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Fear has always been the motivator when it comes to voting. You fear the world will change to become something you can't live with. Politicians just manipulate your fears with their words. They can turn you to hate if they have the media behind them and even to kill if they can stir up enough hatred and demonize who they want dead.

It will be a huge gain for humanity if we turn that fear into something productive like self defense. People who learn self defense are less motivated by fear and can vote with reason, not panic.

Is anyone understanding what I am saying?:D

I think education, as already noted, is the #1 deterrent to fear. But before we can educate, we have to get an audience that is willing to listen. I think that's the first barrier we have to break down, and a great place to start.
 
I think education, as already noted, is the #1 deterrent to fear. But before we can educate, we have to get an audience that is willing to listen. I think that's the first barrier we have to break down, and a great place to start.

Well all education is run by the left and they are against guns. The media is run by the left and constantly is anti gun. So all you have left is the net and the net is all arguments not conducive to social change. I think to implement thinking you have to ask questions. If you want to change thinking you have to get into the strongholds of hate and just ask public questions that make people think.

The post that showed how to change a liberal by fear to a gun lover shows all it took was questions to make them think. If you wanted to start the world toward a better place start asking questions everywhere you go. Put them on bumper stickers and on the net. Send them to the media and e mails to the schools. Time to get people to think or the future is what?
 
In general it's a waste of time to preach to the choir or the die hard enemies. The best use of our efforts is to win as many to our position not necessarily to our party, in the hopes of pressuring all politicians, regardless of party, to protect, rather than attack, our 2A rights.

As for the media - they'll do what they want, but if we give them more fodder to use against us by acting like belligerent idiots (only some, not all do that) they will continue to run those stories. We need to stop writing those stories for them.
The Choir should include Middle of the road Lib-ertarians who although they have sworn off voting GOP under any circumstance (After the Papa Bush Barrel Ban in last part of 2oth century) and who in most cases stand with folks of Choice and are ok with unfettered back yard pot grows , and dislike the notion of Fundys poking their nose into folks bedrooms and C*ck blocking Gay Marriage, they still do not identify with Democrat desire for Open borders and penchant for Progressive Socialism thus they put 2A/RTKBA high on their list and have gravitated back recently to the Tea Party mentality (Which is Majority Republican in makeup) ... We need to have A BIG TENT CHOIR not poo poo the Choir as bought & paid for...
 
Long way around the mountain here but the article is a focus on how change is going to have to be made. When I was young we had a conservative Democrat party that really stood for America. Today's party is no where near the old Democrat party. So being conservative I moved to the Republican party and they too changed away from conservatism. I am now not with any party. Point is if you want something you have to change the party.

You change the party by changing the priorities of the people in it. You are never going to change the people but you can change what is most important to them. For it to happen quickly some big event will make change like 911. If we are going for change in the long run it has to be a concentrated effort in incremental change.

First you change the language to get people thinking. Gun free zone are free to gun you down zones is one I can think of but it's going to take pointing out differences that are not insulting to others but work toward our cause. Hate to say this but to change people you may have to become like them in some ways. If you become the community organizer just like bummer you can lead the masses to what ever you want:D

Sounds a lot like me! It's frustrating seeing people buy into either party, as it's clear neither of them care about what's best for the US or the average citizen. If we let this fake left-right facade divide us, as it was so masterfully designed to do, we will never be able to defend or restore any of our rights.

I don't know why the hypebole of "yelling and screaming" at anti's is being used. I've never yelled, screamed, nor shouted down anyone when discussing the politics of any subject.

I do know that as a white male, I'm automatically categorized as a racist, homophobe who hates women, and wants to overthrow our goverment if I disagree with ONE iota of the progressive mantra.

As for using that argument strategy, that's exactly what I do, and in fact have hushed many of my Australian anti-gun relatives doing exactly what you just illustrated. It made them think, and the timing is especially awesome because of the Muslim extremist attempting to run amok over there.

It's good you're not employing those tactics. I've seen it so many times, and no matter who it's coming from or what they're trying to get across, when they lose their composure I lose interest.

Prejudice is inherent in our society, every which way you can think of. The people categorizing you, labeling you before they know you, that's on them. Holding onto that, even acknowledging it, serves absolutely no positive purpose, and often only makes us bitter.

I'm proud of you guys (This Community) you can see things differently than the calguns.net folks who are very caught up in their inclusion of "Other Issues" when tempering their desire to discuss the political issues revolving around 2A/RTKBA.

I haven't spent much time over there, but that's really sad to hear. Other issues only serve to divide us and take our eye off the ball.

That is a noble idea and one that is probably worth pursuing, but I see (a) big problem(s) that needs to be addressed. The main being that even in this forum we can't agree on many aspects of laws, conduct, ect, open carry being one of the big ones. If we here can't even get together, how are we going to bring more people into the fold, let alone more liberals and/or progressives? Then if we can get them with us, how are we to get everyone on the same sheet of music? Specifically those who are willing to have or want more regulations on guns (which I believe to be 99% of liberals and/or progressives) as evidenced by the article you linked (emphasis mine).........

