Hospitals not yet overwhelmed by rush of virus patients

[SpudBob]

The numbers, in Idaho, have been trending DOWN the last few days! We are NOT on lockdown and haven't been! Only 40 new cases, statewide, reported today!

 

[wp4]

The numbers, in Idaho, have been trending DOWN the last few days! We are NOT on lockdown and haven't been! Only 40 new cases, statewide, reported today!

Idaho will benefit from most every other state locking down, even if they choose not to.

But I have a feeling your turn will come, just like we'll have ours.

 

[CountryGent]

Meh. Life's a bubblegum. Then you die.

Very true. Sometimes there is fun in between.

I'll try. So we see something brewing in China 4 months ago. we see leaked videos of Chinese doctors screaming the hospitals are overwhelmed, people in hazmat suits running next to a gurney in the middle of the street. What appear to be dead bodies in hospital hallways. Then we start to get reports that chinese doctors who were reporting a new infection outbreak and being told to publicly take back what they said and deny an outbreak. Shortly after that the doctor dies. About this time a giant Chinese city gets locked down and videos show people being welded into their apartment buildings. WHO, at a time we dont yet realize are corrupted by the Chinese, tell us that China reports the virus is not spread person to person. What?

So early on we are getting a picture of some sort of horror movie outbreak in China that they are desperately trying to cover up and we are getting a ton of mixed messages. But it is easy to see the cover up and that strikes a ton of fear. Some information starts to leak. Physicians and healthcare workers in China are dying. The early mortality rate being reported out of China for those on a ventilator is 97%. Can we believe it or not? Is it fake or real? who knows it is China.

Shortly there after we hear of a patient in Seattle that is in isolation and doctors are talking to the patient with a robot. A outbreak occurs in Iran and they coverup starts there as well until a ton of government officials get sick. Cant hide that. Soon Italy is reporting cases. In a course of 9 days they go from complaining about tourists not coming to Italy to Shutting the entire country down. 9 days. Hospitals are overwhelmed

Now at this point I start listing to reports from physicians in Italy. I trust what they are saying way more than china. They are overwhelmed. They are overwhelmed so fast that they are letting older patients die to try and save younger ones. They are not even trying to resuscitated people who die because they dont have enough staff to even take care of the still living patients. Doctors start to die. They are begging the rest of the world to take this seriously.

We still had a chance to contain this at this point but everyone from the state health departments up to the CDC and the president proceed to sh*t the bed and do nothing.


Now flu we know. We know what it does, who it kills, how it kills and what to expect. We dont shut the world down every year for flu because we know what to expect. We have a vaccine, 50% of people dont get it, Many still thinks it causes autism. We have a treatment for it. Many of us would not die from flu if we took the prevention and treatment seriously. But people believe Jenny McCarthy over their doctor so what can we do?

Now covid, we dont know. We got unreliable information out of China where it looked so much worse. That's all we had to go on at first. We did not know how it kills, who it kills, what rate it kills. Add to that, China was and is still trying to cover everything up. For all we know this is airborne rabies-like virus and its killing 80% of everyone, At that point we dont know. We dont have a vaccine, we dont have any immunity what so ever, we dont have a treatment. Jenny McCarthy is no where to be found.

So do we take that early information and say "its just flu" and let it infect 60% of the world and kill as many as it appeared it was doing in China or do we shut things down until we know what we are dealing with better? We shut things down. Well, we should have 3 months ago.

Its killing physicians in the US, it is killing residents in their 30's who are asked to take care of these patients because they are younger. When I was in medical school and training, I never heard of residents and physicians dying taking care of patients. I'm sure it happened but not at this rate. This is not flu. No one has immunity.

If you heard some loud growling outside your house in the middle of the night with trees falling over and your Chinese neighbors are screaming its a monster, do you leave your doors open and say they are bluffing and its just raccoons? Or do you lock up, arm yourself, board up the windows and prepare for a fight and wait for the sun to come up to see what it really is?

Absolutely nailed it. Thank you! (And I'd ramble on about the available data, but I'm, frankly, too tired and don't really care at this point.)

