Idiot

[BillB1960]

You watch too many movies...I open carry anytime it is not so cold I must wear a coat. I don't "swager" down the street. I am an old retired businessman, I am no cop, never tried or wanted to be a cop.

Talking about cops, most of the open carry their weapons...no-one gets out of joint because they do. There is absolutely no reason that a private citizen cannot do the same. Criminals hide their weapons because they want the "element of surprise" when they go to use them illegally. The FBI did a study that confirmed that, people with criminal intent never carry their arms openly, and rarely use a holster.

So, who would you rather emulate...the cops? or the robbers?

Yep we've had this discussion before and you didn't make much sense then either. Times have changed and some people haven't changed with them.

Either way carrying an AR into a department store doesn't qualify as emulating anything but an idiot to me and frankly I have no desire to live in a society that was used to seeing people walking around in public with rifles slung over their shoulders.

 

[hermannr]

Yep we've had this discussion before and you didn't make much sense then either. Times have changed and some people haven't changed with them.

Either way carrying an AR into a department store doesn't qualify as emulating anything but an idiot to me and frankly I have no desire to live in a society that was used to seeing people walking around in public with rifles slung over their shoulders.

Then you do not believe the US 2A or the Oregon state Article 1 section 27 or the Washington state Article 1 section 24 mean anything? You are no different than the Brady bunch, it's good for me, the way I think it should be done, but not anyone else and the way they may prefer? Is that it?

The problem is, there are too many people that think like you...that is exactly why we have restrictive gun laws...they do not make one difference, but you MUST do it MY way...do you really think a criminal care what YOUR way may be????

 

[BillB1960]

Then you do not believe the US 2A or the Oregon state Article 1 section 27 or the Washington state Article 1 section 24 mean anything? You are no different than the Brady bunch, it's good for me, the way I think it should be done, but not anyone else and the way they may prefer? Is that it?

The problem is, there are too many people that think like you...that is exactly why we have restrictive gun laws...they do not make one difference, but you MUST do it MY way...do you really think a criminal care what YOUR way may be????

You still haven't come up with a cogent reason for anyone to be carrying a AR into a department store. You can rail against me all you want and accuse me of not supporting the 2A, which is a lie, but you still can't come up with a better excuse than, "because I can" and that's just plain stupid for all the reasons I've already mentioned.

You want to OC with a pistol strapped to your hip...fine, go for it. I don't agree with that method of carry but at least it has a legitimate purpose. Carrying an AR into Fred Meyer had no purpose other than to scare the crap out of people and try to provoke a confrontation. I really don't think that helps put intelligent, responsible gun owners in a good light. It ends up painting us as a bunch of gun fanatics with poor judgement. We don't need that kind of publicity right now or ever for that matter.

 

[Member 3687]

Why do I need to carry a rifle well my wife might say I have small genitals and a short mans attitude and it is my way of feeling like a man and she could be right we have been married a very long time.

It could be to piss off people like you and the Piers Morgan crowd who needs justification for everything and can’t seem to understand that a right does not require a need to be justified. I can tell it is working by your comments on this subject.

I guess what it comes down to is that I have a right to carry openly for the entire world to see and I sometimes feel the need to exercise that right. A right does not require a need or justification because it is a right.

I am sorry if it does not make you or others happy but I was not put on this earth for that purpose. I am sorry if you and others feel it gives gun owners a bad name because I do not.

BillB1960
I really don't think that helps put intelligent, responsible gun owners in a good light. It ends up painting us as a bunch of gun fanatics with poor judgment. We don't need that kind of publicity right now or ever for that matter.

I am also sorry you feel that your personal opinion is the only intelligent, responsible one there is because in my opinion, it is because of people like you we keep losing our freedoms.

Isn’t the First Amendment cool we both get to state our points of view even if sometime heated and you know what’s even better we still have the Second Amendment to keep it and all others intact.

