I now support defunding the (city) police

[Tarawa86]

I'm fairly pro LEO but after watching what's going on, I've decided I now support defunding city police departments. They don't seem all that effective these days after being neutered by their various city councils, and it pretty much seems like many citizens are paying for services they aren't receiving.

I think a better model would be to get rid of city police and increasing the size of our sheriff's departments. Now, I'm not naive and realize one could have a similar situation when the wrong sheriff get's elected (Broward Florida, LA County, etc.) but it seems much less likely when the sheriff is elected by, and accountable to responding to the enforcement priorities of the county as a whole.

I like our sheriff in Washington county and contributed to his campaign ( while also listing my priorities/concerns ). I've also never had a negative interaction with the Hillsboro PD, and they've seemed pretty nice in general - but I can see a future when Hillsboro goes full socialist after all the in-migration from Portland. Hillsboro PD along with code enforcement does a good job of keeping the homeless out of our parks and other public areas, but that could all end if we get PDX style council members.

This was my thought after watching what's going on in PDX and Seattle - and reading that the Denver PD didn't protect Michelle Malkin when she was assaulted for trying to speak at a pro-police rally in Denver.

Edit: This idea involves all city police being moved to the Sheriff's office.

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[albin25]

Police;
- receive, and pass, training and background check, , to be considered to be hired as a cop
- take an oath to become a cop
- need on-going training to remain a cop
- subject to performance scrutiny to stay a cop
- failure to adhere to the oath they took, or laws they enforce, get fired from being a cop
- free doughnut considered by the public as proof of corruption
- any, yes any, complaint is considered true and serious..Complainant is a hailed a "hero"
- need to physically survive long enough to retire

City Council Politician;
- no training to run for election, heck, dumber is considered better.
- take an oath to become a council member
- no on-going training needed to become a "lifer"
- might have job scrutinized for a few days before re-election, maybe.
- free hotel rooms, travel, cash gifts, are just considered S.O.P
- any complaint is considered frivolous and a political "hit",the complainant is trashed
- no big deal to violate your oath, may actually be considered a "plus", if anyone notices
- retire a millionaire.. on the small stipend you say you earned

Keep the Police....De-fund the City Councils

 

[Alexx1401]

ALL, of the problems people are seeing that involve police are in the lap of the voters. The people who vote, put the people in charge of the police in office and keep them there. So now they get to live with what they asked for and I hope they enjoy it. The people in charge who are screaming to defund the cops will of course have their own private police to protect them and the tax payers, who vote for this scheme will pay for that too.

 

[Tarawa86]

Keep the Police....De-fund the City Councils

Well, my idea was more that the city police would move to the sheriff's office lol.

There's some politician up in the Seattle area that's trying to get the voters to agree to have the King County sheriff appointed rather than elected, so I feel like I'm on the right track...

Edit: I mean to say that I strongly oppose appointed sheriff's. They should be elected and accountable to the people

 

[Tarawa86]

The people who vote, put the people in charge of the police in office and keep them there. So now they get to live with what they asked

Agreed, but a lot of people who voted aren't getting what they asked for also. A sheriff that answered to the county as a whole in the absence of the city PD, might start addressing citizen complaints about property crime, etc.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

It seems to me at least....
That defunding the police is a step backwards ...or the wrong thing to do.

Without funds , the police can not train or get the proper equipment needed to do their job.
If one can not train or use the proper equipment....then one has to "make do" with what one has...
Making do , will work.....but only for so long.

Change in policing and policing equipment ,should happen in many cases...
Change needs funds , among other things in order to happen.
Andy

 

[Tarawa86]

It seems to me at least....
That defunding the police is a step backwards ...or the wrong thing to do.

Without funds , the police can not train or get the proper equipment needed to do their job.
If one can not train or use the proper equipment....then one has to "make do"...
Making do , will work.....but only for so long.

Change in policing and policing equipment ,should happen in many cases...
Change needs funds , among other things in order to happen.
Andy

Hehe, I guess my post was a bit tongue in cheek. But, I would much rather pay more county taxes to support a larger Sheriff's office (IE, all city PD becomes sheriff's). and not pay the property taxes to support the city PD (again, I like Hillsboro PD, but that could change if we get a PDX style city council). I also like the way the elected sheriff can tell other politicians to go pound sand if they think a law is unconstitutional. If the Portland police where under the Mult. County Sheriff, citizens in all the surrounding cities would get a say about actually enforcing the laws on the books in downtown PDX, and I think it would be a nicer place.

 

[Alexx1401]

Well, my idea was more that the city police would move to the sheriff's office lol.

There's some politician up in the Seattle area that's trying to get the voters to agree to have the King County sheriff appointed rather than elected, so I feel like I'm on the right track...

