Gun ownership hits new low

[deen_ad]

Anybody here pause to look up some data before posting?
I mean, like PlayboyPenguin said, it's about ownership, not sales. If you don't understand the difference then perhaps it's best to keep quiet.

Gallup:
Gun Ownership and Use in America
A 1% change in household ownership from 2000 to 2005, rising from 41% to 42%. Probably statistically insignificant.

The past five years, who knows, the graph linked in the OP could be right, since it comports with the slight rise in the 2000-2005 timeframe that Gallup covers.

The fact is, the General Social Survey quoted in the article is a massive longitudinal study carried out by heavyweights, not by some partisan hacks. So you can "disagree" with it all you like, but pithy anecdotes about what you saw and heard are not merely irrelevant, they're ridiculous by comparison.
<broken link removed>

It makes no difference. Until a Constitutional Convention or 2/3 of both houses of Congress abolish 2A, and it's then ratified by 3/4 of the states, our right to ownership stands.

Unless the BATF and the present administration keep changing the definition on what guns we are allowed to own! They just need to keep outlawing various types of guns by various means and letters. We can still have the right to own guns, but just not the ones "outlawed". They're already trying that with shotguns.

Eight U.S. Presidents have been NRA members. They are: Ulysses S. Grant,
Theodore Roosevelt, William Howard Taft, Dwight D. Eisenhower,
John F. Kennedy, Richard M. Nixon, Ronald Reagan and George Bush

80 MILLION gun owners didn't shoot anyone today, a few criminals did!

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The "Feedback Score" is low by 4, not everyone posts it I guess.

Deen
NRA Benefactor/Recruiter
Washington Arms Collector member
South West Washington Arms Collector member

 

[deen_ad]

Personally I think the correct study title is:

"Anti-gun study stoops to new lows"

Eight U.S. Presidents have been NRA members. They are: Ulysses S. Grant,
Theodore Roosevelt, William Howard Taft, Dwight D. Eisenhower,
John F. Kennedy, Richard M. Nixon, Ronald Reagan and George Bush

80 MILLION gun owners didn't shoot anyone today, a few criminals did!

----------------------------------------------------------

The "Feedback Score" is low by 4, not everyone posts it I guess.

Deen
NRA Benefactor/Recruiter
Washington Arms Collector member
South West Washington Arms Collector member

 

[Wheeler44]

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics".' Attributed to Mark Twain who attributed it to Disraeli.

 

[chemist]

Yea that Gallup poll is something the last paragraph is the tell

*Results are based on telephone interviews with 1,012 national adults, aged 18 and older, conducted Oct. 13-16, 2005. For results based on the total sample of national adults, one can say with 95% confidence that the margin of sampling error is ±3 percentage points.

For results based on the sample of 305 adults who personally own a gun, the maximum margin of sampling error is ±6 percentage points.

For results based on the sample of 579 adults who personally own a gun, conducted Aug. 29-Sept. 5, 2000, and Oct. 13-16, 2005, the maximum margin of sampling error is ±4 percentage points.

In addition to sampling error, question wording and practical difficulties in conducting surveys can introduce error or bias into the findings of public opinion polls.


As said above this was a telephone pole and by 2005 almost everyone in my family was not using a land line. Nor I would guess a huge part of the population. It’s widely quoted that 25 percent of U.S. households no longer have landlines and that is households so take 288.4 million people divided by 2.9 people (the size of the average household) and you get 99.5 million house holds 99.5 million household that were not part of the sample


In 2005, United States had a household population of 288.4 million - 147.1 million (51 percent) females and 141.3 million (49 percent) males. The median age was 36.4 years. Twenty-five percent of the population were under 18 years and 12 percent were 65 years and older.


so out of 288.4 million - 25% (to remove the kiddies) = 216.375 million people that could be firearms owners. And they talked to 1012 people!!!! thats only 0.00046% and they come up with a 3% margin of error. Bubblegum
if they called even a few more people in a big city then rural the results would have to be all screwed up.

"Telephone pole?"

Okay, ignore the Gallup poll, and go for the GSS study. You can see exactly the same graph there that's reproduced in the HuffPo article.

The data are indisputable, and the methodology above reproach. The only problem that I see is True Believers who are immune to logic and reason.

 

[BigNickShooting]

I don't think that is real. Fear that Obama will tax our guns driven the owners underground. More and more owners buy guns on forums like ours and do NOT REGISTER their guns. I know I am one of them ... Why register them and have Obama taxing me for every gun I own?

 

[Mark W.]

WOW glad I could give you a laugh Chemist I miss spelled a word.

And DUDE you don't know anything about me save I didn't double check my post. So don't refer to me as a True Believer of anything. In fact the only reason I commented at all in this thread was because I tend not to believe anything I read on face value.