P.S. The fact Jenny McCarthy has any voice in public health is a testament to human stupidity. She isn't even that hot, though admittedly I've never been a fan of blondes. And I just lost my train of thought, but I could quote surprisingly raunchy second century BCE literature at this point, but won't (@Kruel J would be the only one to get that joke, among a great many esoteric references we've shared over the years. )

 

[308]

China where it looked so much worse. That's all we had to go on at first. We did not know how it kills, who it kills, what rate it kills. Add to that, China was and is still trying to cover everything up. For all we know this is airborne rabies

I'll try. So we see something brewing in China 4 months ago. we see leaked videos of Chinese doctors screaming the hospitals are overwhelmed, people in hazmat suits running next to a gurney in the middle of the street. What appear to be dead bodies in hospital hallways. Then we start to get reports that chinese doctors who were reporting a new infection outbreak and being told to publicly take back what they said and deny an outbreak. Shortly after that the doctor dies. About this time a giant Chinese city gets locked down and videos show people being welded into their apartment buildings. WHO, at a time we dont yet realize are corrupted by the Chinese, tell us that China reports the virus is not spread person to person. What?

So early on we are getting a picture of some sort of horror movie outbreak in China that they are desperately trying to cover up and we are getting a ton of mixed messages. But it is easy to see the cover up and that strikes a ton of fear. Some information starts to leak. Physicians and healthcare workers in China are dying. The early mortality rate being reported out of China for those on a ventilator is 97%. Can we believe it or not? Is it fake or real? who knows it is China.

Shortly there after we hear of a patient in Seattle that is in isolation and doctors are talking to the patient with a robot. A outbreak occurs in Iran and they coverup starts there as well until a ton of government officials get sick. Cant hide that. Soon Italy is reporting cases. In a course of 9 days they go from complaining about tourists not coming to Italy to Shutting the entire country down. 9 days. Hospitals are overwhelmed

Now at this point I start listing to reports from physicians in Italy. I trust what they are saying way more than china. They are overwhelmed. They are overwhelmed so fast that they are letting older patients die to try and save younger ones. They are not even trying to resuscitated people who die because they dont have enough staff to even take care of the still living patients. Doctors start to die. They are begging the rest of the world to take this seriously.

We still had a chance to contain this at this point but everyone from the state health departments up to the CDC and the president proceed to sh*t the bed and do nothing.


Now flu we know. We know what it does, who it kills, how it kills and what to expect. We dont shut the world down every year for flu because we know what to expect. We have a vaccine, 50% of people dont get it, Many still thinks it causes autism. We have a treatment for it. Many of us would not die from flu if we took the prevention and treatment seriously. But people believe Jenny McCarthy over their doctor so what can we do?

Now covid, we dont know. We got unreliable information out of China where it looked so much worse. That's all we had to go on at first. We did not know how it kills, who it kills, what rate it kills. Add to that, China was and is still trying to cover everything up. For all we know this is airborne rabies-like virus and its killing 80% of everyone, At that point we dont know. We dont have a vaccine, we dont have any immunity what so ever, we dont have a treatment. Jenny McCarthy is no where to be found.

So do we take that early information and say "its just flu" and let it infect 60% of the world and kill as many as it appeared it was doing in China or do we shut things down until we know what we are dealing with better? We shut things down. Well, we should have 3 months ago.

Its killing physicians in the US, it is killing residents in their 30's who are asked to take care of these patients because they are younger. When I was in medical school and training, I never heard of residents and physicians dying taking care of patients. I'm sure it happened but not at this rate. This is not flu. No one has immunity.

If you heard some loud growling outside your house in the middle of the night with trees falling over and your Chinese neighbors are screaming its a monster, do you leave your doors open and say they are bluffing and its just raccoons? Or do you lock up, arm yourself, board up the windows and prepare for a fight and wait for the sun to come up to see what it really is?

Bolus,
Thank you for the logical explanation. That is pretty much all I was looking for regardless of how my typed words may have appeared.

 

[Alexx1401]

.gov testing the waters? I think a statistic they are measuring but not talking about at all is compliance. Maybe even the one they care about the most?

