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There are a couple combative leftists on this forum that I haven’t put on my small ignore list. For one, I’ve mostly stopped participating in political threads, but they also occasionally post intelligent, insightful things that I can agree with, from a different perspective than the usual posts here.

Then in the very next post they’re back to self-righteous, condescending, partisan, “progressive” babble, meant to teach us ignorant knuckle-draggers a thing or two, and I loose interest.

It’s sad really. I see the occasional good post, but I stop myself from “liking” it because of the attitude or combativeness of the poster. I guess that’s why we can’t have realistic, respectful political discussion. We have an echo chamber here (like any place) but when someone comes along with a different perspective and maybe some good points, they’ve also brought the biases, condescension, and “common knowledge” of their own left-wing echo chambers with them, and it just doesn’t work out.
The protagonist that you are referencing is a young man that lives with his parents. He is unemployed and is considering attending community college. Sadly, he doesn't own any firearms and gets all of his conversational data from the internet. He is simply a pretender. He has changed his identity a couple of times and reentered these forums with his "new" I.D. I recognized him because you can change your name, but not your lack of integrity.
 
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Gun control is bad. Fine. So cities come up with other things to curb crime, and those are bad, too.

Are we then back to mass incarceration and draconian sentences? They don't do anything to curb crime, but always so popular among people who don't want to do anything else.
When a criminal is incarcerated, the victims of his criminal bent will be criminals incarcerated with him.

Sounds A-OK to me.
 
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As a small child watching his mother being attacked or as a young teen being attacked by a grown bubblegum man, neither event involved very much money or property value. When violence touches you personally, especially when you've done nothing but exist, I for one peg my meter at, don't give a...... about their rehabilitation. That's on them. If they don't rehabilitate at some point nature will take care of the problem.

That is based more on life experience than opinion. There are several current examples on video expressing just that. Young men who learned hard lessons too late. If they were held accountable after stealing their first cookie the hard lessons most likely aren't needed. There are monsters with and without guns that we don't need in our population.
 
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The protagonist that you are referencing is a young man that lives with his parents. He is unemployed and is considering attending community college. Sadly, he doesn't own any firearms and gets all of his conversational data from the internet. He is simply a pretender. He has changed his identity a couple of times and reentered these forums with his "new" I.D. I recognized him because you can change your name, but not your lack of integrity.
It’s often hard to tell who you’re conversing with online, it could be a teenager in mom’s basement who’s soaked up some radical ideology and thinks he knows it all, a retired veteran who’s traveled the world and seen things, or some joker who just likes to stir the pot. I’m sure you can tell if you really pay attention to their posts, but I haven’t.

I wasn’t solely referring to the guy in this thread, was actually thinking more of another prodigiously posting contrarian. He often makes good points, but I cringe when I see his avatar, because of his arrogant and combative attitude.
 
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It’s often hard to tell who you’re conversing with online, it could be a teenager in mom’s basement who’s soaked up some radical ideology and thinks he knows it all, a retired veteran who’s traveled the world and seen things, or some joker who just likes to stir the pot. I’m sure you can tell if you really pay attention to their posts, but I haven’t.

I wasn’t solely referring to the guy in this thread, was actually thinking more of another prodigiously posting contrarian. He often makes good points, but I cringe when I see his avatar, because of his arrogant and combative attitude.
The guy in this thread is a 50 year old Navy pilot who has seen the world.
 
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I agree, locking people up for a long time isn’t the effective deterrent it needs to be.
Agreed. Until our prisons are actually "prisons"... vs... kumbaya country clubs, they will never be an effective deterrent against crime. As we see... they are simply a time out box rinse and repeat factory.

If you look at countries where the threat of prison is an actual deterrent, it's nearly life in hell on earth. There aren't mutiple menu choices. You eat what you get. 1 hour a day outside of your cell isn't called "solitary confinement"... it's called "serving time". Don't plan on getting a free education or degree, free universal health care, or therapists to work our your mommy/daddy issues.

Overpopulation in prisons? Plan on having to share space with as many per cell as required... vs... limiting the number so we don't tread on anyones "personal space".

Some in jail in the U.S. have openly said... they intentionally went to prison to be able to afford expensive health procedures, to afford to continue their hormone therapy sex transition and the like. Crazy!

Climate controlled cells with TV's and cable... forget about it.

Before I get flamed, I am talking a bit to the extreme to illustrate my point. I do agree there should be rehabilitation programs available on a very limited basis for those that EARN them. Strict criteria should be in place to prevent abuse of those privileges and very costly programs though.

IMHO, I think what we have been shown from more recent history is that trying to jam total reform and rehabilitation down criminals throats is what doesn't work... not that actual "prison" can't be an effective deterrent. If criminals don't "fear" prison though, it's simply no deterrent at all. As it is, all we are teaching them is to "work the system" for gain while they serve their time.

