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Hathcock's Scope?

Discussion in 'Scopes & Optics' started by OLDNEWBIE, Jun 17, 2015.

  1. OLDNEWBIE

    OLDNEWBIE State of Flux Well-Known Member

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    Reading Henderson's book "Marine Sniper" about Carlos Hathcock and am a little confused about how the Unertl scope he used worked. It talks about how he "pulls the scope back into position" or something like that. So I tried looking it up and I get a pic like this.
    I guess it rides in the mounts and has a recoil spring. Still don't understand it and can't find a vid of it. Seems like it wouldn't hold zero.

    upload_2015-6-17_15-33-29.png
     
  2. Velzey

    Velzey Estacada, Oregon Gunsmith Gunsmith Bronze Vendor Bronze Supporter

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    Under recoil the spring helped keep the scope in position. But the small set screw on top slipped allot, and allot of them didn't have the spring on them at all!
     
  3. OLDNEWBIE

    OLDNEWBIE State of Flux Well-Known Member

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    No spring at all would explain Hathcock "pulling it back" I guess. So it did slide back and forth in the mounts?
    It also looks like it was not adjusted internally but by adjusting screws in the mount?
    Can't figure how this was accurate or held zero. But it did, 93 confirmed kills, many more unconfirmed.
     
  4. AR_PSYCHO

    AR_PSYCHO Beaverton Active Member

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    The scope can slide back and forth through the mounts. That spring you see there is designed to push the scope back into place, but often it doesn't fully seat well. I have to do it sometimes on my 1903. Holds zero very well. All adjustments (save the focal length) are external on the scope mounts.

    DSCN0103_zps1f463847.jpg
    DSCN0104_zps61444cd0.jpg
    DSCN0046_zpscf1e7216.jpg
    DSCN0045_zpsa15d0b01.jpg
     
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  5. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    It's a three point contact with the tube, with two of the contacts being adjustable and the other one is not adjustable but spring loaded.
    The large outer diameter spring is for recoil and you compress the spring for heavier loads and then tighten down the lock ring.

    Looks like this setup.

    09-30-10-04-Unertl-scope-adjustment-knobs-return-spring.jpg
     
    OLDNEWBIE likes this.
  6. OLDNEWBIE

    OLDNEWBIE State of Flux Well-Known Member

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    That's pretty awesome AR- Psycho! Looks fun to shoot with all the history behind it and all. Thanks for clearing this up. If I'm reading something I like to understand it as much as possible.
    That's probably why it takes me a week and a half to finish a book my 11 year old finishes in a day and a half!
     
  7. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    I like the fact that he was the first one to mount that type of scope on a 50 cal machine gun and used it to take out a problematic VC that was harassing the troops in a fire base he was staying at.
    It was at that time an unbelievable 2500 yd shot
     
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  8. OLDNEWBIE

    OLDNEWBIE State of Flux Well-Known Member

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    I'm at the part of the book where he's about to take out the General and he is face to face with a poisonous snake after crawling through tall grass all night and day.

    Good read I think there is another book written about him. Fascinating stuff.
     
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2015
  9. jbett98

    jbett98 NW Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Here's a short bio on him that barely scratches the surface of his accomplishments.

    Marine Corps Sniper Carlos Hathcock
    Posted by Sgt Grit Staff
    Carlos N. Hathcock II
    On May 20th, 1959, at 17 years of age, Carlos N. Hathcock II fulfilled his childhood dream by enlisting in the United States Marine Corps. His ability as a marksman was soon recognized by the instructors on the rifle range at Camp Pendleton where he was undergoing recruit training. Later, while based in Hawaii as a member of Company E, 2nd Battalion, 4th Marines, Carlos won the Pacific Division rifle championship. Following his assignment in Hawaii, Hathcock was transferred to Marine Air Station, Cherry Point, North Carolina, where he quickly found himself shooting competitively again. This time he set the Marine Corps record on the "A" Course with a score of 248 points out of a possible 250, a record that stands today. The highlight of his competitive shooting career occurred in 1965 when Carlos out-shot over 3000 other servicemen competing to win the coveted Wimbledon Cup at Camp Perry.

    This achievement led to his being sought out in Vietnam in 1966 to be part of a newly established sniper program. After his training was completed Carlos began his new assignment. Operating from Hill 55, a position 35 miles South-West of Da Nang, Hathcock and his fellow Marine snipers renewed a Marine tactic which had been born in the islands of the Pacific in World War II. Within a short period of time the effects of the Marine snipers could be felt around Hill 55. Carlos rapidly ran up a toll on the enemy that would eventually lead to a bounty being placed on his head by the NVA.

    As a result of his skill Sergeant Hathcock was twice recruited for covert assignments. One of the them was to kill a Frenchman who was working for the North Vietnamese as an interrogator. This individual was torturing American airmen who had been shot down and captured. One round from Carlos' modified Winchester Model 70 ended the Frenchman's career. On another occasion Sergeant Hathcock accepted an assignment for which he was plainly told that his odds for survival were slim. A North Vietnamese general was the target, and the man died when a bullet fired by Carlos struck him from a range of 800 yards. Hathcock returned to Hill 55 unscathed. In one incredible incident an enemy sniper was killed after a prolonged game of "cat and mouse" between Carlos, with his spotter, and the NVA sniper. The fatal round, fired at 500 yards by Hathcock, passed directly through the NVA sniper's rifle scope, striking him in the eye.

    Hathcock would eventually be credited with 93 enemy confirmed killed, including one Viet Cong shot dead by a round fired from a scope-mounted Browning M-2 .50 caliber machine gun at the unbelievable range of 2500 yards.

    In 1969, during his second tour of duty in Vietnam, Carlos was badly burned while rescuing fellow Marines from a burning Amtrack. The other Marines and Carlos had been riding in the vehicle when it ran over an anti-tank mine. Despite the severity of his wounds it would ultimately be the ravages of Multiple Sclerosis (MS) that would bring Hathcock's extraordinary career to an end. In 1979 he was made to retire on 100% disability due to the advancing stages of the disease.

    Gunnery Sergeant Hathcock has spent subsequent years instructing police tactical units in "counter-sniper" techniques. In 1990 a book entitled Marine Sniper, by Charles Henderson, was published, documenting the exploits of this one-of-a-kind Marine. Regretfully Carlos has yet to receive a penny of royalties from sales of the book, which has been produced both in hard cover and paper-back.

    As this brief history is written he is confined to a wheel chair, struggling against the disease which he knows is terminal. Nonetheless he attempts to get to the police rifle range as often as possible. He still loves the crack of the rifles, the smell of gun powder as it drifts across the range, and the company of good men striving to be the best at what they do. The indomitable Carlos N. Hathcock II is indeed one of the "Few and Proud."
     
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  10. BillM

    BillM Amity OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Looks like they ran them without the recoil spring, and manually returned to index for each shot.
    Found a reference that said the Marines ordered them without spring in WWII. Supposedly
    Col. Townsend Whelen believed that the scope was more accurate when manually indexed---
    and at the time (and even now) his opinion carried considerable weight.
     
  11. OLDNEWBIE

    OLDNEWBIE State of Flux Well-Known Member

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    He has since died in 1999.
    upload_2015-6-17_20-34-56.png
     
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  12. USMC-03

    USMC-03 Moscow on the Willamette (i.e. Portland, Oregon) Well-Known Member

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    Correct. 8x Unertls were never equipped with recoil springs on the M1903a1 sniper rifle and this was carried over to the M70 during the Vietnam war.