We can't even get our house in order now, I don't know how in the hell we would do it by adding people who are the polar opposites of most of us here. I would like all gun owners to be on the same page in reference to gun rights, but I'm at a loss for how to accomplish it. Hopefully someone smarter than me can figure it out and unify us.

We definitely need to get our house in order, to whichever extent that it's possible. The problem is that within every issue (gun rights) are many other, smaller, related issues (background checks, NFA items, open carry, etc.). Honestly, we're never going to be able to get on the same page there. Since they're 2A-related they absolutely pertain to our discussion, and always will. I think it'd be best to focus on the things that bring us together, then hold those up as the image we put forth. To unite we need to focus on the most broad bullet points which pertain to all types of gun owners, from Navy Seals to civil war re-enactors.

Though most of us believe in a strict interpretation of the 2A, if we lead our efforts on a campaign of legalizing machine guns, we'll never get anywhere.

Without the Media & 21st Century Pop Culture on our side, educating must be focused on keeping the choir involved & interested not the disbelievers...

Media and pop culture are a very difficult obstacle in this fight. I think the best card in our hand is the fact that it's still viewed as distant to the population. I've found that most of the people who eat up what the media sells are those who have a very generic group of people around them. If we focus on relationships with those around us, we're much closer, giving us more influence if the rapport is there.

In general it's a waste of time to preach to the choir or the die hard enemies. The best use of our efforts is to win as many to our position not necessarily to our party, in the hopes of pressuring all politicians, regardless of party, to protect, rather than attack, our 2A rights.

As for the media - they'll do what they want, but if we give them more fodder to use against us by acting like belligerent idiots (only some, not all do that) they will continue to run those stories. We need to stop writing those stories for them.

New Voters
There are young men and women who haven't even realized that it is time for them to shape their future as U.S. Citizens.

Nonparticipant

Get 2A supporters registered to vote in elections. Rallies, Shooting Events and Rights-Based Public Meetings should have a voters registration booth with information pertaining to current and proposed legislation.
They don't count if they don't vote.

Nonpartisan
Next work on those who are nonpartisans. They are registered and need the information to make an educated decision when they step in the booth. Promotional media should be professional, straight forward and free of scare tactics.

The Rest
Leave these people to the professionals. Your time and effort are too valuable to waste on these obstacles. Two hours of party bashing in the comment section of an Interweb news article does not further the cause.

Your time is valuable to all of us...please don't spend it dropping swords and shields on the field.

This right here should serve as the blueprint. Though, there should be a category between Nonpartisan and The Rest. In this category should be people you are close with, already have rapport with, who may even be anti-gun at this point. You probably already like each other for other reasons, and you don't have to spend time building rapport. This is my favorite group to pull from, and many times all it takes is a trip or two to the range :)

We know we're not going to convert Ginny Burdick. How do we know this? It wasn't by making an assumption or throwing a label on her. We know this because she's shown us and told us herself. These are the people we should be discounting, the real enemies, the people who label themselves anti-gun. People on here who say, might agree with background checks, those people are not a lost cause. We run them off and it's our loss.

And if you look at those events in an honest manner then you will see fear was used to promote self defense. Fear is a big seller and as I said I have never seen so much fear in the USA in my life.

It is to an extent, but I don't think owning a gun for protection is any different that having a fire extinguisher hand, wearing a seat belt, or buying insurance. We should focus on putting forth the notion that gun ownership for personal protection falls into this same category.

Well all education is run by the left and they are against guns. The media is run by the left and constantly is anti gun. So all you have left is the net and the net is all arguments not conducive to social change. I think to implement thinking you have to ask questions. If you want to change thinking you have to get into the strongholds of hate and just ask public questions that make people think.

The post that showed how to change a liberal by fear to a gun lover shows all it took was questions to make them think. If you wanted to start the world toward a better place start asking questions everywhere you go. Put them on bumper stickers and on the net. Send them to the media and e mails to the schools. Time to get people to think or the future is what?

I absolutely agree that education is the key.

An ex-girlfriend didn't know I carried until she saw it one day, at which point she ran upstairs sobbing (yes, seriously). I broke down my Glock and brought up just the frame, showing her that a gun is no more than a bunch of parts. I slowly brought in another piece and another piece, explaining, until the gun was assembled and in her (shaking) hand. Over the next few months she went from someone who was positively adamant that guns were bad to someone who urged me to buy her a PS90 for Christmas.

I also have a longtime friend who was vehemently anti-gun, to the point where I refused to discuss it with him on grounds of his ignorance. One night we were out with a group of buddies and challenged me to something (maybe a game of darts) with money on the line. I accepted on the grounds that rather than paying me if I won, he'd join myself and a couple others in the group on our range trip we had planned for the next day. The other guys started laughing, as no way would he agree to that. You could see his heart sink and his face turn red, but he knew he couldn't back down. I believe he just added a SCAR to his collection.

