how long before Oregon background checks.

[tiggers97]

What happened with the NRA on this? I did not see much support.

Something that shouldn't (cannot) happen here in Oregon: They got in a bit of a tizzy fight with Alan Gottieb. Head of the 2nd Amendment Foundation, a "rival" gun-rights group in WA. So i591 never got any support from the NRA. And since (in my opinion) WA is Alan Gottieb's home state, i594 didn't get as much attention as it deserved.

I hope we don't have to lobby our OWN gun rights groups in Oregon to get them to work together. Otherwise we truly are doomed. We will see bills. And I'm sure there are many that will pass. The trial for us this time isn't necessarily to just stop them, but to also help craft them and hopefully steer the conversation towards criminal control, and not just civilian gun-owner control.

 

[The Heretic]

Not surprising to me at all (the rivalry - if true), such politics are often more important to people in positions of power (whether public office or in an org) than their stated purpose for being in office. People with big egos and a lust for power, not to mention wanting to protect their powerbase, tend to gravitate towards such positions.

 

[tiggers97]

Time to put the legislature address shortcut back on the desktop and start drafting letters n preparation for the onslaught.

This: Are you angry and feel the need to do something now? Just like a squirrel saving nuts for the winter, start drafting emails now so when things get busy, your ahead of the curve. Things you could write about:
1) your house/state representative and committee chairs
2) written testimony
3) letters to the editor - Educate the public. I see the occasional gun-control letter in the Oregonian, setting the tone for future action (on their part). But not so much from the pro-2nd amendment side. See what you can do in your local community. We need to get our own public education program in place, and it can start with you. I think this will have the biggest long-term impact.

Get started early on this stuff. When the time gets closer, it will give you more time to get others to write in as well. Keep them dry and ready in your draft folder till needed

4) getting other people involved. - From all political parties, too. Try and see if you can recruit other people to write in, go to rallies, etc. We need to build our numbers.
5) Get more involved, and commit for the long haul. Ask your local 2nd amendment group what you can do to help. Expect the jobs NOT to be sexy or exciting. But they are needed and necessary. I remember once talking with Kevin Starrett about how many people initially offer to help him, but never followed up and just disappeared because the actual work needed to make things happen was 'boring', or perhaps they were turned off because it was something new for them. Heck, this year I forced myself to help a local candidate and made calls, house knocking, signs, etc. All new to me, and I was initially uncomfortable. But I made myself go thru it and I'm glad I did.

My new-years resolution is to try and introduce at least one non-gun person to shooting, get more involved at the activist level, and get at least two people to write testimony or email their representatives. Count me in for rallies, showing up at the capital for hearings, and my constant ramblings to get people engaged

We'll need all the help we can get from OFF, SAF, GOA, and NRA. I know we can count on Alan Gottleib and Kevin Starrett. But as we just saw in Washington, will it be enough?

As members I think we need to make sure these groups work together, and not get in a pissing match with each other. Each one has their strengths and weaknesses, so they need to complement each other, not try to show up each other like the NRA did to the 2nd Amendment Foundation in WA. There's something I remember reading in Tzu's Art of War about five fingers being stronger as a fist than as individual fingers poking at their enemy.

 

[tiggers97]

Can any of you glass 1/2 full types give me a scenario however far fetched where they can be stopped?

We find another moderate democrat in the senate is the best scenario. At least one that isn't hog wild on gun-control. I don't know all the new senators, or if there are any 'soft' Dems who might do background checks, but nothing else for example.

 

[U201491]

Not knocking OFF, they've helped a lot but with the deck sooo stacked against us now in OR, what can they do when Prozanski, Burdick and the usual crowd can push a Bill through virtually unopposed now?

Can any of you glass 1/2 full types give me a scenario however far fetched where they can be stopped?

These people are IN PLACE and have a BIGGER, TOTAL majority now correct?

The only argument among them is going to be "should we throw in a semi-auto restriction or mag cap law this time along with a I-594 style transfer law or wait awhile?"
After they agree on that, ignoring all input from Gun Advocates, or as they call us Fanatics or Fringe Extremists, they just take a little vote among themselves and it's the Law of the Land, correct?

And as far as OFF not separating Gun Rights from other political issues...............
It's pretty obvious in this State that the people who are scared about and prioritize Global warming, Min wage, social Justice etc. are Voting Democrat down the line.
That Party in this state anyway has made it CLEAR that they are against gun rights.
Downplaying these trumped up fears on other non gun issues is productive imo.

I would never say things like this under any other times, but considering who is there now, we can pray Burdick and her ilk all have a fiery head on......................at 40,000 feet.............................:\
Ahh hell anywhere...............................

 

[Stomper]

I don't give a flip what those dopes in Salem might pass concerning "gun control"... I will NOT comply, and they'll never know what I may (or may not) have.

 

[flydipper]

The power of the recall worked for Colorado!

