it keeps getting dumber... more attempts at gun control.

[Stomper]

WHOA, I (being the OP of this thread), had nothing to say about drugs. I just want to talk about guns.

OK, ok, ok... how about a special zip-gun that shoots marywannie darts into the bums of hotties standing close to wading pools full of jello and tapioca?

 

[Partsproduction]

WHOA, I (being the OP of this thread), had nothing to say about drugs. I just want to talk about guns.

Maybe I misunderstood what you were saying when you said;

because are fueling the violence in Mexico, what a joke.

 

[gehrheart]

Answer me this, If I planted a marijuana seed in the ground, harvested it and smoked it, who did I harm?

As I see it, to your self, yes. To society? no.

Guess I will take a stance here. I have never smoked it. Never will. No interest at all. ( **** the smell alone is bad enough)

I do have a drink, like a good beer, shot of fine scotch. Never to the point where I am not in control.

I do not believe in big brother. I do not believe in overbearing Federal Government. They have no more right to tell me what I can say as they can what I put into my body.

I think it's good to have SOME (emphasis) oversight, monitor industry, our food ect. However that oversight is goes away in ones home. Some argue that when one becomes "addicted" to pot they have no useful input into society. Quit working and live off well fair. I have the problem that is welfare, by itself needs to go. If you want to smoke pot all day and not be productive, fine. I am NOT going to pay for it. Nor do I believe our government has the right to take MY money and give it to some one else.
That is not a drug problem.


Our "drug problem" doesn't stem from drugs or from a "drug culture".

It stems from our cancer that grows from within our great society. From FDR we have allowed Americans to be lazy and earn a living doing it.
Our problems stem from a government all to eager to interfere, to. um, make our life's easier. To babysit us.

To heck with that and these silly wars amongst us. I see a constitution written and given to us that forms the best form of government this earth has seen to date. We as a people have being doing our damn-est to ruin that.
We have a right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness. Not having big brother hold my hand and tell me how I can be happy while emptying my pockets to give to another who doesn't want to earn it.

Limits to apply of course, now I will the argument how jonny-boy can't feed his family or pay the rent because he is to busy smoking pot. News flash, LAZY people are just LAZY no matter how much or little pot they have. If gubmint would get out of MY pockets and quit giving MY money that I worked for to him, well guess he will have to work or just die away. We have created this problem. The more excuses we give it the harder it is to fix it. Remember it has only gotten worse since we banned it in the first place.

I hate the crap.

Can't stand the smell.

Think the whole thing it stupid to even use.


this whole banter back and forth over others telling me what is best for me, that is even worse.

I eat what I want. I drink what I want. Pray the way I want. shoot the way I want and in general life my life the way I want and I have the god given right to do so as given to us by the forefathers of this great REPUBLIC,and no government slacker-living -off-my-dime type is going to tell me other wise.

 

[gehrheart]

Maybe I misunderstood what you were saying when you said;

Because by and large it is not our gun coming from America that is being used in the violence in Mex. Most of the gun used are from there own military.

 

[gehrheart]

WHOA, I (being the OP of this thread), had nothing to say about drugs. I just want to talk about guns.

And what am I diverting? or shifting?

 

[gehrheart]

OK, ok, ok... how about a special zip-gun that shoots marywannie darts into the bums of hotties standing close to wading pools full of jello and tapioca?

:buttrock:

 

[Partsproduction]

So people dying as a result of drug trade = bad? people dying as a result of petroleum trade = good? I wonder what the dead people would say about your theory that their death as a result of oil is more noble? (providing the dead could talk of course.)

If I'm not doing anything wrong and my doing a legal activity results in others fighting and killing each other over how I spend my money, then I bear absolutely no responsibility for the deaths.

If I'm doing something illegal then I share in the responsibility, but the police who are trying to stop my illegal activity have absolutely no responsibility for the murders. You guys are trying to put the blame on law enforcement, stating that we should change the law so criminals won't kill each other. Twisted thinking in my book.

Guns, however, share no responsibility for any of it, nor do those who make and sell them, unless they make and sell them for that purpose (They don't).

We are going to lose some of our rights to keep and bear arms because some people think they should have a special right to do an illegal activity.

Is it possible that shortly after pot is legalized that heroin and cocaine will be legalized?
The simple and short answer is, no, I do not wish to see Heroin, Cocaine or any hard drugs legalized.