This isn't uncommon at all. Guns and cars are probably the most cool, fun, and useful items we can hope to obtain, and once people get past their ignorance, people generally love them.

Education, the media, the political party, those are all just entities made up of the people within them. Rather than go head to head with, or even waste our time speaking out against them, we need to stick with the plan of converting their 'low hanging fruit', which are only slightly leaning their way. Then we move onto the next layer, and the next layer, to the point that when MSNBC looks at their viewership for anti-gun segments, they wonder where all the people went.

To Abandon the Progressive Democrat Ideals for a single issue ?

The Bill of Rights is non-partisan, one political party just decided to take a stance against one of the amendments. The Second Amendment is non-partisan, and the longer we associate anti-gun with everyone who votes Democrat, the more damage you do to the pro-gun movement. The party isn't our focus, nor are anti-gun organizations, such as the media. We're focusing on people here.
 
If you want to know most about the people you talk with look to their fears and how they overcome them. Fear is the biggest motivator in life so the question is this, what do Democrat and Republican politicians fear the most? Understanding their fear will help you overcome your own.
 
I was a relatively center left guns are icky kind of guy until I stayed in a communist country and experienced the true lack of freedom. But that wasn't the biggest shocker for me.. the biggest shocker for me that I was responsible for my own life and setup was when I was carjacked at gun point when I was living in Los Angeles. A revolver pointed at your face from a sweaty black teenager who wanted my truck and wallet was the pivotal moment in my life where I firmly decided.... never again.... never in a million year lifetime.
I think more people need to experience the loss of freedom and become a victim of crime to trully understand what is at stake. There trully isn't any other way than personal traumatic experience.

sorry folks....
 
Funny, I started concealed carrying every day the day after I was robbed at shotgun-point while working in the LA area (Torrance to be exact) in 1980. Since that time I have drawn my weapon many times to stop a crime in progress (thank God I don't have to spend quality time in LA anymore).

These life experiences lend credibility when talking about my notion of protecting myself and are a stark reality in this day and age. It also gets a very visible reaction from whoever I'm talking to since many of them have trouble translating the abstract concepts of gun ownership with self-protection in reality.

Nothing beats a real world example.
 
Two stories that show how fear motivates a person to become self reliant^^^^

The fear has been so amped up in this country that it should change the way people vote.
 
I was a relatively center left guns are icky kind of guy until I stayed in a communist country and experienced the true lack of freedom. But that wasn't the biggest shocker for me.. the biggest shocker for me that I was responsible for my own life and setup was when I was carjacked at gun point when I was living in Los Angeles. A revolver pointed at your face from a sweaty black teenager who wanted my truck and wallet was the pivotal moment in my life where I firmly decided.... never again.... never in a million year lifetime.
I think more people need to experience the loss of freedom and become a victim of crime to trully understand what is at stake. There trully isn't any other way than personal traumatic experience.

sorry folks....
My long-time LEO dad used to say "a liberal is conservative who has yet to be victimized"
Sounds like your story backs up his perspective.
 
Yeah , amped up to give up freedom for security ...

If the politicians had the ability to keep people safe then what you say could happen. It won't for several reasons, first they created hate and fear of those who are supposed to give us security the cops. No way will people put down their arms when there is no trust in those who should protect us.

Second they stirred up racial tensions to riots with no promises to protect people. They let the riots happen and even brought in the race baiters to push it along. People watched as average people lost homes,businesses and lives. Guns were bought because of that, not given up.

And last we have a weak president that does nothing about terrorism while we watch man burnings and beheadings. No way people will give up their guns now. If anything they are buying more.
 
They ( Folks not up to speed on the constitution) could vote in Gungrabbers promising the moon ( Safety through sensible Firearms Restrictions...:eek:

But where has that ever worked? Some European countries have a million rapes a year, and the most gun control.
 
I was a relatively center left guns are icky kind of guy until I stayed in a communist country and experienced the true lack of freedom. But that wasn't the biggest shocker for me.. the biggest shocker for me that I was responsible for my own life and setup was when I was carjacked at gun point when I was living in Los Angeles. A revolver pointed at your face from a sweaty black teenager who wanted my truck and wallet was the pivotal moment in my life where I firmly decided.... never again.... never in a million year lifetime.
I think more people need to experience the loss of freedom and become a victim of crime to trully understand what is at stake. There trully isn't any other way than personal traumatic experience.

sorry folks....
Funny, I started concealed carrying every day the day after I was robbed at shotgun-point while working in the LA area (Torrance to be exact) in 1980. Since that time I have drawn my weapon many times to stop a crime in progress (thank God I don't have to spend quality time in LA anymore).

These life experiences lend credibility when talking about my notion of protecting myself and are a stark reality in this day and age. It also gets a very visible reaction from whoever I'm talking to since many of them have trouble translating the abstract concepts of gun ownership with self-protection in reality.

Nothing beats a real world example.


You can't have peace until you know suffering.
 

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