Below is the definition of a right and nowhere in this definition is there to be found anything requiring a need for it to be justified.

right 1) n. an entitlement to something, whether to concepts like justice and due process, or to ownership of property or some interest in property, real or personal. These rights include various freedoms, protection against interference with enjoyment of life and property, civil rights enjoyed by citizens such as voting and access to the courts, natural rights accepted by civilized societies, human rights to protect people throughout the world from terror, torture, barbaric practices and deprivation of civil rights and profit from their labor, and such American constitutional guarantees as the right to freedoms of speech, press, religion, assembly and petition. 2) adj. just, fair, correct. (See: civil rights, marital rights)

 

[BillB1960]

Why do I need to carry a rifle well my wife might say I have small genitals and a short mans attitude and it is my way of feeling like a man and she could be right we have been married a very long time.

It could be to piss off people like you and the Piers Morgan crowd who needs justification for everything and can't seem to understand that a right does not require a need to be justified. I can tell it is working by your comments on this subject.

I guess what it comes down to is that I have a right to carry openly for the entire world to see and I sometimes feel the need to exercise that right. A right does not require a need or justification because it is a right.

I am sorry if it does not make you or others happy but I was not put on this earth for that purpose. I am sorry if you and others feel it gives gun owners a bad name because I do not.



I am also sorry you feel that your personal opinion is the only intelligent, responsible one there is because in my opinion, it is because of people like you we keep losing our freedoms.

Isn't the First Amendment cool we both get to state our points of view even if sometime heated and you know what's even better we still have the Second Amendment to keep it and all others intact.

Below is the definition of a right and nowhere in this definition is there to be found anything requiring a need for it to be justified.

right 1) n. an entitlement to something, whether to concepts like justice and due process, or to ownership of property or some interest in property, real or personal. These rights include various freedoms, protection against interference with enjoyment of life and property, civil rights enjoyed by citizens such as voting and access to the courts, natural rights accepted by civilized societies, human rights to protect people throughout the world from terror, torture, barbaric practices and deprivation of civil rights and profit from their labor, and such American constitutional guarantees as the right to freedoms of speech, press, religion, assembly and petition. 2) adj. just, fair, correct. (See: civil rights, marital rights)

All that babbling and still the best you can come up with is: "because I can". Kinda sad really. We've got the government and the main stream media licking their chops to shoot us down and people like you and that idiot who took his AR to Fred Meyer just because he could keep handing them ammunition.

This fight isn't going to be won or lost in the courts or the capitols, it's going to be won or lost in the court of public opinion. Public opinion that's shaped by the MSM and fueled with stories of the bad things people do with guns. Bad things like walking around in public with 'scary black rifles' saying, "I'm exercising my right under the 2nd Amendment" while soccer moms are calling 911 and rushing their kids out to the minivan. Guess who won that round? I'll give you a hint, it wasn't the guy carrying the rifle.

 

[davemata]

Can you give me any legitimate reason that you need a "tool for killing" other than self-defense, or potentially hunting?

Neat thing about a right bro, I don't have to give you anything. As for your opinions on the 2A, where did you get your Constitutional Law education? I'm currently shopping law schools.

 

[davemata]

I can think of other reasons, I kind of like target shooting and just plinking. Hunting and self defense are not the only reason to own them.

You don't have to play his silly game. It's the game of the gun-controllers.

 

[hermannr]

All that babbling and still the best you can come up with is: "because I can". Kinda sad really. We've got the government and the main stream media licking their chops to shoot us down and people like you and that idiot who took his AR to Fred Meyer just because he could keep handing them ammunition.

This fight isn't going to be won or lost in the courts or the capitols, it's going to be won or lost in the court of public opinion. Public opinion that's shaped by the MSM and fueled with stories of the bad things people do with guns. Bad things like walking around in public with 'scary black rifles' saying, "I'm exercising my right under the 2nd Amendment" while soccer moms are calling 911 and rushing their kids out to the minivan. Guess who won that round? I'll give you a hint, it wasn't the guy carrying the rifle.

So, not only do you not like the second amendment, you don't care for the first either?

As for the "scary" black rifle, it is only scary because it is an unknown quantity. There are a lot of people in this country that do not understand a lot of things, are because they do not understand, they have fear of them. I cannot control their fear, but I can educate them to the law.

As for the guy that you think lost, well, he may have lost a round, but in all good fights, there are many rounds, and who wins the fight is what counts. That particular jurisdictioon may end up paying for him to go through law school so he can help other people that are fighting for their rights... because of the illegal act of some of their officers, "under the color of law".

 

[davemata]

So, not only do you not like the second amendment, you don't care for the first either?

