Headspace and milsurp bolt actions question

Bsteinhauer28 · Apr 30, 2021

Hello All. I recently started my venture into collecting old milsurp rifles and started off with a Type 99 Arisaka and a 91/30 Mosin. Being new to gun ownership and inexperienced with some aspects of inspection I decided to take my Arisaka to a gunsmith (A&C in Gresham/Portland) to have them give the rifle a good lookover. The results of their... brief (that is a whole separate issue) inspection was that the rifle had closed on a no go gauge and a mention of 25+ thousandths excessive headspace (as far as I know they just popped a no go gauge in and charged me 70 bucks). As a result of all this I ordered a field gauge from Pacific Tool and Gauge and popped it in several ways (By virtue of learning experience) and the pictures show where the bolt stopped.

My question to those more experienced with older rifles is should I be worried or am I good to go?

Picture order is fully assembled bolt with the gauge not hooked into the extractor, second is fully assembled bolt with gauge hooked into the extractor, and the last is disassembled bolt (no extractor).

elija_t · Apr 30, 2021

Yup, the rifle is screwed. I'll give you 20 bucks and my half eaten pb&j sandwich to take that dangerous rifle off your hands! (joking)

As long as it doesn't close on the field gauge you're good to go. Its common for some milsurp rifles to close on a no-go, and no-go guages are only really used when adjusting headspace. If you're really worried, just tie it to a board or something and shoot it behind cover. Asisakas have some of the strongest actions of that eras bolt action rifles, so I wouldn't be worried

Pepe-lepew · Apr 30, 2021

If you collect old milsurp than you should learn to reload too. Many older milsurp rifles were not chambered to a standard used today. Reloading allows you to size the brass to the headspace on the rifle. The only part of caution is to make sure there is not any issues with the bolt, receiver or barrel.

Zingger · May 1, 2021

Echoing member Lepew on reloading- after you have fire-formed the brass, you can set up your sizing die to accommodate your chamber's characteristics. As the rifle falls between no-go and field, it should be gtg. Watch for case head separation so you don't have to go fishing.
Enjoy!

Mikej · May 1, 2021

Bsteinhauer28 said:
I decided to take my Arisaka to a gunsmith (A&C in Gresham/Portland) to have them give the rifle a good lookover.

The wife and I went in to http://allisoncareygunworks.com/ ONCE. Wifey and I were both new to guns. I had shot some and just received some of my dad's old guns that he'd not shot in over 50 years. We were in the market for Wifey's first gun, now that I had a nice classic S&W .38 sp. The "Gun Rom" was the first stop.

Allison and Carey was the second. They were every bit as unfriendly as the ol' farts at The Gun Room. I was pretty naïve at the time. You'd think guys who'd been in business as long as these two would recognize noobs and want to help guide them into this great hobby! That was about 11 +/- years ago. Still got a bad taste in my mouth from the experience.

Dozer99 · May 1, 2021

It's an Arisaka. Put a round in the chamber, if the bolt closes and doesn't crush the case, pull the trigger (pointed in a safe direction) and then repeat. Check and see if the barrel is clear and free of any debris first.

The Type 99 was known for being a very strong action. I have never had a problem with mine and I have two that don't close all the way on a go/no go gauge. They do close on a field gauge though and still shoot great!

They are a lot of fun to shoot.

DYODD

Velzey · May 1, 2021

Wow, note to self... other shops charge twice what I do to check headspace...
Ok I'm glad you got a field gauge. Allot of old milsurp rifles will close on a no-go. But not close on the field guage. From the picture the bolt is nowhere near closing on the field. Plenty safe to fire.
For that $75 did they inspect the bore and chamber and let you know how it looked?

7.7 brass is easy to make if you reload.

Bsteinhauer28 · May 1, 2021

Velzey said:
Wow, note to self... other shops charge twice what I do to check headspace...
Ok I'm glad you got a field gauge. Allot of old milsurp rifles will close on a no-go. But not close on the field guage. From the picture the bolt is nowhere near closing on the field. Plenty safe to fire.
For that $75 did they inspect the bore and chamber and let you know how it looked?

7.7 brass is easy to make if you reload.

If they did they didn't say anything about it. As far as I am aware they popped a no go in, got freaked out that it closed on it and refused to fire it and (I presume) inspect anything else. *Correction* they did try to see if it had been rechambered or 30-06 which it had not been.

As far as reloading goes I'm working on getting all the materials together and I ordered 3 bags of PPU brass (50pcs each).

po18guy · May 1, 2021

The rule of thumb for headspace was to cut a circle of masking tape and stick it onto the case head. If the bolt closed easily, there was too much headspace. Works on rimmed cases, but with rimless it can get tricky. Worse comes to worse, you can:
1. buy a surplus bolt and try it.
2. have a good gunsmith turn the barrel in one turn/rechamber.
3. machine the barrel shoulder a few thousandths to correct headspace and re-mount the sights (unless the mount is integral to the barrel).
4. There are others, but $$$

red1992 · Jan 4, 2024

Bsteinhauer28 said:
Hello All. I recently started my venture into collecting old milsurp rifles and started off with a Type 99 Arisaka and a 91/30 Mosin. Being new to gun ownership and inexperienced with some aspects of inspection I decided to take my Arisaka to a gunsmith (A&C in Gresham/Portland) to have them give the rifle a good lookover. The results of their... brief (that is a whole separate issue) inspection was that the rifle had closed on a no go gauge and a mention of 25+ thousandths excessive headspace (as far as I know they just popped a no go gauge in and charged me 70 bucks). As a result of all this I ordered a field gauge from Pacific Tool and Gauge and popped it in several ways (By virtue of learning experience) and the pictures show where the bolt stopped.

My question to those more experienced with older rifles is should I be worried or am I good to go?

Picture order is fully assembled bolt with the gauge not hooked into the extractor, second is fully assembled bolt with gauge hooked into the extractor, and the last is disassembled bolt (no extractor).

View attachment 874051 View attachment 874052 View attachment 874053

I have the same 1! I'm looking for a bayonet

Dozer99 said:
It's an Arisaka. Put a round in the chamber, if the bolt closes and doesn't crush the case, pull the trigger (pointed in a safe direction) and then repeat. Check and see if the barrel is clear and free of any debris first.

The Type 99 was known for being a very strong action. I have never had a problem with mine and I have two that don't close all the way on a go/no go gauge. They do close on a field gauge though and still shoot great!

They are a lot of fun to shoot.

DYODD

I'm looking for a bayonet