Appointed by who? The same people who are telling everyone to de fund the city police? The people who appointed the current Chief who is proving to be a joke as she knows if she actually acts like a Cop they will just fire her? This is the people who made a huge mess rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic. They made a HUGE mess, now they pretend they had nothing to do with it, and want to be voted back in to fix it. So by all means let them appoint the Sheriff as then of course they can fire the same person. So when they make a mess of the county police department they can blame the one they appointed, fire them, tell the voters how great they are and appoint another one. Who will of course have to do as they say or be fired. The only way this will ever change is if enough people who vote decide they want some adults to run the show for a while. Until then they get what they asked for, and of course blame people like Trump, who have nothing to do with it and no control of it.

 

[Tarawa86]

Appointed by who?

I meant that the politician can't stand that the King County Sheriff is elected, and thus not under her thumb. Hence her push to have the Sheriff appointed, which I strongly oppose.

My argument is that if the Sheriff was responsible for all law enforcement, with all city PD being folded into the Sheriff's office, we might have more robust law enforcement in places like Porltand, since the Sheriff has to answer directly to all the voters in the county, not a city council (or just voters in portland for that matter)

 

[Alexx1401]

I meant that the politician can't stand that the King County Sheriff is elected, and thus not under her thumb. Hence her push to have the Sheriff appointed, which I strongly oppose.

My argument is that if the Sheriff was responsible for all law enforcement, with all city PD being folded into the Sheriff's office, we might have more robust law enforcement in places like Porltand, since the Sheriff has to answer directly to all the voters in the county, not a city council (or just voters in portland for that matter)

Believe me the people running the city would never allow the KCSD to take over because they know what would happen. The people who they support, who are trying to loot and burn, would be stomped on. The press would blame them with lots of photo's of the poor protesters being hurt. The protesters would then turn on them and show up at their homes. Remember what turned that idiot mayor who was supporting this. The protesters showed up at her home and all of a sudden the mayor started going after some of her own team mates. It is kind of fun to watch them go at each other now. Do feel bad for those who live there and are stuck in the middle of this mess but, they need to get out and vote if they want change.

 

[Tarawa86]

Believe me the people running the city would never allow the KCSD to take over because they know what would happen. The people who they support, who are trying to loot and burn, would be stomped on. The press would blame them with lots of photo's of the poor protesters being hurt. The protesters would then turn on them and show up at their homes. R

I hear you, I'm just dreaming. It just pisses me off that we have ceded, for example, our 1st amendment rights in many areas so as not to be 'provoking'. I don't go anywhere near the protests, but it really makes me angry that I couldn't show up with an American flag and a MAGA hat in downtown pdx without having to kill a bunch of people that would try to assault me. I believe groups like patriot prayer and the proud boys got started in part because they were angry that every conservative rally ended up with conservatives being assaulted by the leftist Brownshirt fascists. Also, if you read the different city forums, you can definitely get a sense of just how tired they are of all the crime drug users and homeless are perpetuating.

 

[Alexx1401]

I hear you, I'm just dreaming. It just pisses me off that we have ceded, for example, our 1st amendment rights in many areas so as not to be 'provoking'. I don't go anywhere near the protests, but it really makes me angry that I couldn't show up with an American flag and a MAGA hat in downtown pdx without having to kill a bunch of people that tried to assault me. I believe groups like patriot prayer and the proud boys got started in part because they were angry that every conservative rally ended up with conservatives being assaulted by the leftist Brownshirt fascists. Also, if you read the different city forums, you can definitely get a sense of just how tired they are of all the crime drug users and homeless are perpetuating.

You bet. You show up with a MAGA hat, or flag and they would attack you. Then when you defended yourself they would arrest and charge you with a crime for daring to offend the scum. Free speech is only for them, not you. I really do hope they keep this up until November. If we have any chance to wake some people up this is it. For decades I have had people think I was a tinfoil hat type when I tried to tell them where this was headed. Now it's on full display and no one can pretend it's not happening any more. All I can hope is this finally wakes a lot of people up who have been voting for this. Either by actively voting for these people or just sitting out elections thinking it will not matter, they are all the same, blah, blah, blah. Maybe now they will see what happens when you let people like this in power. I hope

 

[Certaindeaf]

Police;
- receive, and pass, training and background check, , to be considered to be hired as a cop
- take an oath to become a cop
- need on-going training to remain a cop
- subject to performance scrutiny to stay a cop
- failure to adhere to the oath they took, or laws they enforce, get fired from being a cop
- free doughnut considered by the public as proof of corruption
- any, yes any, complaint is considered true and serious..Complainant is a hailed a "hero"
- need to physically survive long enough to retire

City Council Politician;
- no training to run for election, heck, dumber is considered better.
- take an oath to become a council member
- no on-going training needed to become a "lifer"
- might have job scrutinized for a few days before re-election, maybe.
- free hotel rooms, travel, cash gifts, are just considered S.O.P
- any complaint is considered frivolous and a political "hit",the complainant is trashed
- no big deal to violate your oath, may actually be considered a "plus", if anyone notices
- retire a millionaire.. on the small stipend you say you earned

Keep the Police....De-fund the City Councils

Don't forget drug testing for coppers.. smoking crack is a sanctioned prerequisite for most all other gov class workers though.
good times

 

[dcfranzen]

Local police departments are quasi-military organizations that take their orders from the politicians elected by the community. If community members are not satisfied with the lack of police departments they need to elect different folks to guide the department in a different direction.

