Washington Handgun wait times

[User 1234]

If the state improves the process our wait times will shorten. The more the state centralized the process however the easier it will be for anti-gun politicians to manipulate the process to be as lengthy and burdensome as possible.

 

[STEELE]

My SUPER FFL guy is as frustrated as I am. He told me that WA state is now the processor of all checks and that they are either understaffed or incompetent. A recent handgun check took about 10 days. This means that both the FFL and the purchaser have to make at least two trips and two meets. The buyer had just been granted a CPL weeks before. I can't understand why current WA CPL holders and/or retired law enforcement officers who have federal permission under the FLEOSA cannot simply buy on the spot.

 

[Alexx1401]

My SUPER FFL guy is as frustrated as I am. He told me that WA state is now the processor of all checks and that they are either understaffed or incompetent. A recent handgun check took about 10 days. This means that both the FFL and the purchaser have to make at least two trips and two meets. The buyer had just been granted a CPL weeks before. I can't understand why current WA CPL holders and/or retired law enforcement officers who have federal permission under the FLEOSA cannot simply buy on the spot.

Well this is what happens when a LOT of the gun owning public either refuses to vote, or if they vote they actually vote for the people doing this too them. Any more 10 days is considered "good". The Feds told WA ever since the law went in requiring background checks, that they had to set up their own system to do insta checks. The Feds were doing it to help out while the state got it in. State did nothing as they did not care, and did not want to. So finally Feds said we are out. Voters passed a couple new gun control laws that like all of them did zero for slowing criminals, only made it harder for the law abiding. Since the law makers see the voters passing this on their own why should they care? With both of the citizen passed gun laws a huge portion of the gun owning public had zero idea the laws went into effect, they had never heard of them, so of course did not vote against them. So again, why would the law makers here care? If enough gun owners finally get mad, and vote, you will see a change. If not? Well this just gets worse.

 

[gmerkt]

If enough gun owners finally get mad, and vote, you will see a change. If not? Well this just gets worse.

We've been down this worn road before. On average around the country, approx. 30% of people own guns. The other 70% either don't like guns, or don't care. Most of that large number in the "don't care" category can usually be persuaded to vote for new gun laws that emphasize safety. Those middle voters will usually respond favorably to a proposal that is put to them as reasonable and in the interest of public safety. So if you magically get that entire 30% of gun owners to vote, they are not likely to defeat new gun control measures.

I think I-1639 illustrated this in a practical way more than anything we can say here. It was much ballyhooed by the gun-haters as a "common sense measure" to "regulate assault rifles." That's a hot-button issue in this era of mass shootings. The measure passed by nearly 60%. Let's assume that you got every single gun owner to vote against it, that's a theoretical 30%, then you got another 10% of the middle voters who don't own guns to go against it. You were still 10% plus one shy of winning. You just can't beat 60% yes votes. You can blame "lazy gun owners" for not voting, yet if you rounded them all up with a gun pointed at their head and forced them to vote against, you still can't beat 60% for. The arithmetic on this is really quite simple.

 

[Alexx1401]

We've been down this worn road before. On average around the country, approx. 30% of people own guns. The other 70% either don't like guns, or don't care. Most of that large number in the "don't care" category can usually be persuaded to vote for new gun laws that emphasize safety. Those middle voters will usually respond favorably to a proposal that is put to them as reasonable and in the interest of public safety. So if you magically get that entire 30% of gun owners to vote, they are not likely to defeat new gun control measures.

I think I-1639 illustrated this in a practical way more than anything we can say here. It was much ballyhooed by the gun-haters as a "common sense measure" to "regulate assault rifles." That's a hot-button issue in this era of mass shootings. The measure passed by nearly 60%. Let's assume that you got every single gun owner to vote against it, that's a theoretical 30%, then you got another 10% of the middle voters who don't own guns to go against it. You were still 10% plus one shy of winning. You just can't beat 60% yes votes. You can blame "lazy gun owners" for not voting, yet if you rounded them all up with a gun pointed at their head and forced them to vote against, you still can't beat 60% for. The arithmetic on this is really quite simple.

We have been down this worn out road of "we are outnumbered and can do nothing". It sounds real good but the facts are still facts. I know many do not like facts but that will not change them. Look up how many legal gun owners there are in WA state. Then look at how many have signed the petition to repeal 1639. Then tell me the problem is we are outnumbered. Sorry the problem is gun owners. People who keep up with the worn out trope of we are outnumbered are careful to not listen to people who sell guns. As they tell them about the people showing up to buy who still had no idea the last couple new laws even went in. So problem is not being outnumbered when gun owners refuse to give a damn, until it's too late of course. Then the ones who suddenly find out some new law steps on them they scream it's all someone else's fault. Like the NRA, who they of course do not belong to. Yep worn road alright.

 

[gmerkt]

Look up how many legal gun owners there are in WA state.

