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Interesting "Solvent trap" on eBay

Discussion in 'General Firearm Discussion' started by IronMonster, Oct 18, 2014.

  1. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    mjbskwim likes this.
  2. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    A what trap?
     
  3. Riot

    Riot Benton County, Washington Well-Known Member

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    They call them "solvent traps". The concept is, is that when you are cleaning your firearm, you attach one of these bolts on a threaded barrel that is the correct adapter to place a car oil filter over the end of your firearm to "collect solvent".

    Since an oil filter is a cheap firearm suppressor...well, you get the idea.
     
  4. The Heretic

    The Heretic Oregon Well-Known Member

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  5. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Look on YouTube and see how they supposedly work.
     
  6. erudne

    erudne The Pie Matrix PPL Say Sleeping W/Your Rifle Is A bad Thing? Bronze Supporter

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    this is not an adaptor, it is a long aluminum tube marked "front towards enemy" and will only screw on to a specific mount, looks like it was stolen from the factory or airsoft as it is AL
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2014
  7. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Or stolen from the military.
     
  8. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    I dont think so, I dont know what the deal is but if it was intended to be a suppressor the engraving would have included a model number and caliber designation. It seems really strange to me that all the other engraving would be there but the identifying marks left off. I think its more likely a China built fake suppressor. He has sold more than one ( someone has left feedback for one other) Maybe they where prototypes that never intended to be finished into suppressors? I dont know, but it is weird.
     
  9. erudne

    erudne The Pie Matrix PPL Say Sleeping W/Your Rifle Is A bad Thing? Bronze Supporter

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    FWIW the ATF classifies them as suppressors
    button-silencer_556sd.jpg

    http://www.advanced-armament.com/556mm-Rifle_c_17.html

    can-mini4-3.jpg&maxx=90&maxy=60

    The Mini4 is the result of a request for an ultra-compact can for 5.56mm rifles and carbines. The Mini4 features the same fully welded all-Inconel® guts as our M4-2000. With an overall weight of 13.5 ounces and adding less than 3 inches to the overall length of the host weapon, it is easy to disregard the Mini4 until the shooting starts. Despite its compact dimensions, the Mini4 reduces the muzzle signature below the 140 decibel threshold at the shooter’s ear on 14.5” and longer barrels and dramatically reduces visible flash.

    spacer.gif
    MSRP:
    $895.00
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2014
  10. BlindedByScience

    BlindedByScience Vancouver WA Well-Known Member

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    "....Because of this, many have speculated that the idea of using this product as a Solvent Trap is just a cover up for illegal uses, when in reality, the evidence points to this product being for cleaning purposes...."

    Yeah. Sure. I know when I'm trying to contain solvent, I use a trap with a hole in both ends. Got it.

    I'm all for removing suppressors from the whole NFA system, but this looks like a great way to get in deep with the BATFE. And, those guys have no sense of humor, whatsoever.
     
    PDXSparky and erudne like this.
  11. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    Excatlly, if you look at the close ups on AAC's page you will see the markings I am talking about.
     
  12. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Maybe that scratch near the release button made it a rejected part at AAC and someone boosted it out of the
    factory.
     
  13. Modeler

    Modeler Molalla, Oregon Soccer Fan

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  14. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Here's what I see if you buy one of these and convert it as they kinda, but not "wink wink" hint what it could be used for.
    In(Solvent) because of the all the lawyer fees trying to keep you out of Federal prison.
    (Trap)ped for over ten years with someone other then your wife/girlfriend, but still having an active sex life.
     
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  15. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    Yep, seems like a all around bad idea. There must be lots of people doing it, looks like there are several folks making parts. I value my freedom. A grand for a legal & registered can seems like a bargain compared to a felony charge
     
  16. The Heretic

    The Heretic Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I think this comes under the same domain as the SIG "arm brace".

    If used as "intended", as a solvent trap, then I would assume it would be legal. Maybe a bad assumption.

    If you drill the hole in the end cap, it then becomes for all effects and purposes, a suppressor. As long as you don't do that, you would be fine.

    However, the fact that they don't have or supply an ATF letter would worry me. "Talking to an agent" doesn't mean anything. Without that letter (like SIG has) such opinions are just hearsay and are not a valid defense in court.

    That said, having the adapters themselves is probably safe. Having the rest of the parts, with holes drilled, that could be construed as "constructive intent".

    Think of it this way - fake silencers are not illegal - yet they could be made into a suppressor easily enough. They are essentially the same as these "solvent traps".

    Would I like a suppressor?

    Sure. But I am not willing to step over that line in the sand to put myself on a list with the ATF and a bunch of other government agencies as having one and thereby ratcheting myself up higher on a list of "threats" or otherwise give them an excuse to come knocking on my door. The likelihood of that happening? Not much. But it is just a line I won't cross. YMMV.

    However, if SHTF where rule of law was absent, I sure would like the ability and parts necessary to quickly assemble a suppressor with a few minutes work on a drill press. I think in that case a suppressor would come in handy.
     
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  17. bolus

    bolus Portland Gold Supporter Gold Supporter 2015 Volunteer 2016 Volunteer

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    jeez, just buy a suppressor.

    It would make more sense if they marketed it as a gun light

    "no mr ATF, that isnt a suppressor, its my maglite gun light. It has this cool strobe effect when you pull the trigger in rapid succession."
     
  18. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    I dont think the Sig arm brace is a good comparison. There is no way to make it into anything illegal. It is what it is and you can use it any way you like and it does not change the classification of the weapon being a pistol. I own two of these and spent a lot of time reading everything there was to read. If I did not feel 100% that it was safe too own these they would not be in my safe. My only worry is I own two AR pistols and maybe 10 AR rifles and have a pile of assembled and assembled lowers. I make damn sure that the pistol uppers are always on a lower with a pistol tube and I even marked the pistol lowers with a stamped "pistol"

    I want no gray area. I want to do everything 100% on the up and up and there be no way to construe anything I have as questionable. In my opinion the last thing you want to do have anything they could construe as intent. Is it legal for you to buy M16 full auto trigger groups? Can you have a "solvent trap" or fake suppressor"? I am sure its "legal" by definition, does not change the fact that the FED's can make a case against you if you have them. If for some reason they ever did a search of my collection of bits, I want zero items to turn up that could even be questioned.
     
  19. The Heretic

    The Heretic Oregon Well-Known Member

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    Let me put it this way.

    A cylinder on the end of a firearm barrel with a hole in the end of it is not a suppressor unless it actually suppresses the sound signature of the firearm to a measurable degree - or:

    http://www.atf.gov/content/firearms/firearms-industry/guides/gun-control-act-definition-silencer

    "any part intended only for use in such assembly or fabrication"

    I have a VW Beetle exhaust tip. I have several oil filters. Each of these could conceivably be used as an ad-hoc suppressor for a firearm with the right adapter. Ditto with pop bottles. I have a banged up Maglite out in my shop. I could go buy some freeze plugs. Are any of these illegal if I don't put them on a firearm?

    If I have a "solvent trap" and I actually use it for that purpose and not as a suppressor, I would assert that it isn't a suppressor - especially if there is no hole drilled in the end cap.

    I have an Ishapore Enfield with a "jungle carbine" flash suppressor on the end. It is essentially a cylinder with a hole in the end. It does not suppress sound. Is it illegal?

    No.
     
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  20. The Heretic

    The Heretic Oregon Well-Known Member

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    But yes - until there is an ATF letter on the issue of solvent traps, I would consider it to be a gray area to be avoided until such time as a letter is published.

    Close, but not quite (read the very last paragraph from the ATF):

    http://johnpierceesq.com/?p=667