Your comments included.

 

[Mark W.]

I don't think that is real. Fear that Obama will tax our guns driven the owners underground. More and more owners buy guns on forums like ours and do NOT REGISTER their guns. I know I am one of them ... Why register them and have Obama taxing me for every gun I own?

How would you go about registering a firearm in the State of Oregon?

 

[Wheeler44]

Okay, ignore the Gallup poll, and go for the GSS study. You can see exactly the same graph there that's reproduced in the HuffPo article.

The data are indisputable, and the methodology above reproach. The only problem that I see is True Believers who are immune to logic and reason.

I don't doubt that the pollsters got the answers that they were looking for. However, record firearms sales, record concealed carry permits, record hunting license sales and the fact that I see literally hundreds of brand new shooters every year for the last 3 years paints a slightly different picture.

You can throw out my anecdotal evidence and still have record firearms sales and record CCW permits issued. Yeah I suppose Playboy Penguin might be buyin' all of the guns, but I doubt that he's buyin' all of the CCW permits. And I'm positive that he's not buyin' all of the hunting licenses.

Indisputable data and methodology beyond reproach aside, all I can say is "Dewey wins".

W44

 

[deen_ad]

Indisputable data and methodology beyond reproach aside, all I can say is "Dewey wins".

W44

They called 0.00046% of the people in the US and chemist says that's "Indisputable data and methodology beyond reproach"?

Is chemist a sock puppet?

Eight U.S. Presidents have been NRA members. They are: Ulysses S. Grant,
Theodore Roosevelt, William Howard Taft, Dwight D. Eisenhower,
John F. Kennedy, Richard M. Nixon, Ronald Reagan and George Bush

80 MILLION gun owners didn't shoot anyone today, a few criminals did!

----------------------------------------------------------

The "Feedback Score" is low by 4, not everyone posts it I guess.

Deen
NRA Benefactor/Recruiter
Washington Arms Collector member
South West Washington Arms Collector member

 

[chemist]

For God's sake, gentlemen!!
Mark W., you may or may not be a True Believer - I have no idea. Today's news is full of True Believers who refuse to admit that the POTUS was born in Hawaii. Utterly immune to any data or logic. These are the people to whom I refer - those whose convictions override any and all conflicting information.

And Wheeler44, "pollsters?" Are you serious?? Do you think of the University of Chicago faculty as "pollsters?" These people are so far beyond the average people in their expertise, experience, methodology, and review processes that they make all of us look like yokels!

Gentlemen, you and I are totally, completely, indisputably outclassed by the scientists who have spent decades creating the GSS. At least I know it.

 

[BroncoFan]

For God's sake, gentlemen!!
Mark W., you may or may not be a True Believer - I have no idea. Today's news is full of True Believers who refuse to admit that the POTUS was born in Hawaii. Utterly immune to any data or logic. These are the people to whom I refer - those whose convictions override any and all conflicting information.

And Wheeler44, "pollsters?" Are you serious?? Do you think of the University of Chicago faculty as "pollsters?" These people are so far beyond the average people in their expertise, experience, methodology, and review processes that they make all of us look like yokels!

Gentlemen, you and I are totally, completely, indisputably outclassed by the scientists who have spent decades creating the GSS. At least I know it.

Wow - Your faith in academia is, um, hmm, well...
There is one very important component missing here. How many folks would actually respond in the affirmative to a question, "Are there any guns or revolvers in your home?" I'm by no means a conspiracy theorist but I know what my response would be.
"Nonya." Given the very high profile demonization of gun owners in America in the last several years my guess is that most folks who may have otherwise answered in the affirmative simply would say "no" or refuse to answer. If there are enough refusals to respond then your outcome can be incredibly skewed. My guess would be that of those that refused to respond that the overwhelming majority would be gun owners. Until they can quantify with any degree of credibility the entire response or rejection rate I'll stick with my healthy dose of skepticism of any thing the VPC touches.

 

[Gator Monroe]

Boating Accidents are at an alarming high .

 

[deen_ad]

Gentlemen, you and I are totally, completely, indisputably outclassed by the scientists who have spent decades creating the GSS. At least I know it.

Now that's funny!! Any child could poke holes in the methodology where 1,012 people "speak" for the entire population of the US!!

I will make sure my wife and two grandsons are new gun users and owners! Right now one grandson is too young to own a gun so I'll have to wait. Now if I'm called just my report alone would change the results significantly!!

Eight U.S. Presidents have been NRA members. They are: Ulysses S. Grant,
Theodore Roosevelt, William Howard Taft, Dwight D. Eisenhower,
John F. Kennedy, Richard M. Nixon, Ronald Reagan and George Bush

80 MILLION gun owners didn't shoot anyone today, a few criminals did!

----------------------------------------------------------

The "Feedback Score" is low by 4, not everyone posts it I guess.