I'm from Wa. and got involved in the 594 fight. We have a hope of getting this thing gutted in the Legislature because the make-up of our legislature is different than yours in Ore. If not gutted then it will go to court and who knows then. It is severely flawed and deals with multiple issues which violates our constitution. That said
my advice to you is to get a PAC going now donating money to it regularly. If this goes to an initiative. You cannot out spend these billionaires they will buy up all the tv time and the media will not give your side a fair shake on the reporting. The grassroots can work. Get the word out quick and accurate, punching holes in their statistics. They use the same ones over and over and have been debunked time and again. They will lie over and over. They will bring in emotion about so and so who was killed by gun violence. I used: what about all the soldiers who died for our rights and freedoms. It worked well for me. Get involved in the local debates. Have two guys work as a team, one guy who is sharp on clarifying what is wrong with the bill and the other guy who can immediately debunk the lies they tell on the spot because the media won't report their side as telling lies. I personally wouldn't run a counter initiative again like we did this time with 591. It split our resources and could have made the difference in beating this 594 had we been able to afford prime tv time early on. The infighting between NRA and SAF was evident and the NRA is fielding a lot of wrath from Wa. members right now. Which I'm sure is making Bloomburg smile.

I can't overstate this point enough if it's an initiative. You must get out and talk directly with everybody, they will sell it with a snappy headline and the crap will be in the details. People won't care they have to eat a bucket of crap to get to the M&M all they heard was M&M. I thought I had my county in the bag to beat this. No pro 594 letters to the editor no signs anywhere for 594 nothing. We had no 594 stuff everywhere. In the end lost by 60%. All people saw was the M&M and the other side pounded it home on the prime time with blatant lies that we couldn't counter due to NO MONEY. You all will need to go door to door, FTF with people explaining in detail all the bad stuff in it. Sounds like a lot of work huh! Well it is and we didn't do enough and we split our monies which I think was a mistake in hindsite.

Get a PAC going and donate your money to it, you cannot count on the NRA or SAF to do it for you. Thanks for listening.

 

[44mag2ndamend]

Of the 67 or so messages so far we could stop wasting our energy and start directing it to where it needs to go. I can not see for the life of me who here other than Kevin and his organization OFF to start directing funds.

Anyone whom looks at a political heat map can cleary see that Oregon by land mass is very Red. Even looking across to the votes in counties the areas that were voted Republican won by a landslide. Richardson took some areas at a 67% approval rating. Its phucking Multnomah County every time that PHUCKS THINGS UP. Look at King County statistics up in Washington.

Why should one county dictate rule for everyone else in the state? Its just stupid that we cant see through this and get things changed.

 

[Creep]

I find it ridiculous that while we have "Truth in advertising" laws, we don't have "Truth in media" laws, or better yet (and I bet this would chap quite a few asses) "Truth in politics" laws. Can you imagine the unhappiness if there were some kind of penalty for lying to the people you're supposed to work for?

 

[bnsaibum]

Can any of you glass 1/2 full types give me a scenario however far fetched where they can be stopped?

Part of the strategy we have must be to be seen as for something rather than against UBC/magcap/etc. How about offering an idea that sounds "reasonable" to most, but would be unacceptable for the die hard Bliss Ninnies. They may just dismiss it out of hand because it comes from gun owners, they may not, but if they do then they can be painted as being obstructionists to gun "safety" legislation. The tricky part is figuring out something to offer that we could live with if it were to pass. Not a pleasant prospect.

For a far fetched idea how about a free OSP system that provides the seller with immunity should the buyer or some subsequent owner use the firearm in a crime. This would only require enough info to discover if the buyer was not prohibited, meaning it would do away with the current OSP database and require no info on the firearm.

Pros-
Free, no more $10 fee
No more state registration
Immunity from prosecution

Cons-
Strong possibility of a mandate for all sales added by antis as an amendment
I am sure there are more

I realize that currently there are few prosecutions for sellers who acted in good faith. The reason to include this is to actually provide legal immunity and more importantly to play politics. How many non-gun owners know much about firearms laws? Look at how many people, even gun owners, buy the media line of 'registered gun' in the news. I am sure that the Bliss Ninnies would have a fit over doing away with the OSP database and likely with having to have all taxpayers pay for the State Police to run the check for us for free. I sure as hell don't want all sales to have a mandated background check.

In any event, if we do offer some idea it needs to be sold like I-594 was in WA. The only way to do that is to offer something first and control the message. It's getting late, I'm getting tired and likely not thinking very clearly. Flame away, but don't crucify me too badly. My first paragraph does have some merit.

 

[Nick Burkhardt]

How about an Oregon income tax deduction or dollar for dollar credit for safe purchases.

 

[PiratePast40]

How about an Oregon income tax deduction or dollar for dollar credit for safe purchases.

Why, so that yet another organization has a record of your gun ownership? So they can come to your house to inspect?

Everyone please take a deep breath and walk away from the kool-aid. This is how the wolves feed themselves. They promise the herd that they just want one lamb today. Problem is that the wolf herd grows while the sheep herd gets eaten.

One more time: LAWFUL GUN OWNERS ARE NOT THE PROBLEM. THERE IS NO REASON FOR US TO GIVE UP ANYTHING BECAUSE OF THEIR NEED FOR CONTROL! THEY'RE NO BETTER THAN TROLLS.

