Guns, like people, get old... and usually not better. A rant....

[CamoDeafie]

That really depends on what is defined as "able bodied" though but realistically.. I am not as able bodied as the average soldier is.. however... I can contribute to defense through other methods as a support personnel, by way of repairing gear, modifying, making new gear, that sort of thing. I can defend myself and my wife with the guns I have, in a limited range engagement, and support others doing the same, however one should not expect every person to be able to run long distances, be very active in combat situations, and juggle the priorities in combat at home... so there are many other ways to provide support for the sharp end of the spear so to speak maybe its being a mechanic, transport driver, gearmaker, medical support, electronic intelligence, information brokering, communications, refuelling depot type of work, farming/providing food, cooks, I'm sute there are many other ways to support the local militia needs that doesnt require thr persons to be as fit and healthy as the combat personnel need to be... healthy, yes that is a requirement regardless of role, fit? That depends. My doctor says I'm healthy, BP, cholesterol, blood tests all said I'm healthy, just overweight, however these tests dont show how unfit or fit I am for strenuous physical activities... so there is that. I do try to eat proper amounts of good food, and some physical activities... I have no illusion that I would not be able to keep up with a long range,high speed patrol type of unit, unless I'm the jeep driver

The High-Point is a 9mm carbine. Ugly as sin, but always, always goes bang and accurately too. I estimate I've put roughly about a 1000 rounds downrange through it. Not a single ftf or fte. It's my truck gun. Only holds 10+1, but I have added an attachment that holds 2 spare, fully loaded magazines to it's stock.

Theres the equally ugly, donkey dong looking 20rd Redball magazines that also works pretty good for them. I have 4 of these mags and 5 of the factory 10rd mags... and a shoulder bag to carry them. I agree, they may be ugly, but they are pretty reliable and simple to put together..much like the old British STEN guns and to an extent, like the M3 Grease gun and similarly simple guns. Their handguns though.. have had a reputation of being less reliable than the carbines.. how much of that is due to the shooter limpwristing or due to how theyre made.. I am not sure.

Ar15s.... tuned just right... 100000% reliable. Tuned wrong? Well. Theres the problems. Any of which could be solved pretty easily if ya got the parts and patience for it

 

[User 1234]

I think that ugly reliable guns serve a very important role. The "gun snob club" definitely does not include me.

 

[Kruel J]

I think that ugly reliable guns serve a very important role. The "gun snob club" definitely does not include me.

Lots think Glocks are ugly.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Lots think Glocks are ugly.

Quite a few think AR15s are ugly

 

[Kruel J]

Quite a few think AR15s are ugly

Very true.

 

[User 1234]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Someday I will have a Sharps.

 

[x2ndxall]

Lots think Glocks are ugly.

They are.

 

[11Charlie]

They are.

Maybe but they can be dolled up!

 

[MannyGlocks]

I read on this thread people being described as 'mall ninjas' for owning an AR15.

I don't care as I think those who do the name calling are dem/commie nanny state types who wouldn't defend themselves in a life or death scenario, but hope someone else will save their bacon (AR's ownership would be greatly appreciated at that time) if they're assaulted.

I'm not in the least dismayed if an anti cares to mock my ownership of guns.

However, when he/she had the chance to get a CHL and buy a gun/practice for self defense, if later importuned to help them with their non-gun conviction, I'll have to let them deal with their life or death situation on their own.

I'm not an LEO and my gun is for my family and me.

Is that harsh of me?

Nope.

Quick story: A few years back sitting in a chair smoking a fine, hand rolled, premium cigar in a cigar store. A new guy comes in, notices I'm carrying. Sits down, eventually announces in a voice dripping with holier than thou fervor that he'd 'never carry a gun'.

I responded OK: Are you married/children? His response: Yes

I asked if he, his wife and children found themselves in a life/death/assault situation would he want my assistance with my gun to save him and his family or turn away my gun help?

He said he'd want my help with my gun.

I just looked at him and said nothing further.

 

[User 1234]

Not everyone who owns an AR is a mall ninja. Not everyone who owns an AR leaves their brass behind or does mag dumps right next to someone sighting in a scope.