Deen
NRA Benefactor/Recruiter
Washington Arms Collector member
South West Washington Arms Collector member

 

[Wheeler44]

For God's sake, gentlemen!!

And Wheeler44, "pollsters?" Are you serious?? Do you think of the University of Chicago faculty as "pollsters?" These people are so far beyond the average people in their expertise, experience, methodology, and review processes that they make all of us look like yokels!

Gentlemen, you and I are totally, completely, indisputably outclassed by the scientists who have spent decades creating the GSS. At least I know it.

Ahhhh science......I have had self proclaimed "chemists" on this very forum claim that methanol cannot be created by yeast...Yet every hillbilly home distiller knows that the small amount of methanol from mashes or washes must be removed before consumption. Yep....Science..asking 1500 people a question and applying the answers to a population of 350,000,000 and claiming an accuracy rating of +or- 3%......I bet they shoot sub-MOA all day long as well....

Oh and then there's that little report by the Wall Street Journal claiming between 12.7% and 15% increase in firearms sales. And the fact that Walmart is again selling firearms in stores that ceased that practice. But what would WSJ and Walmart know about it....

I'm sure that those folks in Chicago know all about firearms in American homes...Is it possible that they only polled in Chicago?

And finally.....Throwing around incendiary phrases like "True believer" when you have so much faith in science is laughable. The Sun is a mass of incandescent gas..Oh wait ...The Sun is a miasma of incandescent plasma. Oh wait.....

 

[Grunwald]

Call me a skeptic, but I view with great suspicion anything that originates out of Chicago. This suspicion predates Obama, just so you know that it has nothing to do with him. I just view the city as the most corrupt place in the entire nation and by a very wide margin.

With regard to this study, I have not reviewed their methodology by a few questions come to mind.
How did they chose the people that they surveyed? Was it by completely random calling?
Did they call people that they have surveyed previously?
Did the geographic location of the survey's subject change? Let's face it, if you take the survey in Dallas Texas one years, and then in New York the next, the results are not going to be even remotely the same. People in New York have firearms restrictions that Texans do not, and that does not even take into account cultural differences.

I can tell you that there were many news stories after Obama got elected which profiled individuals who were new gun owners, and became so purely based on who got elected to the oval office.
Coincidentally, I am one of these individuals. Before Obama, last time I've handled a firearm was while running a rifle range for the Boy Scouts while in college (summer job) some 20 years ago. Seemed like a good fit after getting out of the Army. However until the last election cycle I have not even thought of owning a firearm. Now I have bought a couple via retail channels (thought an FFL) as well as a few as private sales. Also picked up a FFL-03 (C&R) so I could get surplus stuff directly.
I would also not move to any state where I could not bring my collection with me (another reason I will never move to Kalifornia)

 

[CAL30M1]

Hmm. Think maybe folks just wised up and don't want to share that info?

That's my guess.

 

[Grunwald]

Direct quote from the General Social Survey - Study Description:
"For the baseline items in the initial survey, some 150 social scientists reviewed drafts of the questionnaire, suggested revisions and additions, and expressed their preferences by vote. Topic and question selection is monitored annually by a Board of Overseers, composed of distinguished social scientists. "

ROTLLMAO, social scientists?? better yet - distinguished social scientists!!! LOL
These people are not scientists. These individuals are about as much close to being scientists as a sanitation engineer is to a real engineer.
That was too funny. .. OK, I'm going back to read the rest of the description. I'm sure I will have more laughs.

.. back from reading he rest of it. Nothing much in it as far a useful and detailed description of the methodology used. The description is mostly full of self-aggrandizement.

 

[billdeserthills]

More like general public IQ hits new low.

How did you think we wound up the current Prez?

 

[Gator Monroe]

How would you go about registering a firearm in the State of Oregon?

Don't you guys have to get a stamp or Class 3 or register FA or SBR or "Real Cans" ?

 

[sadiesassy]

SO I could understand the reference to Gun "Ownership" declining - I buy all the gin s in my house - even though others use them.
There really is not a good way to track ownership - particularly since resales to private parties are not tracked.
And with an aging population I could seee some decline.

BUt it does not take a genious ( Maybe that is a Social Scientist) to look at the earnings reports on gun companies and recognize that gun purchases are increasing - maybe just held by fewer people. WSJ just reported gun sales up what was it 12- 15% ( Women were a major buyer).

SO the statement is one of those irrelevant social statistics - that we paid hansomly for.

Oh Yeah Social Scientist = Government sociologist with no clue what is happening