Doesn't matter what you think friend, it will start soon after pot is legalized, the "war on drugs" is also about heroin and meth. The same "logic" you are using to legalize pot will be used to legalize heroin and all other drugs, like it or not, "If we legalize crank (Heroin, cocaine etc.) the cartels will not have anything to fight over". Frankly I don't see much difference between pot and any of the others.

that a pot head can be irresponsible does not make smoking pot irresponsible,

So, breaking the law is not irresponsible in your book. Hmm, weird.

Whose version of morality are you speaking of?

What version do you use, it says that intentionally breaking the law is OK?

So, again, what about rape? Why not legalize rape? Murder?

Where will it end?
Now who is using diversion?

It's a straight up question, since you claim that having laws against one thing causes bad results then it follows that laws against other crimes causes bad results.

And therein is the heart of my anger in all this. People are saying that because "I" want to smoke pot there shouldn't be a law against it. It's law based on what others do that I don't do, those laws are OK. But any law against something I like, that's bad. Some people like to snuff teen aged girls for crying out loud!
Pot smoking is not a victimless crime any more than shooting heroin is, they both lead to self destruction. I guess I can see where some of this comes from, in Oregon suicide is legal. But wrong is wrong, a change in the law doesn't change that.

 

[Partsproduction]

now I will the argument how jonny-boy can't feed his family or pay the rent because he is to busy smoking pot. News flash, LAZY people are just LAZY no matter how much or little pot they have.

That's not been my observation, people who were productive become zombies after years of smoking pot. For some reason it seems to alter the self actualization urge we are born with.

 

[Chee-to]

Whose version of morality are you speaking of ? I just don't find thou shalt not toke in the 10 commandments.

:cigar:

 

[Partsproduction]

Because using illegal drugs is exactly the same as rape

Are you serious? Are you sure you weren't high when you wrote that

My point is that since rape and murder continue to haunt our society even though we have had a war on rape and murder from the beginning, and that even though we don't seem to be "winning" that war either should we stop charging people for those crimes? That's part of the "logic" of the legalize pot crowd, we haven't won the war so we should stop trying. To me the fact that we are not winning means we need to try harder.

And I'll say it again, prohibition worked so well, didn't it?

So we should add another drug to alcohol? The pain we suffer from alcohol isn't enough? Why not make all crimes legal, the crime rate drops to zero overnight.

 

[Trlsmn]

If I'm not doing anything wrong and my doing a legal activity results in others fighting and killing each other over how I spend my money, then I bear absolutely no responsibility for the deaths.

If I'm doing something illegal then I share in the responsibility, but the police who are trying to stop my illegal activity have absolutely no responsibility for the murders. You guys are trying to put the blame on law enforcement, stating that we should change the law so criminals won't kill each other. Twisted thinking in my book.

Guns, however, share no responsibility for any of it, nor do those who make and sell them, unless they make and sell them for that purpose (They don't).

We are going to lose some of our rights to keep and bear arms because some people think they should have a special right to do an illegal activity.



Doesn't matter what you think friend, it will start soon after pot is legalized, the "war on drugs" is also about heroin and meth. The same "logic" you are using to legalize pot will be used to legalize heroin and all other drugs, like it or not, "If we legalize crank (Heroin, cocaine etc.) the cartels will not have anything to fight over". Frankly I don't see much difference between pot and any of the others.



So, breaking the law is not irresponsible in your book. Hmm, weird.



What version do you use, it says that intentionally breaking the law is OK?



It's a straight up question, since you claim that having laws against one thing causes bad results then it follows that laws against other crimes causes bad results.

And therein is the heart of my anger in all this. People are saying that because "I" want to smoke pot there shouldn't be a law against it. It's law based on what others do that I don't do, those laws are OK. But any law against something I like, that's bad. Some people like to snuff teen aged girls for crying out loud!
Pot smoking is not a victimless crime any more than shooting heroin is, they both lead to self destruction. I guess I can see where some of this comes from, in Oregon suicide is legal. But wrong is wrong, a change in the law doesn't change that.

You equate breaking the law with immorality, history has shown that to be fundamentally flawed, by that standard slavery was a moral action at one time.

Since I am not a pot smoker but I can look at the situation objectively and still advocate for the legalization of marijuana it kind of nullifies your argument of:

"I" want to smoke pot there shouldn't be a law against it."

 

[Partsproduction]

Because by and large it is not our gun coming from America that is being used in the violence in Mex. Most of the gun used are from there own military.