 

[oli700]

That really depends on what is defined as "able bodied" though but realistically.. I am not as able bodied as the average soldier is.. however... I can contribute to defense through other methods as a support personnel, by way of repairing gear, modifying, making new gear, that sort of thing. I can defend myself and my wife with the guns I have, in a limited range engagement, and support others doing the same, however one should not expect every person to be able to run long distances, be very active in combat situations, and juggle the priorities in combat at home... so there are many other ways to provide support for the sharp end of the spear so to speak maybe its being a mechanic, transport driver, gearmaker, medical support, electronic intelligence, information brokering, communications, refuelling depot type of work, farming/providing food, cooks, I'm sute there are many other ways to support the local militia needs that doesnt require thr persons to be as fit and healthy as the combat personnel need to be... healthy, yes that is a requirement regardless of role, fit? That depends. My doctor says I'm healthy, BP, cholesterol, blood tests all said I'm healthy, just overweight, however these tests dont show how unfit or fit I am for strenuous physical activities... so there is that. I do try to eat proper amounts of good food, and some physical activities... I have no illusion that I would not be able to keep up with a long range,high speed patrol type of unit, unless I'm the jeep driver


Theres the equally ugly, donkey dong looking 20rd Redball magazines that also works pretty good for them. I have 4 of these mags and 5 of the factory 10rd mags... and a shoulder bag to carry them. I agree, they may be ugly, but they are pretty reliable and simple to put together..much like the old British STEN guns and to an extent, like the M3 Grease gun and similarly simple guns. Their handguns though.. have had a reputation of being less reliable than the carbines.. how much of that is due to the shooter limpwristing or due to how theyre made.. I am not sure.

Ar15s.... tuned just right... 100000% reliable. Tuned wrong? Well. Theres the problems. Any of which could be solved pretty easily if ya got the parts and patience for it

Everyone has a place , everyone has value . I'm a division sup and sometimes operations chief for an Oregon type1 imt. I often meet governors and such . When they want to meet hero's I take them to the guy who puts gas in our rigs first .

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Lets see a .223 vs one of @AndyinEverson muskets, hmmm which one is most likely more lethal.

Both are "equally lethal"....If I were to shoot a deer with a .223 or a musket ball...as long as the shot placement is good...then its still a dead deer , no matter what.

Both are subject to the same basic safety rules...finger off the trigger until you are ready to shoot and keep your muzzle pointed in a safe direction.

One may be able to argue that the .223 rifle could put more rounds in the air or on target at a given time , than the musket...
But...
I would then state that its only the bullets that hit what you want , that really matter , the rest is just flash and noise.
I'd rather have one good shot , than 30 bad ones...

I have said it before and I'll say so again...
If all I had was my Hawken Rifle and I needed to defend myself ....I wouldn't curl up and wait to die , 'cause it was all that I had.
In fact if I had my Hawken , I might be better off as I know this rifle inside and out and have been shooting it almost exclusively for over 20 years now....
Andy

 

[CamoDeafie]

Which famous person said this...

beware the man with but one gun, for he knows how to use it

 

[DuneHopper]

Both are "equally lethal"....If I were to shoot a deer with a .223 or a musket ball...as long as the shot placement is good...then its still a dead deer , no matter what.

Both are subject to the same basic safety rules...finger off the trigger until you are ready to shoot and keep your muzzle pointed in a safe direction.

One may be able to argue that the .223 rifle could put more rounds in the air or on target at a given time , than the musket...
But...
I would then state that its only the bullets that hit what you want , that really matter , the rest is just flash and noise.
I'd rather have one good shot , than 30 bad ones...