I already have. The only thing we can go by is survey data. Enough of those have been done to identify that on average around the country, the number is approximately 30%, a number which doesn't support your argument. In Washington state specifically, you can find numbers from 27.7 to 34 percent. Anything drawn from official records, like "registered" firearms is completely unreliable because of the vast number of unregistered guns. Which would tend to the low side anyway.

look at how many have signed the petition to repeal 1639.

Well, some people might not want to sign a document that is sitting out on a counter so anybody in the public can see the addresses in it. Like, "here's where to go to break in and steal guns." I understand that's how the petition works but that alone could be a reason why some people don't want to sign it in a gun shop.

people who sell guns. As they tell them about the people showing up to buy who still had no idea the last couple new laws even went in.

Yes, and these people are all in the 30% of Americans who own guns. Once again I say it, if you get all 30% to vote, it still won't be enough. Don't you get it? You've got to come up with a reason for some part (hopefully 20% plus one) of the other 70% to vote your side. It doesn't help that the anti-gun people have donors with very deep pockets that can donate millions to shape public opinion.

Then the ones who suddenly find out some new law steps on them they scream it's all someone else's fault

YES! You are right! But their vote won't matter because they are still in the 30% who, under prevailing circumstances, will always be outvoted by the other side.

You may talk to owners of gun shops. Their world is kinda small. One in ten people who walk into a gun shop buy a gun for the first time. The other nine are repeat buyers. But think about all the immigrants that are moving into the west coast, filling up apartment buildings. Most of them come from places where legal gun ownership is close to impossible. So unless they are gangsters, not many will ever be part of the gun owners in America. It's just not part of their previous cultural experience.

The chart below says it all. The graph on the left pretty closely matches the 70% of Americans who don't own guns.


Note, see the light blue band in the column on the right supporting stricter gun laws? Those are the elderly GOP voters who always vote yes for "safety" issues.

I get what Alexx1401 thinks might be possible. That if we could get 100% of the 30% who own guns to vote, maybe we could count on only half of the 70% of antis and don't cares to not vote. But half of 70% is still 35%, and counting on the "other side" not to vote is against most hopes because by and large, they are the "get out the vote" people who tend to mobilize their base. Along with the millions of dollars used to do it. I just don't think it's realistic to expect this scenario can come to pass.

I'm not saying gun owners should just give up. I'm saying that the mine of votes in the middle is what we should be going after, not just back-slidden gun owners. And that is a tough nut as things stand right now.

Well, here's another example not directly related to guns. But it's a good one to illustrate the outnumbered situation. In presidential elections, Washington state hasn't gone Republican since going for Ronald Reagan for his second term. That was 1984. Since then, Wash. hasn't gone, win or lose nationally, for any GOP pres. candidate. The most recent presidential election, 2016, Hillary Clinton carried Wash. state by about 500,000 votes. Even though she lost nationally, she got all 32 electoral votes from Washington. So if you are a Donald Trump supporter in Wash., your vote ain't never gonna count for anything.

 

[EPS]

Better yet LOOK UP HOW MANY ILLEGAL HAND GUN OWNERS THERE ARE IN WASHINGTON.
mmmmmmm oh that's right you can't .
There illegal.
Probably both illegal gun owner # stolen gun.
And illegal alian .
But those don't matter to the libs in Olympia.
Just want to control the legal people.

 

[Alexx1401]

Better yet LOOK UP HOW MANY ILLEGAL HAND GUN OWNERS THERE ARE IN WASHINGTON.
mmmmmmm oh that's right you can't .
There illegal.
Probably both illegal gun owner # stolen gun.
And illegal alian .
But those don't matter to the libs in Olympia.
Just want to control the legal people.

Yes sadly every new gun law of course does zero to curb criminals. I would have to guess "most" law makers know full well the laws they are pushing do zero for crime. Especially since almost every single law maker who is pushing more gun laws also pushes making excuses for the criminals who use guns.
Now the "people" is another story. Sadly many gun owners do go for this crap. Some of them really think more laws will make less crime. Many of them think if they give the grabbers some compromise they will be left alone. Sadly anyone who is not with head in sand knows this only goes one way. We lose more. So sadly we have now a LOT of gun owners who try real hard to convince anyone who will listen that there is no hope, we can't win so we should just give up. We are so outnumbered no point. Its really sad to watch it just keep happening.

 

[EPS]

Yes sadly every new gun law of course does zero to curb criminals. I would have to guess "most" law makers know full well the laws they are pushing do zero for crime. Especially since almost every single law maker who is pushing more gun laws also pushes making excuses for the criminals who use guns.
Now the "people" is another story. Sadly many gun owners do go for this crap. Some of them really think more laws will make less crime. Many of them think if they give the grabbers some compromise they will be left alone. Sadly anyone who is not with head in sand knows this only goes one way. We lose more. So sadly we have now a LOT of gun owners who try real hard to convince anyone who will listen that there is no hope, we can't win so we should just give up. We are so outnumbered no point. Its really sad to watch it just keep happening.

