JavaScript is disabled
Our website requires JavaScript to function properly. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser settings before proceeding.
I do not think Obama is going to let the congress do anything stupid on the way out, but I could be wrong. Obama is still thinking he has a shot at a second term and doing anything involving guns would hurt that chance. I truly believe the scariest outcome for gun owners would be Obama in a second term with nothing to lose.

Yeah, a second term would be even worse. I have no idea what Obama is thinking of his chances of a second term at this point. I see the polls that show not many people are happy with the president or congress. I have a feeling they have some tricks up their sleeves though.
 
LOL. Of course when something is brought up about Constitutional violations, there is always someone to bring Bush up immediately! Bush is not our president anymore! I didn't like some of the crap Bush did either!

The fact is that Bush is long gone. Obama is president now. He is stomping on the constitution as well as the will of the people in a way I haven't really seen in my lifetime. What is new is that people are fed up with it!

The government is supposed to have a healthy fear of it's citizens. That fear is obviously long gone. If we do not do something soon, this country will be unrecognizable as the United States. You may be o.k. with that, but I am not.

Maybe that's because Bush robbed us of constitutional freedoms while "Patriots" sat on the side lines and did nothing and in some cases cheered it on. The same people that are now becoming whiny little girls over Obamas every move.

Why weren't they fed up with it during Bush's reign?

Right, because he's not a democrat.

Does anyone else seem to see the irony, that a democrat gets elected office and it's like somebody flipped a switch that caused every other internet poster with a conservative bias to start shouting "THE GUBBERMINT!!!!"

You guys are years behind the game, this is the same stuff that we have been talking about since before Obama was even a presidential candidate. And it's too late.
 
Maybe that's because Bush robbed us of constitutional freedoms while "Patriots" sat on the side lines and did nothing and in some cases cheered it on. The same people that are now becoming whiny little girls over Obamas every move.

Why weren't they fed up with it during Bush's reign?

Right, because he's not a democrat.

Does anyone else seem to see the irony, that a democrat gets elected office and it's like somebody flipped a switch that caused every other internet poster with a conservative bias to start shouting "THE GUBBERMINT!!!!"

You guys are years behind the game, this is the same stuff that we have been talking about since before Obama was even a presidential candidate. And it's too late.

First off, this isn't about Democrat vs. Republican! If we do not get past the rediculous labels, we are going to go down as a country. Have you ever heard "united we stand, divided we fall"? Most Republicans and Democrats are seperated by a couple of issues. I think most of us love this country, and don't really want to live in a society where are children are in debt, and servants to their government. Am I wrong there?

This is where I stand. I have two little kids. I want my kids to grow up in the United States that I grew up in. I do not want them to grow up in some European knockoff where their freedoms are very limited and the government is their master. That is where we are headed at a fast rate.

You assume that I am a big Bush fan because I am a conservative. You assume wrong. I did not like the fact that Bush did nothing about the illegal immigration problem. I really did not like the Patriot Act, and I was very vocal about that at the time he put it in place. There was actually a lot of stuff I didn't like about Bush.

I will say this however. The difference between Bush and Obama is huge.
 
First off, this isn't about Democrat vs. Republican! If we do not get past the rediculous labels, we are going to go down as a country. Have you ever heard "united we stand, divided we fall"? Most Republicans and Democrats are seperated by a couple of issues. I think most of us love this country, and don't really want to live in a society where are children are in debt, and servants to their government. Am I wrong there?

This is where I stand. I have two little kids. I want my kids to grow up in the United States that I grew up in. I do not want them to grow up in some European knockoff where their freedoms are very limited and the government is their master. That is where we are headed at a fast rate.

You assume that I am a big Bush fan because I am a conservative. You assume wrong. I did not like the fact that Bush did nothing about the illegal immigration problem. I really did not like the Patriot Act, and I was very vocal about that at the time he put it in place. There was actually a lot of stuff I didn't like about Bush.

I will say this however. The difference between Bush and Obama is huge.

I wasn't assuming you were a big fan of Bush. I'm glad you were vocal about it, because most conservatives I saw cheered the patriot act on.

I wish this weren't about republican vs. Democrat. I am neither of these things. But this is what it is. A democrat is elected office and suddenly everything that happens is an action of tyranny. Literally over night these opinions changed.

If McCain had made office, and did the same things Obama has done we would not see this reaction that we do now.

I'm glad you can see past the party bias, unfortunately it's not something many can do..
 
I wasn't assuming you were a big fan of Bush. I'm glad you were vocal about it, because most conservatives I saw cheered the patriot act on.

I think some people cheered it on because of the situation. We had just been attacked on a fairly large scale, and people were seeking security. The problem is that Ben Franklin said it best when he said, "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." I did not like the Patriot Act because of the potential for violation of constitutional rights.