Remember, never trust or be surprised by the poor actions of someone who makes a statement like this:

I fully support and believe in the 2nd Amendment, owning a military style semi auto, learning how to use it and practicing with it.

Because you know that what follows is going to be a load of crap, and that they're saying that because they're trying to fake you out. What's coming out of them next is going to be some assinine argument against that what they say they support.

 

[BadMotel]

Because you know that what follows is going to be a load of crap, and that they're saying that because they're trying to fake you out. What's coming out of them next is going to be some assinine argument against that what they say they support.

So, people can only support things your way?

 

[hermannr]

Remember, never trust or be surprised by the poor actions of someone who makes a statement like this:


Because you know that what follows is going to be a load of crap, and that they're saying that because they're trying to fake you out. What's coming out of them next is going to be some assinine argument against that what they say they support.

Ye, that is exactly what Sen Can(do it)well put in her form letter.

 

[Blaylocke]

So many secret shame, sheeple, Piers Morgan, Anti-OCer, Anti-2A people around here. If you support the 2nd amendment, you should be mandated to carry a locked and loaded rifle while picking up your groceries. How else but by carrying a rifle through the checkstand will these people learn that everyone who carries a rifle is a responsible gun owner?

 

[hermannr]

So, people can only support things your way?

No, you do not have to do it "my way". I have no need to force or belittle, or call anyone names that does not see life as I do.

However, I also do not want someone to try to force me to see life the way they do. As long as they to not try force their way of thinking on everyone else, they can think anyway they want...not a problem.

You might want to read this: The Seven Varieties of Gun Control Advocate

 

[BillB1960]

So, not only do you not like the second amendment, you don't care for the first either?

As for the "scary" black rifle, it is only scary because it is an unknown quantity. There are a lot of people in this country that do not understand a lot of things, are because they do not understand, they have fear of them. I cannot control their fear, but I can educate them to the law.

As for the guy that you think lost, well, he may have lost a round, but in all good fights, there are many rounds, and who wins the fight is what counts. That particular jurisdictioon may end up paying for him to go through law school so he can help other people that are fighting for their rights... because of the illegal act of some of their officers, "under the color of law".

Try not putting words in my mouth and actually answer the question I've been asking you and all the rest of the "we can do whatever we want whenever we want" cowboys. Why do you need to carry an AR into a department store?

You and the others can't point to 1 single instance where I've not come down in favor of the 2nd Amendment or the 1st for that matter but you accuse me of both. Show me a quote.

All I'm saying is that using good judgement especially in times like these goes a lot further than giving the finger to the general public calling them "sheep" and telling them they have to get used to it. If you can't figure out that you're part of the problem not the solution then I don't want you on my side at all.

 

[BillB1960]

No, you do not have to do it "my way". I have no need to force or belittle, or call anyone names that does not see life as I do.

However, I also do not want someone to try to force me to see life the way they do. As long as they to not try force their way of thinking on everyone else, they can think anyway they want...not a problem.

You might want to read this: The Seven Varieties of Gun Control Advocate

You need to keep your stories straight herman. It was just a few posts back you were calling people "sheep" and saying that "the people and LE need to learn to live with it". Those were your words and now here you are saying "you don't have to do it my way". Seems like calling people "sheep" is a fairly belittling term to me as well. So the bottom line here is that you do expect people to see things you way and anyone that doesn't somehow doesn't support the 2nd Amendment. You certainly are a piece of work cowboy, I think the Indians used to call it 'speaking with forked tongue'.

 

[BillB1960]

Remember, never trust or be surprised by the poor actions of someone who makes a statement like this:


Because you know that what follows is going to be a load of crap, and that they're saying that because they're trying to fake you out. What's coming out of them next is going to be some assinine argument against that what they say they support.

Again, show me a quote where I have not supported the 2nd Amendment. I never said you couldn't carry your AR into a department store, what I said was it's a stupid thing to do and if idiots keep doing it then we won't have to worry about it anymore because there won't be any ARs to carry anywhere.

 

[Member 3687]

Just like Viet Nam we will win their hearts and minds. I hate to tell you but that did not work out real well.

Well how about the need to protect my self because according the Supreme Court police do not have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone. Yes many of them will and do but they do not have to.