Yep, and this is why I was amazed at the wisdom of POTUS to leave this to the states. For years I have heard he is a fascist and wants to control everyone. Now the same people who said that are mad he is not making himself a dictator. He told the states they could decide. Then just look how many of them decide. WA is a great example of how they think. Gov workers are fine but if you do what they do, you need to not work. You need to stay home but the homeless are fine roaming around free. This may actually wake up a few voters, at least I can hope. Pot shop is necessary and can stay open but the gun shop has to close. Let criminals out of jail and keep you from buying a gun and threaten to put you in jail. Hope voters are enjoying what they asked for now.

 

[SpudBob]

But I have a feeling

A feeling??? No fact! A feeling! Maybe you should buy some lotto tickets.

 

[wp4]

A feeling??? No fact! A feeling! Maybe you should buy some lotto tickets.

Feel better?

Yes, a feeling, a hunch, a thought not based on anything but conjecture. That's why I said it that way, not a fact.

Your feelings are well displayed in your post.

 

[Kruel J]

Feel better?

Yes, a feeling, a hunch, a thought not based on anything but conjecture. That's why I said it that way, not a fact.

Your feelings are well displayed in your post.

That is the nicest "f off" post I've read in quite some time. Well played.

 

[Tarawa86]

If you heard some loud growling outside your house in the middle of the night with trees falling over and your Chinese neighbors are screaming its a monster, do you leave your doors open and say they are bluffing and its just raccoons? Or do you lock up, arm yourself, board up the windows and prepare for a fight and wait for the sun to come up to see what it really is?

Watched way too many episodes of 'Lost'. We all know falling trees and screaming are a sign of the smoke monster.

 

[User 1234]

That is the nicest "f off" post I've read in quite some time. Well played.

And this is the most retro!



Not intended for anyone, just funny.

 

[No_Regerts]

So, what you're all saying is, if I go fishing and shooting out by myself in defiance of the CB-1984 rules, 90% of America will die?

Sweet! Tight lines!

 

[User 1234]

So, what you're all saying is, if I go fishing and shooting out by myself in defiance of the CB-1984 rules, 90% of America will die?

Sweet! Tight lines!

Not so sweet, you don't get to pick which 90%.

 

[_TroyH]

I think you meant to say something else, the test has nothing to do with someone being symptomatic. When they do the swab they are checking for the presence of the virus , the virus can be present even if you do not have any symptoms, they've also established that you be contagious as far as 10 after you have recovered from the virus yourself.

So yes we need to test on a wide scale basis

Correct. Not only can you have the virus while being asymptomatic but you can be contagious. I didn't say otherwise.

What I'm saying is that unless you need advanced care, being tested offers no benefit. Either way, positive or negative, stay home.

Even if there is an abundance of test kits, testing everyone is a waste of medical staff and medical supplies and will provide only minimal benefit.

 

[No_Regerts]

Not so sweet, you don't get to pick which 90%.

Knowing my luck, I'd be left with a bunch of Californians and the company that would pay out the life insurance policies where I was the beneficiary would have folded.

 

[03A3Sporter]

Correct. Not only can you have the virus while being asymptomatic but you can be contagious. I didn't say otherwise.

What I'm saying is that unless you need advanced care, being tested offers no benefit. Either way, positive or negative, stay home.

Even if there is an abundance of test kits, testing everyone is a waste of medical staff and medical supplies and will provide only minimal benefit.

Most credible pathologists do not agree with you, testing and tracking is the only way to know how big a problem this is and how professionals need to respond / treat , control the spread , and when we will reach herd immunity.

I can't agree with the assumption oh let's just not test. That isn't sound science or a good strategy here

 

[SpudBob]

Your feelings are well displayed in your post.

I was hopeing you got it!

 

[BigGame]

In 2017-2018 when 61,000 Americans died from the flu, I am one who actually was affected by that flu. I was sicker than I ever had been in my entire life. I coughed for about 3-months after and have never really recovered from some of that damage. And to top that off, the VP of our company who came to town and accidentally infected us, wiped out our entire office.
No body shut down the planet then...nobody here cared enough about me or the 61000 Americans who died to make a 2000 contentious post thread.