I wish this weren't about republican vs. Democrat. I am neither of these things. But this is what it is. A democrat is elected office and suddenly everything that happens is an action of tyranny. Literally over night these opinions changed. If McCain had made office, and did the same things Obama has done we would not see this reaction that we do now.

That is part of the problem I have. McCain very likely would have done similar things. I don't really consider McCain much of a conservative. I will say that with McCain, I don't think our gun rights would be in quite the same jeapordy though. I didn't think we had a good choice in the last election to be quite honest.

I would also remind you that Democrats were speculating that Bush would call an emergency, put matial law in place, and start a dictatorship. I think there has been a distrust of opposing political parties. It is almost like the U.S. and the Soviet Union during the cold war. The problem is that the majority of us are citizens with a similar picture of what we want our country to be. Many people have been pitted against their neighbors by political parties. We the people have not gained from this at all!

I'm glad you can see past the party bias, unfortunately it's not something many can do..

I sincerely hope that people start seeing past party lines soon. I truly believe some of these issues might unite people.
 
What, you think three years and winning the presidency has changed his mind?...

I think what he is saying isn't so much that Obama's position may have changed, but the circumstances certainly have. The president isn't exactly riding the wave of popularity that he had going for him a little while ago. He may also no longer be under the illusion that his "idealistic ambitions" will be accepted by the country.... As well as the article seeming alarmist because old information is being presented as new revelations.

It seems like those buying into that kind of sensationalism actually WANT there to be an attack on our rights, just so it would justify their opinions and positions. They said it was gonna happen right after Obama took office, it didn't. Every time there's a nationally-reported shooting, someone invariably says, "Well here we go, they're gonna use this to take away our gun rights! Hello AWB Pt. II..." According to the nation's most prominent anti-gun lobby, there's been over 200 mass shootings since the current administration took office, and yet the administration has done nothing. The doomsayers just keep saying, just wait for it, it's coming. They spend all of this time, effort, resources, energy in fending off attacks that never materialize they completely lost sight of the fact that maybe they should advancing gun rights rather than protecting them from thus-far nonexistent attacks.

It's no different than people who predict the end of the world. Oh sure, Nostradamus said the world would end in 1996, but it didn't happen, fortunately Y2K was too far off so the doomsayers could say, "Oh, here it comes for real this time!" Once more nothing. Terry Cook said the armageddon would go down in 2001, and 9 years later we're still here. Now we got folks waiting on the phony baloney 12/21/2012 prophecy, convinced that this time this is really it. It seems like there's actually genuine disappointment every time it doesn't happen.

Are there really threats out there? You bet! Are there really people out there that would take away your rights given the opportunity? Of course. But the more time and focus is wasted on sensationalist and alarmist claims, the less there's left for advancing rather than being perpetually stuck in defensive mode and doing nothing.
 
It seems like those buying into that kind of sensationalism actually WANT there to be an attack on our rights, just so it would justify their opinions and positions. They said it was gonna happen right after Obama took office, it didn't. Every time there's a nationally-reported shooting, someone invariably says, "Well here we go, they're gonna use this to take away our gun rights! Hello AWB Pt. II..." According to the nation's most prominent anti-gun lobby, there's been over 200 mass shootings since the current administration took office, and yet the administration has done nothing. The doomsayers just keep saying, just wait for it, it's coming. They spend all of this time, effort, resources, energy in fending off attacks that never materialize they completely lost sight of the fact that maybe they should advancing gun rights rather than protecting them from thus-far nonexistent attacks.

It's no different than people who predict the end of the world. Oh sure, Nostradamus said the world would end in 1996, but it didn't happen, fortunately Y2K was too far off so the doomsayers could say, "Oh, here it comes for real this time!" Once more nothing. Terry Cook said the armageddon would go down in 2001, and 9 years later we're still here. Now we got folks waiting on the phony baloney 12/21/2012 prophecy, convinced that this time this is really it. It seems like there's actually genuine disappointment every time it doesn't happen.

I would point out that it is much different than people who predict the end of the world. First off, to be worried about the implementation of a second assault weapons ban, there had to already be a first. It was tried, and passed during the Clinton administration when Democrats had control as they do now. It is a similar situation with a much more liberal president.

There is no question if the powers that be want strict gun laws passed. They are on record saying that they do! It was not the first issue they were going to attack. Do you really think that Obama will leave office without trying to push some gun control?

We have also watched all of the other places who have lost their gun rights, such as England and even Australia. I would rather have people too sensitive when it comes to losing their gun rights, than not sensitive enough.
 
Thank you, Raftman, for putting this in perspective. And... let's remember, it is gun owners who are creating problems for their own, by hoarding ammo and guns based on an over hyped threat. Gun owners who went out and bought all the ammo they could find when Obama was elected, based on the idea that.... what... he would start a nationwide tax on ammo sales? REALLY? Let's remember that gun owners are responsible for, essentially, destroying firearm use by making ammunition scarce for over a year. I COULDN'T FIND ANY TWENTY TWO AMMO AVAILABLE ANYWHERE FOR A PERIOD OF TIME. We have met the enemy, and he is us. So, I'm asking that we, as gun owners, try to not do what we did before. Let's not freak out and hoard ammo or guns. Let's not screw up the shooting hobby (again) because we are worried about the Democratic administration.
 