Defunding the police is a silly notion created by media outlets to generate social turmoil and gain revenues for their organization while dividing the community even further.

 

[tkdguy]

I am sure many of you know that defunding the police, removing the police, is the tactic to the communist party, radical leftist socialists, and Nazi types; all in a systematic and dynamic effort to restructure society, in the light of communism types, and to then replace with leftist minded federal police. Maybe have a look at the tactics of the 1915 Russian revolution and the Nazi party from 1932 onward and communism ideas and governance?

 

[Tarawa86]

Local police departments are quasi-military organizations that take their orders from the politicians elected by the community. If community members are not satisfied with the lack of police departments they need to elect different folks to guide the department in a different direction.

I am sure many of you know that defunding the police, removing the police, is the tactic to the communist party, radical leftist socialists, and Nazi types; all in a systematic and dynamic effort to restructure society, in the light of communism types, and to then replace with leftist minded federal police. Maybe have a look at the tactics of the 1915 Russian revolution and the Nazi party from 1932 onward and communism ideas and governance?

Well, not sure if you read through any of the messages in this thread. My main point is that I feel we would be better served with policing from the Sheriff's department. Same amount of cops, they'd all just be sheriff's.

I realize that voters in Portland and Seattle are getting the policing they deserve because of the city councils they elect however, those are our cities too, even if we don't live in them. We can't afford to just write them off. The Sheriff is responsible to the voters of the whole county, so surrounding communities could apply effective pressure to actually enforce the law.

This would effectively neuter the 'Defund the police' movement. They can't stand not having the head of law enforcement directly answerable to the people, hence the ballot measure submitted by the King County Council to make the Sheriff an appointed rather than elected position, which would be a terrible turn of events.

King County Council moves to strip power from Sheriff’s Office; proposals to head to voters in November

From 1969 until 1996, the King County executive appointed the county sheriff.

www.seattletimes.com

 

[HA556]

@Tarawa86 , for what it's worth my friend, I understood what you were getting at!

 

[tkdguy]

Well, not sure if you read through any of the messages in this thread. My main point is that I feel we would be better served with policing from the Sheriff's department. Same amount of cops, they'd all just be sheriff's.

I realize that voters in Portland and Seattle are getting the policing they deserve because of the city councils they elect however, those are our cities too, even if we don't live in them. We can't afford to just write them off. The Sheriff is responsible to the voters of the whole county, so surrounding communities could apply effective pressure to actually enforce the law.

This would effectively neuter the 'Defund the police' movement. They can't stand not having the head of law enforcement directly answerable to the people, hence the ballot measure submitted by the King County Council to make the Sheriff an appointed rather than elected position, which would be a terrible turn of events.

King County Council moves to strip power from Sheriff’s Office; proposals to head to voters in November

From 1969 until 1996, the King County executive appointed the county sheriff.

www.seattletimes.com

I am talking of a step wise planned communist restructuring of society. What is happening is systematic.

 

[Tarawa86]

I am talking of a step wise planned communist restructuring of society. What is happening is systematic.

Yeah, it's a well known tactic. Hence, my 'Sheriff's only' plan.

 

[tkdguy]

Well, not sure if you read through any of the messages in this thread. My main point is that I feel we would be better served with policing from the Sheriff's department. Same amount of cops, they'd all just be sheriff's.

I realize that voters in Portland and Seattle are getting the policing they deserve because of the city councils they elect however, those are our cities too, even if we don't live in them. We can't afford to just write them off. The Sheriff is responsible to the voters of the whole county, so surrounding communities could apply effective pressure to actually enforce the law.

This would effectively neuter the 'Defund the police' movement. They can't stand not having the head of law enforcement directly answerable to the people, hence the ballot measure submitted by the King County Council to make the Sheriff an appointed rather than elected position, which would be a terrible turn of events.

King County Council moves to strip power from Sheriff’s Office; proposals to head to voters in November

From 1969 until 1996, the King County executive appointed the county sheriff.

www.seattletimes.com

I may be wrong but the voters in Pdx seem to tollerate the state of the City and do not seem to be complaining to the City governance. I may be wrong but if they were the City administration would act differently? I think the same dynamic is happening in Salem as well.