Burden of Influenza

Learn about how CDC estimates the burden of seasonal influenza in the U.S.

www.cdc.gov

I'll take a crack at the "COVID-19 is no worse than influenza" viewpoint.

308 cited an influenza website by the CDC, which is a good one. If you dig around there you'll find the following stats for the average annual US experience 2010-2019 with regard to influenza:

• Deaths average 11.7 per 100,000 per year 2010-2019
• There were 11.9 hospitalizations for every death
• The bulk of severe cases take place over a 3-4 month period annually

In Oregon so far our experience has not been too bad, which is good. Social distancing does seem to be slowing infections significantly. However, there are several outbreaks in our country so far that you should compare to the influenza stats above.

1. New York State had its first COVID-19 death on 3/14/20. As of yesterday (3 weeks later), they had already reached 19.9 deaths per 100,000 for the state.
2. New Jersey had its first COVID-19 death on 3/10/20. As of yesterday (4 weeks later), they had already reached 11.3 deaths per 100,000.
3. Louisiana: 3/14/20 first death, 3 weeks later they were at 11.0 deaths per 100,000 for the state.

Regardless of whether the ultimate number of deaths from COVID-19 are in the ballpark of influenza or not, there are some big differences that are causing all of the anxiety right now:

1. COVID-19 is much, much faster than influenza. In 3-4 weeks, we're seeing death rates that for influenza are spread out over 3-4 months.
2. This puts tremendous pressure on our healthcare system. This is a very different "peak" than influenza.
3. We don't know for sure how high the death/hospitalization rates will go. Even with the extreme measures taken to date, NYC is maxed out.

I hope the measures we've taken spare many parts of the country from the same fate some places are experiencing. I also hope that people stop repeating the notion that COVID-19 is no different than influenza. Not true.

 

[RedRover]

I've asked this question several times and not seen a direct answer:

WHY DID NO ONE SHUT DOWN THE PLANET IN 2017-2018 WHEN 60+ THOUSAND AMERICANS DIED FROM THE FLU...AND WHY DID NONE OF THOSE POSTING IN THE 2000 POST CV THREAD EMOTE THE SAME WAY...BACK THEN when I personally suffered through that same flu that killed more than our dear CV-1984 has worldwide.

Because if we didn't do anything at all, 1 million people could have died.

Get it?

Got it?

Good.

The more you know...

 

[No_Regerts]

It doesn't matter how fast the virus reaches a death rate if the rate remains fairly constant.

 

[ma96782]

Interesting?

So 1st person "in charge" says I know let's start a pretend global pandemic!

2ns person "in charge" says YES!

1st person "in charge" we can shut most the country down and cause a potential second great depression.

2nd person "in charge" says YES!

1st person "in charge" Let's take away all sports, peoples jobs, and encourage them to stay home!

2nd person "in charge" says...... You guessed it YES!

So this is what happened? Im sure I am making this simple but just trying to understand how the he!! people think this is not a concerning issue?

LOL. And in China. The scenario possibly went like......

Let's make a biological weapon with these bats.

Ok...let's use the Wuhan Lab.

Rrrright.....it's a Level 4 facility and we can claim that we're only doing "research".

Hey Boss, we're making a lot of progress.

Good, let's try it on Patient Zero.

Well, it worked. BTW, Patient Zero has left the building with it.

Not to worry......we'll just say it came from the market close by. And BTW.....mum's the word. It's a CCP top secret and all that.

Ooops.....some doctors are talking about it.

Well, shut them up. PRONTO!

Yeah.....that'll be easy.....I'll just use the CCP standard operational procedure. Straight from the playbook.

Hey, someone.....figure out how to blame America and TRUMP.

Don't worry Boss. Those Capitalist Pigs will believe anything from us. They should just consider it "payback," for those tariffs. LOL.

What about our dead here in China?

Well, they died Heros. You know.....in the name of, "CCP World Domination".

Ahhh......let's call it a day.

Rrrright....you in for some Bat Soup tonight?

Aloha, Mark