Guy who sold cop killer the gun is arrested

[John Brown]

BAN HIM!!!

Wise guy!

Addendum:

The guy admitted to an undercover buyer, that he didn't care about criminal records, and he didn't ask, and he didn't need to know.

So he does deserve what he gets. Not very bright.

 

[wired]

Wise guy!

Addendum:

The guy admitted to an undercover buyer, that he didn't care about criminal records, and he didn't ask, and he didn't need to know.

So he does deserve what he gets. Not very bright.

He doesnt have to "care" but if he does have prior knowledge that he is selling to a convicted felon then he is breaking the law. He doesnt have to ask and him not needing to know is his opinion only. If it can be proven in a court of law that he knew he was selling to a convicted felon then he can be convicted.

 

[mjbskwim]

Now I'm just sayin' here

There is only one gun dealer involved or mentioned.
So far.

Maybe this guy was screwing up big time?
Maybe he did sell guns to the wrong people,knowingly?
Why else did they target him?Just seems the guys who get investigated were pushing the limits anyway.

I mean the gun shows have been going on in Puyallup for a long time.Without any incident,that I remember,but this one.

Kinda like people taking the Bull's eyes' side.Now he screwed up big time.He got off easy.

We do need to weed these sorts out.It makes the rest of us law abiding gun owners look bad.

Maybe he didn't know who he was selling to.We aren't required to ask for any ID to sell a gun in this state.We can't sell to know felons,but if we don't know,how can they prove we did?

Was he selling the guns as private sales or thru his FFL?

From the drawing,I think I know the guy.He always seemed like a good dealer to me.

And wired,if what John Brown said is true,the guy is a dope for answering a question like that.
A guy asks me about selling to felons/criminal records and he is no longer a customer.
I would tell them everybody needs a CCL and drivers license.
Besides,they do a back round check to be a member of WAC and you can't sell to a non memeber.
Just a stupid question to ask/answer at a gun show.Plus everyone knows the governments hate gun shows

Ever seen how small they can make a camera?

Hate to see these things happen.I believe they go to most shows too.

 

[CharlesAFerg]

From the sound of that article, the guy is a straw-purchaser for multiple crooks.

Yeah, but how? I don't see anything even remotely damning. he's got lots of money and a firearm collection. He's an old guy, is this not typical of an old firearms collector?

It doesn't say that he did this before. He likely had no idea that the buyer was going to do what he was going to do.

You sell a car privately to another person.
He gets drunk and drives over a bunch of kids waiting at a bus stop.
Turns out he had past convictions for drunk driving.
You're going to jail for selling him the car.

The bottom line is that it makes a person responsible for what another person does. If the guy is a genuine dealer, and he's routinely helping people bypass the law, that's a horse of another color. But a successful prosecution of something like this potentially enables the average Joe (like me) to do hard time for selling a gun to someone without a background check (which is perfectly legal in WA).

Agreed.

 

[Dell_dude]

Basically, from what I've read elsewhere, the Feds are going after him for being an unlicensed dealer.

He was not an FFL, but the volume of guns he was buying and selling was enough that it was either his sole or major source of income.

If that is the case, (not sure if it is, like I said, I just read it somewhere else), then he's probably screwed.

 

[John Brown]

Correct. The Monfort gun is NOT the issue.

 

[Trlsmn]

Regarding the monthly Puyallup (and Monroe) show, that is already the case...no NICS check, no sale. I believe that the news article is factually incorrect.

That's the way I understood it too so article leaves me confused as to the actual guilt of the seller.

 

[Trlsmn]

Ok...I'm gonna leave now. I can see myself getting banned. But I thought we should know, and be prepared for Gwegwar and her minions to have a field day with this.

No reason for a ban here, it is a relevant topic and a situation I been expecting to see here eventually, it needs to be discussed.

I see people that are not dealers that are "flipping" a lot of guns and in that back of my mind I've been expecting the heat to come down on someone eventually.

 

[Sawdust]

That's the way I understood it too so article leaves me confused as to the actual guilt of the seller.

It's not about "actual guilt" it is about the perception presented to the public.

Now all the people out there (general public) that are going to jump on the band wagon for "more reasonable gun laws" are always missing the main point. Laws will NEVER prevent a crime! Laws are only there to keep the honest people honest. The laws can only be enforced AFTER a crime has been committed.

Rant over.

 

[vico512]

Yeah, it's unclear, to me, after reading the Times article, of the actual facts. If, in fact, Monfort had no criminal record (and could pass the NICS check), he would be authorized to belong to WAC and buy guns there. If not, then he would have to buy from a private party but not while at a WAC show. With most of these articles, the research (and premature conclusions) typically leave a lot to be desired.

I agree with an earlier comment -- I don't believe that Monfort is the real issue here. It's unfortunate that he is, due to the tragic & well publicized loss of the officer, and all of the bad publicity attached to the incident.

