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I got stumped. Anyone KNOW the answer?

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by Blowgunner, Feb 2, 2015.

  1. Blowgunner

    Blowgunner Tanasbourne Active Member

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    One of my employees stumped me with a question today. His question was "Can an antique pistol(flintlock,percussion, etc) be open carried loaded in Multnomah county?". My first response was "Why would you?", but that still didn't answer his question. I did a little looking and couldn't find anything that necessarily classified antique weapons differently than a cartridge weapon, so I would assume they are dealt with the same way. Am I correct?
    In my looking it does seem like some states treat them with federal laws and don't count them as "firearms". Interesting.
     
  2. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    I don't know about Oregon but Many states consider black powder weapons to be firearms and as far as the law goes no different than a Glock 19. Other states go along with the federal law that states if it's so old it's no longer a controlled item.
     
  3. Blowgunner

    Blowgunner Tanasbourne Active Member

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    Yeah, I noticed that too. Some are very informative in the way the laws are written. Oregon, not so much, although that doesn't really surprise me.
     
  4. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    ORS 166

    166.210 Definitions. As used in ORS 166.250 to 166.270, 166.291 to 166.295 and 166.410 to 166.470:

    (1) “Antique firearm” means:

    (a) Any firearm, including any firearm with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap or similar type of ignition system, manufactured in or before 1898; and

    (b) Any replica of any firearm described in paragraph (a) of this subsection if the replica:

    (A) Is not designed or redesigned for using rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition; or

    (B) Uses rimfire or conventional centerfire fixed ammunition that is no longer manufactured in the United States and that is not readily available in the ordinary channels of commercial trade.

    (2) “Corrections officer” has the meaning given that term in ORS 181.610.

    (3) “Firearm” means a weapon, by whatever name known, which is designed to expel a projectile by the action of powder.

    (4) “Firearms silencer” means any device for silencing, muffling or diminishing the report of a firearm.

    (5) “Handgun” means any pistol or revolver using a fixed cartridge containing a propellant charge, primer and projectile, and designed to be aimed or fired otherwise than from the shoulder.

    (6) “Machine gun” means a weapon of any description by whatever name known, loaded or unloaded, which is designed or modified to allow two or more shots to be fired by a single pressure on the trigger device.

    (7) “Minor” means a person under 18 years of age.

    (8) “Offense” has the meaning given that term in ORS 161.505.

    (9) “Parole and probation officer” has the meaning given that term in ORS 181.610.

    (10) “Peace officer” has the meaning given that term in ORS 133.005.

    (11) “Short-barreled rifle” means a rifle having one or more barrels less than 16 inches in length and any weapon made from a rifle if the weapon has an overall length of less than 26 inches.

    (12) “Short-barreled shotgun” means a shotgun having one or more barrels less than 18 inches in length and any weapon made from a shotgun if the weapon has an overall length of less than 26 inches. [Amended by 1977 c.769 §1; 1979 c.779 §3; 1989 c.839 §1; 1993 c.735 §14; 1995 c.670 §3; 1999 c.1040 §2; 2001 c.666 §§32,44; 2003 c.614 §7; 2007 c.368 §1; 2009 c.610 §4]

    https://www.oregonlegislature.gov/bills_laws/lawsstatutes/2013ors166.html

    Please look at definition #3, I couldn't find reference of the Portland City charter to the definition of firearm, but one could safely assume that they would revert to the definition outlined by the state. Get a CHL, and you can carry your flint-lock allllll you want.

    Oregon defines a firearm as anything that expels a projectile with powder, 166.173 gives cities and counties the authority to regulate the possession of firearms.
     
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  5. Blowgunner

    Blowgunner Tanasbourne Active Member

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    Perfect. That's what i figured. Didn't want to answer without knowing. Nothing is worse than spreading wrong information.
    Thanks guys!
     
  6. etrain16

    etrain16 Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I think what you're looking for is referenced not under the city of Portland, but under Multnomah County. On April 24, 2013, as a partial response to SH, the Multnomah County Commission tightened the restrictions on possession of guns throughout Multnomah county. They basically took the restrictions to the absolute allowed in the state, without state preemption blocking them.

    Among other things, it prohibits the possession of a loaded 'firearm' in public places, but exempts those with an Oregon CHL. As Solv3nt pointed out, you have to go to the definition of 'firearm', and certainly, your example would qualify as a 'firearm', thereby making it fall under the restrictions in the ordinance. I agree with Solv3nt's assessment, he is correct as I've understood it.

    For further reference, here is a link to that county gun ordinance - it would be good to be familiar with this document if you live and/or work in Multnomah County (click on the link for the PDF document):

    https://multco.us/file/9312/download
     
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  7. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    Multnomah County mirrored the laws of Portland, which are as strict as the state allows them to be. A CHL allows you to tell the city and county to pound sand, as they have no authority (for the time being) to regulate your possession of a firearm.

    Also, please note that in Multnomah County, as well as the city of Portland, being in possession of a loaded magazine or clip is in violation of the ordinance without a CHL, regardless of where it is located in your car.
     
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  8. 308

    308 ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ Platinum Supporter Silver Supporter

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    This ordinanace (not you) is such complete and utter worthless BS!
     
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  9. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    Thank you for clarifying that I'm not worthless BS ;)
     
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  10. 308

    308 ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ ΜOΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ Platinum Supporter Silver Supporter

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    Hey, you never know how someone may read into words typed on the interwebz :D
     
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  11. nehalemguy

    nehalemguy Vernonia Well-Known Member

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    Only if you also start sporting an eye patch and end every statement with "Arrrrr".

    E
     
  12. Dyjital

    Dyjital Albany, Ore Flavorite Member Bronze Supporter

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    Wait....

    Aren't these allowed as they are not considered a firearm by definition? They are reproductions based on pre-1899? models etc?

    Guess it depends if the county uses "firearm" or "handgun" as their definition.
     
  13. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    Federal law says they are not a firearm, many state laws say they are.
     
  14. etrain16

    etrain16 Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Look at Solv3nt's post above - he lists the State of Oregon's definition (per ORS) of "Firearm", which would apply to this style of guns. The Multnomah County ordinance doesn't appear to define any terms, but numerous times references back to the ORS regarding exemptions to the ordinance. I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say that they are looking to the State's definitions, which, if that is the case, means the pirate pistol is a "firearm", and therefore, subject to the ordinance.

    Just my 2 cents.
     
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  15. IronMonster

    IronMonster Washington Opinionated Member Diamond Supporter

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    I concur
     
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  16. balaperdida

    balaperdida eastern idaho Well-Known Member

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    "...action of powder..."??? Like face powder, athletes foot powder, antiperspirant powder, etc.???
     
  17. solv3nt

    solv3nt Portland Well-Known Member

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    I cringe when thinking about what you Eastern Idaho boys are adding to your foot powder and antiperspirant to be able to expel a bullet from a firearm.
     
  18. balaperdida

    balaperdida eastern idaho Well-Known Member

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    ^^^^Just wondering what I might find in the personal products aisles of Oregon supermarkets.
     
  19. Capn Jack

    Capn Jack Wet-Stern Washington Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Ever see a demonstration of a powdered grain explosion?:eek:

    The politicians who write these laws have no concept of
    semantics and very little understanding of the subject matter.:mad:
     
  20. Martini_Up

    Martini_Up NW USA Well-Known Member

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    "Regulation of the right to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed."

    :s0114:
     
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