Agreed. I would add that it doesn't make any difference anyway where the guns come from, we should not alter our laws because police in another country can't run it right. We who enjoy our guns are sensitive to the notion that inanimate items don't kill anyone.

 

[Partsproduction]

You equate breaking the law with immorality, history has shown that to be fundamentally flawed, by that standard slavery was a moral action at one time.

Actually I don't say that following immoral laws makes one moral, if we make pot legal it will still be wrong to abuse it. In hitler's Germany it was legal to murder Jews, in our own society the law says a woman can murder her unborn child. Wrong things cannot be made right by changing the laws.

But in general most people feel that lawbreakers are immoral people.

This whole discussion is very distasteful to me, how many people are saying that the answer to a problem is to make an illegal activity legal is frightening. I really do believe that morality is in serious decline.

So, someone who believes that laws are good is an outcast now.

 

[Partsproduction]

Since I am not a pot smoker but I can look at the situation objectively and still advocate for the legalization of marijuana it kind of nullifies your argument of:

Quote:
"I" want to smoke pot there shouldn't be a law against it."

A new version of logic? I didn't say you smoke pot. I said that's where the idea comes from. If I want to steal then laws against theft are bad. :huh:

 

[bnsaibum]

Agreed. I would add that it doesn't make any difference anyway where the guns come from, we should not alter our laws because police in another country can't run it right. We who enjoy our guns are sensitive to the notion that inanimate items don't kill anyone.

+1

 

[Stomper]

Look... go and smoke, toke, swallow, shoot-up, and snort, whatever you want however you want, and how much you want, but when you are strung out, can't hold a job, abuse your family, your kids, your pets, lose your house and are on the street, don't expect the PUBLIC to give you ANYTHING to "rehab" you... turn to crime, get your arse shot to hades... Constitutional and SIMPLE!!

 

[gehrheart]

That's not been my observation, people who were productive become zombies after years of smoking pot. For some reason it seems to alter the self actualization urge we are born with.

yep I can agree to that as well. No way to argue that. however my point is a little beyond that.

People choose to be lazy. If they start smoking pot, then become lazy it was still by their CHOICE. They choose to be lazy regardless if they started that way or ended up their. It's beyond drugs. A person doesn't need to be on drugs to become lazy or be lazy.

Choice.


I don't want to pay any more for their choice.

I don't want big brother.



I do not need or want the gubmint telling me how I am free, but not really.

 

[gehrheart]

Look... go and smoke, toke, swallow, shoot-up, and snort, whatever you want however you want, and how much you want, but when you are strung out, can't hold a job, abuse your family, your kids, your pets, lose your house and are on the street, don't expect the PUBLIC to give you ANYTHING to "rehab" you... turn to crime, get your arse shot to hades... Constitutional and SIMPLE!!

That is what I was trying to get to, just used to many words.

 

[gehrheart]

This whole discussion is very distasteful to me, how many people are saying that the answer to a problem is to make an illegal activity legal is frightening. I really do believe that morality is in serious decline.

So, someone who believes that laws are good is an outcast now.

I certainly am not advocating we change the laws because another bordering county can't control their own. And please, at least in my case, believe that I am calling drug use, legal or not a moral act, (as I do believe drug use leads to immoral behavior.) I'm am simply stating that the, no were in our constitution is there a provision for federal government to control our morals or to create laws based on what is moral. That is not the job of the federal government. That is my case. I just do not want big brother.
Like wise, I truly believe the government has no right to tell what kind of gun I can or can't have.

Yes, this country is in moral decline. No argument their. It's not because of drugs. It goes far beyond that.

 

[Trlsmn]

Actually I don't say that following immoral laws makes one moral, if we make pot legal it will still be wrong to abuse it. In hitler's Germany it was legal to murder Jews, in our own society the law says a woman can murder her unborn child. Wrong things cannot be made right by changing the laws.

But in general most people feel that lawbreakers are immoral people.

This whole discussion is very distasteful to me, how many people are saying that the answer to a problem is to make an illegal activity legal is frightening. I really do believe that morality is in serious decline.

So, someone who believes that laws are good is an outcast now.

Ah but who gets to be the decider of what laws are moral? I understand your point, I have two kids that I don't want to go near drugs and I am more than willing to deprive them of their rights to do so if need be.

As for the outcast part I don't consider you or your views as outcast just someone with his own opinion that differs from mine, discussion is what we do here, it need not be angry or a condemnation, sometimes it is simply a discussion. As I like to say, if we all agreed about everything we would soon find that we are talking to ourselves.