 

[deen_ad]

How is prosecuting people who sell guns to convicted felons not a good thing? Am I missing something? Don't they run background checks at gun shows?

of personally owned weapons do not require any background checks anywhere. Looks to me like the BATF is going to go after as many private sellers as they can. They don't even have to win the case in court, just by illegally charging and prosecuting someone they force them to spend large amounts of money to defend themselves in court.

Same thing happened in Texas a while back where a gentleman sold a gun to illegal immigrants (that were working with BATF). Gentlemen is doing two years in prison and the illegals are walking free.

--------------------------------------

The "Trade Ratings" is low by 3!
Some people just don't post it I guess

Deen
NRA Benefactor/Recruiter
WAC member
ACSWW member

 

[deen_ad]

They feds and the state will have to prove he knew they were felons before he sold them guns. That is going to be a very heavy burden of evidence. He may be charged with something but its unlikely he will be convicted. A law school dropout could get him off on the flimsy evidence they will have to work with.

he will have to spend big $$ to defend himself, none of which he can get back from the Feds for the illegal prosecution.

--------------------------------------

The "Trade Ratings" is low by 3!
Some people just don't post it I guess

Deen
NRA Benefactor/Recruiter
WAC member
ACSWW member

 

[Outrider]

According to the U.S. attorney's office which filed the complaint, David Devenny knew that he was selling to a prohibited person. The first one was a guy with a felony conviction and the second one was a guy with a domestic violence conviction.

Granted, it's going to be interesting to hear how he knew. Maybe the guys walked up to the table at a WAC show without their own WAC badges (since they can't pass a NICS check to get one) and told the guy they can't pass a background check and he said he didn't care and he'd sell to them anyway. Some people are into willful ignorance. There's probably more to the story than what we're hearing and it may take a six to twelve months to learn what the real deal was.

 

[nwg19]

The seller is a member over at Seattle Guns, goes by handlebar dave. He has something like 150 positive transactions with members there. I've seen him at the Puyallup shows with a table, and talked to him a few times. He seemed OK, but who knows?
If Monfort wasn't a member, there are always members who just pass their phone number to someone and meet them later away from the fairgrounds.
Apparently the feds ran the gun that killed Officer Brenton, the registered owner said he sold it to handlebar dave.
Of course that is not what dave was arrested for. From what I heard one of the undercover cops told him he has a conviction for domestic violence and dave said I don't want to hear about it and sold him the gun. Not smart, I would have walked away from that sale.
I try to sell to folks who have really good feedback at the forums, and I want to see their concealed weapons permit and ID. Not much more we can do, ya just hope somebody legal doesn't go nuts and kill someone with a gun that came from you.
This is a mess, and yes they will use this against gunshows, and firearms ownership in general. And we have a dead cop. This couldn't be much worse.

<broken link removed>

 

[johnny5]

The good people of this country are being put a pond by the gun grabbers of this country they don't care about whether you protect your family from criminals .that is not there concern.all they want is to control what you say and do that they disagree on. if you want to keep your guns in this country your going to have to fight the state and federal governments.Its time to quit voting the same people in to office that only think of how much money they can get in there pockets rather than what the people want.People should get rid of the same old crap thats in office.get people who will ask what you want.The majority should rule.Not minority lets ask the public what they want not just a selected few. Get a peoples party for the people not the special interest group.get rid of the republican and the democratic parties and get one for the people .that all folks.

 

[Outrider]

Where can a guy read that first hand? As a 07 FFL holder and a gun show vendor I'm very interested in reading the charges in total.

The US Attorney's Office for the Western District of Washington has a website. On it, you can find a press release regarding the Devenny case. Here is the link: <broken link removed>

In the press release, the word "complaint" is written in red. Click on it and you can download a copy of the Devenny Complaint as a 12 page PDF file.

 

[bullet lady]

Here is a link to a story that gives a better explanation of the "true" details of the arrest: <broken link removed>

 

[John Brown]

Just another article that leaves it hanging. Shame on you Dave. WHATS THE CRIME????????? Where are the details on what ACTUAL law was broken? Hello???

 

[mjbskwim]

Kinda like a points system.
Guys talk about points for getting draw tags,nascar has a points system,golf does I think.
Your wife or girlfriend too

Well if you screw up you get points.When the powers that be,hear your name enough,they remember you (points)
Then if they hear of you enough they want to collect your points.

Don't let the ATF and the rest hear of you and they won't arrest you.

Hundreds of FFLs out there.You think they just pulled this guys name out of a hat?
These guys want arrests that will stick too you know

 

[revjen45]

"Either ATF framed this guy or he is in "a heap of trouble", as it were."
If he was framed, he's still in deep guano.
.
I almost never sell my guns, but if I were going to I would either know the person well, or want to see a WA DL and CCL.