Let's not freak out and hoard ammo or guns. Let's not screw up the shooting hobby (again) because we are worried about the Democratic administration.

Shooting hobby? The stakes were and are a heck of a lot higher than that for me. I'm one of your enemies, the hoarders, I spent time almost every day looking for components and primers (Not much for ammo) and still think I did the right thing.

The reaction so many of us had did not go without notice by the new administration, it was a true revelation to them as they began for the first time to see patriots as a real force opposed to their socio/marxist "Change". They actually believed for a while that they had carte blanche to dismantle the American dream, and the vision suddenly turned to one of blood running in the streets and that of their bodies lying unburied in the gutters.
 
I would point out that it is much different than people who predict the end of the world. First off, to be worried about the implementation of a second assault weapons ban, there had to already be a first. It was tried, and passed during the Clinton administration when Democrats had control as they do now. It is a similar situation with a much more liberal president.

And whether your believe the Biblical history of the world or the history presented by the prevailing scientific theories, the world has ended before too.

What's more... though the AWB did occur during Clinton's presidency and the Dems had control. One might also recall what happened after the fact. The Dems lost control and it took a lot of fouling up by the Republicans to convince America to give the Dems another chance. Presently the Dems are already losing favor and fast. Taking strong anti-gun steps would only hasten that decline. I suspect many or most of them know it.

It's not a question of whether it's happened before, but the likelihood that it will happen again. The circumstances of today are different from those of past. It's kind of like the gamblers fallacy. If you've got a dime, and you flip it, and it lands on heads... that outcome has no influence whatsoever on the outcome if you flip the dime once more. I guess that's true even if the dime is loaded.
 
I'm sorry, but his argument opens with a case that President Obama recently 'dropped his cagey and coy dissembling' and 'is no longer laying low on the issue' -- and claims for support an article written in 2007 before Obama was even on the ballot for President.

The guy should go back to High School Debating 101 if that's the best he can do.

+1:s0155:
 
What we need are "common sense" laws on freedom of religion, also we need to register, license, and tax religious transactions as well as establish religion free zones and ban religion in urban at risk areas and cities, also a government database should be kept for public safety...........:p

Now that scares me!:(
 
The fact is that Bush is long gone. Obama is president now. He is stomping on the constitution as well as the will of the people in a way I haven't really seen in my lifetime. What is new is that people are fed up with it.

Please, elaborate on what parts of the Constitution that President Obama has "stomped on". I don't agree with the President's views on gun control, but I certainly have not seen any Constitution stomping.:D
 
First off, this isn't about Democrat vs. Republican! If we do not get past the rediculous labels, we are going to go down as a country. Have you ever heard "united we stand, divided we fall"? Most Republicans and Democrats are seperated by a couple of issues. I think most of us love this country, and don't really want to live in a society where are children are in debt, and servants to their government. Am I wrong there?

This is where I stand. I have two little kids. I want my kids to grow up in the United States that I grew up in. I do not want them to grow up in some European knockoff where their freedoms are very limited and the government is their master. That is where we are headed at a fast rate.

You assume that I am a big Bush fan because I am a conservative. You assume wrong. I did not like the fact that Bush did nothing about the illegal immigration problem. I really did not like the Patriot Act, and I was very vocal about that at the time he put it in place. There was actually a lot of stuff I didn't like about Bush.

I will say this however. The difference between Bush and Obama is huge.

I have to agree with the statement that WE have to work and stand
together. If ALL of us would put as much energy into writing our politicians about our support of the 2nd Amendment as we do in bashing Bush and Obama, we might actually accomplish something!:cool:
 
Maybe that's because Bush robbed us of constitutional freedoms while "Patriots" sat on the side lines and did nothing and in some cases cheered it on. The same people that are now becoming whiny little girls over Obamas every move.

Why weren't they fed up with it during Bush's reign?

Right, because he's not a democrat.

Does anyone else seem to see the irony, that a democrat gets elected office and it's like somebody flipped a switch that caused every other internet poster with a conservative bias to start shouting "THE GUBBERMINT!!!!"

You guys are years behind the game, this is the same stuff that we have been talking about since before Obama was even a presidential candidate. And it's too late.


Geez 56kninja get over Bush. It's the year 2010 Obama is president now.......... :huh:
 

Upcoming Events

Tillamook Gun & Knife Show
Tillamook, OR
"The Original" Kalispell Gun Show
Kalispell, MT
Teen Rifle 1 Class
Springfield, OR
Kids Firearm Safety 2 Class
Springfield, OR

New Resource Reviews

New Classified Ads

Back Top