I have said it before and I'll say so again...
If all I had was my Hawken Rifle and I needed to defend myself ....I wouldn't curl up and wait to die , 'cause it was all that I had.
In fact if I had my Hawken , I might be better off as I know this rifle inside and out and have been shooting it almost exclusively for over 20 years now....
Andy

All know is being shot by a musket is not something I desire, was shot once in the foot by
a friend. So do not like being shot in any case. But just something about a musket reminds me of being shot by a canon. They tell me as a kid I shot a few muskets from of all people a guy who lived just ten miles from where I live now. But was done in the bay lands California. Reminds me when my dad had to go target shooting for sea gulls. The city paid him to go out and kill 1000's as they were all infected with something. They were not sick, just infected. Guess thats how they dealt with it. I went out with him a few times. Really helped me hone in my skill having to hit these birds with a rifle not a shot gun in flight.
Ummm ok that thought went off topic sorry.. was same area where we always went shooting, I do not remember the Muskets, but really remember the gulls well.....anyways thats how the story took flight.... pun intended.

 

[Wstrickl]

Kel tecs are awesome. I have yet to own a bad one. U can buy some pretty junk ar's so bashing on a kel tec as a harbor freight gun is just silly. In that case dpms is in the bob the builder tool set of firearms. Lol

 

[Mygrainman]

Buying a cheap gun such as a Hi-Point or a Kel-Tec is like buying tools from Harbor Freight. Most are junk, but every now and then the sun shines the right way and you get a good one. The difference is you're not fixing your vehicle, you're defending your life and your loved ones.

Why risk it?

Because 30 rounds of .22 Mag that's why...
The PMR30 is a loud, obnoxious, fire breathing monster.. and probably the funnest pistol I've ever shot!
Can't wait for the new .22lr version. Only other keltec I'd own is the KSG.
I wouldn't really trust any of the Florida made guns with my life...I have other "tools" for that application.
Each tool has is purpose. Kel-Tec is innovative if nothing else...
They give us fun affordable alternatives to the SCARs, Tavors, Five-Sevens, etc.
it's companys like PSA and Bear creek that grind my gears.
Flooding the market with cheap crap that drives the value of decent guns into the dirt because most people don't understand why a BCM AR should cost $1500 when they can get an identical "looking" rifle from PSA for $400.

 

[CamoDeafie]

it's companys like PSA and Bear creek that grind my gears.
Flooding the market with cheap crap that drives the value of decent guns into the dirt because most people don't understand why a BCM AR should cost $1500 when they can get an identical "looking" rifle from PSA for $400.

where do they get their forgings/parts from though...... If I rememebr correctly, there's not exactly many companies making the receiver forgings and the basic parts are everywhere?
This is also why having a set of known roll marks posted and brand quality/quantity is helpful. I have a Sarco sourced AR15 build, I would never claim it to be as good as a COLT or BCM; But I can attest that the parts used, at least seem to be of decent quality. The same for PSA parts (I once built a PSA Ar15 and sold it off....) THe hard part is making sure that the BCG and such were quality....

 

[Kruel J]

The BCG and the barrel are where it's at really.

 

[Kruel J]

Because 30 rounds of .22 Mag that's why...
The PMR30 is a loud, obnoxious, fire breathing monster.. and probably the funnest pistol I've ever shot!
Can't wait for the new .22lr version. Only other keltec I'd own is the KSG.
I wouldn't really trust any of the Florida made guns with my life...I have other "tools" for that application.
Each tool has is purpose. Kel-Tec is innovative if nothing else...
They give us fun affordable alternatives to the SCARs, Tavors, Five-Sevens, etc.
it's companys like PSA and Bear creek that grind my gears.
Flooding the market with cheap crap that drives the value of decent guns into the dirt because most people don't understand why a BCM AR should cost $1500 when they can get an identical "looking" rifle from PSA for $400.

I really wanted to like the PMR 30, but too many issues with them. What good is 30 rounds if you can only send a few and then clear, tap, rack and repeat?

 

[Mygrainman]

where do they get their forgings/parts from though...... If I rememebr correctly, there's not exactly many companies making the receiver forgings and the basic parts are everywhere?
This is also why having a set of known roll marks posted and brand quality/quantity is helpful. I have a Sarco sourced AR15 build, I would never claim it to be as good as a COLT or BCM; But I can attest that the parts used, at least seem to be of decent quality. The same for PSA parts (I once built a PSA Ar15 and sold it off....) THe hard part is making sure that the BCG and such were quality....

For me it's all about the barrels and BCGs... but mostly barrels.