I tell all my friends buy another gun.
And buy ammo mags or what ever .
Buy buy buy .
If you don't like the AR15 WHO CARES YOU NEED TO BUY ONE.

But you are right lots of people have just gave up .
Or have they maybe they are just buying guns on the down low and not really talking about it?

 

[Alexx1401]

I tell all my friends buy another gun.
And buy ammo mags or what ever .
Buy buy buy .
If you don't like the AR15 WHO CARES YOU NEED TO BUY ONE.

But you are right lots of people have just gave up .
Or have they maybe they are just buying guns on the down low and not really talking about it?

I keep hoping. Sadly every election time when I think maybe people have had enough, they show me they have not. I don't know how bad it has to get to finally make a bunch of them get off their butt. It is so stupid easy to vote in this state too. Don't even need a stamp any more. All you have to do is fill out and drop in mail. Yet so many still can't be bothered.
Look how much trouble they are having just trying to get the repeal of 1639 on the ballot.

 

[gmerkt]

I would have to guess "most" law makers know full well the laws they are pushing do zero for crime.

Of course they know it. Gun control is about CONTROL. They know there will always be a certain amount of non-preventable crime. This they cannot fully control but one of the reasons some support more gun control is because in many constituencies the voters view it as "something being done." Many anti-gun people believe that if they can get guns away from legitimate users, it's that many fewer guns that have the potential of falling into the wrong hands. Numbers again.

Sadly every election time when I think maybe people have had enough, they show me they have not

It's not just about guns. It's about most everything that goes against people on the right. Seattle is probably one of the worst examples. There hasn't been a tax measure go up on the ballot for the past I don't know how many years that hasn't passed. Any new tax will pass. Because you have a majority of voters now who don't have direct skin in the game. So when their landlord jacks the rent, they just blame Amazon. They never see a tax bill, so they don't have any hesitation for voting for another add-on to it.

 

[grandpaknowall]

Tuesday morning in Oregon it only took me about 15 minutes to wait for my anti 2nd amendment background check.

Why so long? Only took me about 60 seconds.....

 

[Alexx1401]

Why so long? Only took me about 60 seconds.....

Ya, ya, you guys who can still walk in and buy a gun just keep rubbing it in.
I miss the days when it used to take as long to buy a box of handgun ammo as it did to buy the damn gun for it
Of course I know I feel a lot safer now

 

[fredball]

What I have heard from Washington FFLs is five days or less.

where did you here that at some out of the way town with two cops Vancouver Washington is minimum 10days or longer

 

[fredball]

Any firearm that has to go thru what ever sheriffs office will take 10 days or longer
bolt guns and complete or stripped lowers are 10 minutes in Washington state
To bad more gun owners don't pay attention to commie laws like 1639 for example
and vote no on them rant over

 

[fredball]

If you read my original post i was simply asking if the law imposed a wait time on pistols. And if so what were people seeing for times. Personally i have no problem waiting for a gun. If the law keeps people from shooting up schools and businesses I'm all for it

So What you are saying is people like me or any other member on this site (law abiding) are the PEOPLE you are talking about that shoot up schools
REALLY this is why dumb laws like this pass . Laws like 1639 do nothing to stop crazy's from killing / What laws like do is to keep the law abiding from self protection and perpetuate the system & create victims.

 

[fredball]

The mandatory wait times are an infringement and should be stricken by the courts. Are the courts ever going to honor the "shall not be infringed" language strictly as written? Very unlikely.

Waiting periods do not prevent gun deaths because criminals don't buy them at FFLs they buy them on the black market. Some people throughout history have bought guns at an FFL and then decided much later to use them for criminal purposes long after the waiting period expired. There are also people who are dead today because they could not take their self defense firearms with them to "gun free zones" or take them home in a timely manner. Waiting periods are another "feel good" gun control measure. Did Kate Steinle's killer get his handgun legally? No, it was stolen from a cop.

Not if Left wing Lunatics continue to be voted into office in washington state they think the gubberment is the solution to everything gubberment is the problem not the solution

 

[Alexx1401]

If you read my original post i was simply asking if the law imposed a wait time on pistols. And if so what were people seeing for times. Personally i have no problem waiting for a gun. If the law keeps people from shooting up schools and businesses I'm all for it

How much wait time should there be for people who want to rent or buy a truck then? Surely that would stop people making them into weapons, right?

 

[shibbershabber]

Any improvements on times?

I bought my first post-1639 handgun yesterday... Wondering what its like in Clark County?

I left same day with a lever gun but who knows how long to take home an old beat to bubblegum Model 10....
Well at least the people of WA are safer for it.

 

[irwinhn1]

Any improvements on times?

I bought my first post-1639 handgun yesterday... Wondering what its like in Clark County?

I left same day with a lever gun but who knows how long to take home an old beat to bubblegum Model 10....
Well at least the people of WA are safer for it.

I can't speak for Clark county, but I bought a pistol in Snohomish county last monday and it was ready to be picked up a week later. So 5ish business days