 

[Quigley_Sharps]

its in the works:
http://gov.oregonlive.com/bill/2014/SB1551/

 

[tiggers97]

Part of the strategy we have must be to be seen as for something rather than against UBC/magcap/etc. ......

For a far fetched idea how about a free OSP system that provides the seller with immunity should the buyer or some subsequent owner use the firearm in a crime. This would only require enough info to discover if the buyer was not prohibited, meaning it would do away with the current OSP database and require no info on the firearm.

I've thought (reluctantly) about this as well. We do have a free background check call in already in place. Call in to say Mr. X is selling to Mr. Y, is Y ok to receive? Yes/No. Mr. X keeps a sales receipt for... 1-2 years? (cover his butt if the gun shows up in a crime and it gets traced back to him). Make sure there are exemptions for Concealed Carry, and other FFL's like 03's. Period, end of check.

In any event, if we do offer some idea it needs to be sold like I-594 was in WA. The only way to do that is to offer something first and control the message. It's getting late, I'm getting tired and likely not thinking very clearly. Flame away, but don't crucify me too badly. My first paparagraph does have some merit.

First move and control the message. yes. The other side has a head start on that. I really need to start writing "letters to the editor" every time I see a gun-nonsense submission.

 

[OLDNEWBIE]

Part of the strategy we have must be to be seen as for something rather than against UBC/magcap/etc. How about offering an idea that sounds "reasonable" to most, but would be unacceptable for the die hard Bliss Ninnies. They may just dismiss it out of hand because it comes from gun owners, they may not, but if they do then they can be painted as being obstructionists to gun "safety" legislation. The tricky part is figuring out something to offer that we could live with if it were to pass. Not a pleasant prospect.

For a far fetched idea how about a free OSP system that provides the seller with immunity should the buyer or some subsequent owner use the firearm in a crime. This would only require enough info to discover if the buyer was not prohibited, meaning it would do away with the current OSP database and require no info on the firearm.

Pros-
Free, no more $10 fee
No more state registration
Immunity from prosecution

Cons-
Strong possibility of a mandate for all sales added by antis as an amendment
I am sure there are more

I realize that currently there are few prosecutions for sellers who acted in good faith. The reason to include this is to actually provide legal immunity and more importantly to play politics. How many non-gun owners know much about firearms laws? Look at how many people, even gun owners, buy the media line of 'registered gun' in the news. I am sure that the Bliss Ninnies would have a fit over doing away with the OSP database and likely with having to have all taxpayers pay for the State Police to run the check for us for free. I sure as hell don't want all sales to have a mandated background check.

In any event, if we do offer some idea it needs to be sold like I-594 was in WA. The only way to do that is to offer something first and control the message. It's getting late, I'm getting tired and likely not thinking very clearly. Flame away, but don't crucify me too badly. My first paragraph does have some merit.

Sounds like Creepy Kitz sort of agrees with you strangely enough.
http://registerguard.com/rg/news/lo...s-on-tough-campaign-2015-legislature.html.csp

Kitzhaber said he doesn't expect Democrats to try and overplay their hand and pursue an overly ambitious agenda in the upcoming session.
On gun control, for example, if advocates push for more than the background-check expansion, he said, "they'll start losing Democratic votes." Some Democrats have repeatedly lobbied for allowing school districts to ban concealed handguns on their property, for example. Others have pushed for a ban on semiautomatic weapons or for restrictions on gun clip sizes.
Why do I not believe him?

Something to use in our letter campaigns against Mag caps and the like anyway. The Goveror says he's against it???

 

[U201491]

The latest mailout from OFF isn't particularly reassuring is it?

http://www.oregonfirearms.org/2014-elections

"Oregon Firearms Federation is a political organization. Our focus is on winning political battles through activism. But we cannot underestimate the threats to your rights based on the changes in the Oregon Legislature and the introduction of limitless funds by those who want to steal your freedom. While we urge you to prepare for the political battles ahead and be a part of this fight, you should also consider making any preparations now to deal with potential bans and confiscations."

Sell it all except your carry weapon...............

 

[BroncoFan]

its in the works:
http://gov.oregonlive.com/bill/2014/SB1551/

That's from last year's session but I'm sure it has always been wandering the halls in Salem like something out of the walking dead....

 

[OLDNEWBIE]

Like turds that won't flush, these Bills, (and politicians) keep popping up.

 

[Stomper]

Over a HALF BILLION DOLLARS went up in smoke between the Columbia River Crossing "feasibility study" and disgraceful Cover Oregon website failure and NOT ONE SINGLE THING TO SHOW FOR IT, except that MuddahPlukah's friends and his PLUCKING WEASLE WHORE getting their pockets lined.

Nobody is held accountable, and that PLUCKING SCHMUCK gets reelected without so much as a cocked eyebrow from anyone... and some of you actually BELIEVE ANYTHING that SHEITE says in a newspaper interview.... Really?

 

[jbett98]

In President Lincolns day, you came to Washington DC to do your duty as a representative of the people, but if you stayed beyond your term limit and tried to hang onto your office, you were considered a low life scoundrel that couldn't be trusted by the folks back home.