pin.

If you are using cast bullets, you still have to use the expander when sizing the cases, then after that, you flare the mouth just a taste. I like the Lyman M die for flaring rifle case mouths. Those are sized to the caliber bullet being used.

Most die sets the decapping pin is replaceable. Therefore removable.

With Lee dies, the pin is an integral part of the rod. But they're inexpensive so it doesn't matter. The complete Lee expander w/ pin doesn't cost any more than the single little pin itself from RCBS or Hornady.

i use a lee universal neck expanding dye for my 30-30 and my 300blk.

With jacketed bullets? If not, again, I wonder why this would be necessary. But I'm always up for learning more so please enlighten me. I do like the Lee Universal Expanding Die, it comes in handy for some uses that come up.

 

[quneur]

Could the process be what is holding up using the sizing/decapping die? Decap, clean, prime, resize when instead he could decap, clean, resize then prime.

I normally size/decap, clean, case prep (or clean after), prime, add powder, seat, crimp.

 

[po18guy]

I've got a question about how to proceed. I'm starting to reload 30-30 now that my "severely abused 30-30" project is completely restored. I've started hand-priming, use a universal decapper for all my brass, and I use a Lee Factory Crimp die whenever it makes sense. I am using a Lee Classic Turret press.

For the Lee 30-30 carbide die set, the decapper rod for the sizing die also serves as the case mouth flare tool. The powder die also does not flare the case mouth as it does with 223, 9mm, 38, and 44 die sets. During the load development, I started with the powder drop station, then the bullet seating die, and finally a light crimp with the FCD. Since the case mouth was not flared, I have to be VERY careful when placing the bullet into the seating die to prevent crushing the edge of the case mouth.

Here's the question. I want to flare the case mouth before I seat the bullet. Is it recommended to "grind" off the decapping portion of the sizing rod to leave just the flaring portion of the rod in place (remember I use a hand primer)? Normally I resist grinding off anything related to reloading equipment since they are machined tools with tight tolerances!

View attachment 710488

Is it one piece or pressed in? If pressed in, then pull it out and toss it in the die box. If not, grind away!

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

Maybe I'm missing something here. Are you using cast bullets in your .30-30 loads? If not, I can't think of any reason for flaring a .30-30 case mouth, or .223 that you also mentioned. To prevent crushing the case mouth when seating a rifle bullet, you chamfer it. That is, you put a little slope on the edge of the inside of the mouth. This allows the bullet to feed into the neck.



What you are holding in your hand in that picture is not for flaring. That's the neck expander. When you full length resize, that sizes the neck to proper spec. on the upstroke of the press. But it doesn't flare.

To answer your basic question, you don't need to grind anything off that combination neck expander/decapper. If you've already decapped the cases, the expander with it's built-in decapper is just gonna be going through an empty hole.

If, when sizing rifle brass, you leave the expander out completely, yes you are gonna crush case necks when you attempt to seat a bullet. Because just using only the sizing die body alone sizes the neck down overly; the expander pulls the neck back out to "true" size.

RCBS rifle dies use an expander as well, it looks a little different than the Lee design. It's a rod with a "ball" or similar sizer on it, then the pin.

If you are using cast bullets, you still have to use the expander when sizing the cases, then after that, you flare the mouth just a taste. I like the Lyman M die for flaring rifle case mouths. Those are sized to the caliber bullet being used.



With Lee dies, the pin is an integral part of the rod. But they're inexpensive so it doesn't matter. The complete Lee expander w/ pin doesn't cost any more than the single little pin itself from RCBS or Hornady.



With jacketed bullets? If not, again, I wonder why this would be necessary. But I'm always up for learning more so please enlighten me. I do like the Lee Universal Expanding Die, it comes in handy for some uses that come up.

no. lead poly coated bullets

 

[Certaindeaf]

I'd just get a Lee universal expanding die and then maybe grind that decapper.

 

[v0lcom13sn0w]

you also can get decappers that dont expand at all...

 

[Member 34319]

Maybe I'm missing something here. Are you using cast bullets in your .30-30 loads? If not, I can't think of any reason for flaring a .30-30 case mouth, or .223 that you also mentioned. To prevent crushing the case mouth when seating a rifle bullet, you chamfer it. That is, you put a little slope on the edge of the inside of the mouth. This allows the bullet to feed into the neck.



What you are holding in your hand in that picture is not for flaring. That's the neck expander. When you full length resize, that sizes the neck to proper spec. on the upstroke of the press. But it doesn't flare.

To answer your basic question, you don't need to grind anything off that combination neck expander/decapper. If you've already decapped the cases, the expander with it's built-in decapper is just gonna be going through an empty hole.

If, when sizing rifle brass, you leave the expander out completely, yes you are gonna crush case necks when you attempt to seat a bullet. Because just using only the sizing die body alone sizes the neck down overly; the expander pulls the neck back out to "true" size.

RCBS rifle dies use an expander as well, it looks a little different than the Lee design. It's a rod with a "ball" or similar sizer on it, then the pin.

If you are using cast bullets, you still have to use the expander when sizing the cases, then after that, you flare the mouth just a taste. I like the Lyman M die for flaring rifle case mouths. Those are sized to the caliber bullet being used.



With Lee dies, the pin is an integral part of the rod. But they're inexpensive so it doesn't matter. The complete Lee expander w/ pin doesn't cost any more than the single little pin itself from RCBS or Hornady.



With jacketed bullets? If not, again, I wonder why this would be necessary. But I'm always up for learning more so please enlighten me. I do like the Lee Universal Expanding Die, it comes in handy for some uses that come up.

If the post isn't cheap. Get a spare and leave it alone, then grind off the pin on the other.

 

[robertvarner]

you also can get decappers that dont expand at all...

I already have a Universal Decapper in a separate turret that I just pop in and it works wonders to decap multiple calibers in one sitting. Then I tumble them wet with SS pins separated by caliber (no .380 allowed within 100 yards of my shop).

Once they are dry, I put them in buckets by caliber until I decide what to hand prime and then load up.

 

[gmerkt]

no. lead poly coated bullets

I haven't tried any coated lead bullets in rifle yet. I've got so many jacketed rifle bullets put by that I don't really have need to. But I agree a coated bullet would be like using a cast bullet in rifle, a slight flare would be needed. That coating scratches off without too much effort.

I used to cast rifle bullets for .45-70, 8mm Mauser, 8x56R Austrian and some others. But no longer, I gave that up. I used the flare step on those. But never with jacketed or plated bullets.

 

[robertvarner]

Decided to buy a Lee Expanding Die. Got it set up with the slightest of neck flare as station #1, powder-through as station #2, bullet-length die is in #3, and the FCD (set to a light crimp) is station #4.

I think this should work for me. I also kept the decap/full-length 30-30 sizing die intact and placed it on the same turret where I have my universal decap die and my full-length 223 sizing die.

That way if I need to perform any of those tasks like I would in a single-station press operation.

Keeps all my options open.

 

[awshoot]

Maybe I'm missing something here. Are you using cast bullets in your .30-30 loads? If not, I can't think of any reason for flaring a .30-30 case mouth, or .223 that you also mentioned.
...

Same -- I get flaring the pistol cartridge cases, but I don't flare for any of the rifle rounds I reload (though none are straight wall rifle cartridges but neither is the 30-30). I was wondering if I'm missing something -- as it turns out I was -- I've not used plain lead in rifle loads.