Justices Rule Police Do Not Have a Constitutional Duty to Protect Someone
http://www.nytimes.com/2005/06/28/politics/28scotus.html?_r=1&


How about the 92 LA riots who stopped looters and vandals from destroying Korean town it was not the cops it was the people with both hand guns and semi auto rifles (AR 15s) until the national guard backed them up.

92 LA riots
1992 Los Angeles riots - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Then let’s look at the budget cuts across the US as city tax revenues are depleted so are the services like police and fire (because are economy is doing so well). Recently a Wisconsin Sheriff and if I remember right less than a couple years back a Seattle areas sheriff came out telling folks to arm them selves as they can no longer respond to calls in a timely manner. It is a fact that they can not be every place at once. It is up to you to know the law and defend your self.

If they could be every where then Virginia tech, Columbine and Sandy Hook could not have happen but they did. The cops, FBI and DHS did not show up with their assault weapons until after the fact a lot of good that did.

Wisconsin Sheriff
Wisconsin sheriff's warning: Arm yourself, we might not get there in time - CSMonitor.com

I have a canceled permit in 2 states but in the summer time I do not want to put on a jacket so I open carry and have done so for more than 20years. It is a right in my state and I do not have to show a need to exercise it. My military and civilian training has taught me that a hand gun is used to get you to a rifle so why waste the time with a hand gun and not just carry a rifle and from time to time I do (an AK not an AR though).

I was a licensed dealer in 86 when they changed the NFA laws and also in 94 with the import and assault weapons ban and found out you will not change someone’s mind if it is made up. The media will spin any issue any way it wants to so let them, they have that right.

I feel if you do not use a right then for all intents and purposes it is lost all ready. I refuse to give up that right with out a fight and after talking to my state representatives in person it seems I will not have to at least in the near future. Well at least in Idaho.

So you have every right to feel it is a bad thing to open carry a rifle and I have every right to feel it is not.

We will just have to agree to disagree..

 

[BillB1960]

You've certainly listed a lot of reasons to own a military style semi auto all of which I agree with. Not the most important one in my mind but that's fine, whatever works for you.

I have yet to run across anyone open carrying a long gun while I'm carrying but I do recall the shock I felt when I first saw soldiers carrying assault rifles at PDX right after 9/11. Seeing people carrying long guns even slung made me think of 3rd world countries and America is not a 3rd world country. I have no idea exactly how I'm going to handle it when I come across someone with an AR slung over their shoulder when I'm not expecting it but I'm pretty sure I'll be keeping a close eye on them. I damn sure know it's not something I want to get used to and I'm pretty sure the general public wont get used to it either.

 

[Member 3687]

BillB1960
I have yet to run across anyone open carrying a long gun while I'm carrying but I do recall the shock I felt when I first saw soldiers carrying assault rifles at PDX right after 9/11. Seeing people carrying long guns even slung made me think of 3rd world countries and America is not a 3rd world country. I have no idea exactly how I'm going to handle it when I come across someone with an AR slung over their shoulder when I'm not expecting it but I'm pretty sure I'll be keeping a close eye on them. I damn sure know it's not something I want to get used to and I'm pretty sure the general public won’t get used to it either.

If you look at history and state laws you would find most states have or had the right to open carry and like now canceled carry was regulated. The reason was an honest man had nothing to hide so the firearm was in the open only criminals would carry canceled so there for it must be regulated.

Now you are evil if you open carry and everyone including the bad guy carries canceled.

I do not fear a man with a rifle on his back but would keep tabs on him if he was carrying it in the ready.

Seeing people carrying long guns even slung made me think of 3rd world countries and America is not a 3rd world country.

Well I have only been to a couple 3rd world countries and have read about more and it seems that only the government, police and bad guys have the guns and not the citizens. Mexico and Africa comes to mind and I am not sure if Mexico is still classed as a 3 world country. The citizen in both of these countries has very strict or no legal rights to firearms at all.

Guess what the feds and many states want to regulate, register or ban your firearms getting us closer to a third world country where only the government and the bad guys have the guns. The honest citizen will be left defenseless.

These are just my opinions.

 

[Phillyfan]

Doing stupid stuff in the name of "the 2A says I can" will be the quickest and easiest way for 2A haters to attack and limit those rights.

There weren't limits on the 1st ammendment until some dumbass yelled "fire" in a theater.