Diverting expenditures from mass rehabilitation efforts as well would likely allow us to build more prisons and bolster those that are painfully understaffed.

Food for thought.
 
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Agreed. Until our prisons are actually "prisons"... vs... kumbaya country clubs, they will never be an effective deterrent against crime. As we see... they are simply a time out box rinse and repeat factory.

If you look at countries where the threat of prison is an actual deterrent, it's nearly life in hell on earth. There aren't mutiple menu choices. You eat what you get. 1 hour a day outside of your cell isn't called "solitary confinement"... it's called "serving time". Don't plan on getting a free education or degree, free universal health care, or therapists to work our your mommy/daddy issues.

Overpopulation in prisons? Plan on having to share space with as many per cell as required... vs... limiting the number so we don't tread on anyones "personal space".

Some in jail in the U.S. have openly said... they intentionally went to prison to be able to afford expensive health procedures, to afford to continue their hormone therapy sex transition and the like. Crazy!

Climate controlled cells with TV's and cable... forget about it.

Before I get flamed, I am talking a bit to the extreme to illustrate my point. I do agree there should be rehabilitation programs available on a very limited basis for those that EARN them. Strict criteria should be in place to prevent abuse of those privileges and very costly programs though.

IMHO, I think what we have been shown from more recent history is that trying to jam total reform and rehabilitation down criminals throats is what doesn't work... not that actual "prison" can't be an effective deterrent. If criminals don't "fear" prison though, it's simply no deterrent at all. As it is, all we are teaching them is to "work the system" for gain while they serve their time.

Diverting expenditures from mass rehabilitation efforts as well would likely allow us to build more prisons and bolster those that are painfully understaffed.

Food for thought.
Why do you think the US is more like 3rd world countries with nasty penal systems and not like a 1st world European country?
 
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Man, I sometimes really hate people. Is it really so hard to be polite?
What did you expect? There are all kinds of people here, plenty of vets, plenty of highly educated, high-IQ, well traveled folks. These people believe a wide variety of different things. I've seen enough in my life to realize that human beings have the amazing ability to believe whatever they want to believe, often despite observable reality.

We observe our world and try to make sense of it in our minds. We finds convincing people to listen to, and our views change and evolve through our lives. We all think that we've chosen our views and ideology because they're the most logical and obvious, but in reality we can justify and believe literally anything we want to believe, despite whatever level of intelligence, experience, or education we have. I've met incredibly intelligent, educated people in my life with all kinds of very different, but sincerely held beliefs.

Arguing politics on the internet is almost always a complete waste of time. Nobody cares what I think, nor do they care what level of education or experience I have. I could also be anyone I want to be be online. I do know that if I decided to participate in a forum where the subject matter was such that the large majority of participants where likely of an ideology very different from mine, I wouldn't be surprised if people treated me poorly when I talked politics. I'd be a fool to think I could keep fighting and change their minds.

Unless of course I were the type who just liked to fight, which I don't, so I'll take my leave now. Enjoy.
 
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What did you expect? There are all kinds of people here, plenty of vets, plenty of highly educated, high-IQ, well traveled folks. These people believe a wide variety of different things. I've seen enough in my life to realize that human beings have the amazing ability to believe whatever they want to believe, often despite observable reality.

We observe our world and try to make sense of it in our minds. We finds convincing people to listen to, and our views change and evolve through our lives. We all think that we've chosen our views and ideology because they're the most logical and obvious, but in reality we can justify and believe literally anything we want to believe, despite whatever level of intelligence, experience, or education we have. I've met incredibly intelligent, educated people in my life with all kinds of very different, but sincerely held beliefs.

Arguing politics on the internet is almost always a complete waste of time. Nobody cares what I think, nor do they care what level of education or experience I have. I could also be anyone I want to be be online. I do know that if I decided to participate in a forum where the subject matter was such that the large majority of participants where likely of an ideology very different from mine, I wouldn't be surprised if people treated me poorly when I talked politics. I'd be a fool to think I could keep fighting and change their minds.

Unless of course I were the type who just liked to fight, which I don't, so I'll take my leave now. Enjoy.
I expected to answer the question you posed about me, not receive some sort of honorarium. I certainly didn't expect you to be rude. Have I been rude to you?

No one is forcing anyone to discuss politics, yet you and everyone else acts like responding to political threads with something other than the party line licences you to be impolite and awful to fellow members.
 
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I do know that if I decided to participate in a forum where the subject matter was such that the large majority of participants where likely of an ideology very different from mine, I wouldn't be surprised if people treated me poorly when I talked politics. I'd be a fool to think I could keep fighting and change their minds.
☝️This!! Yeah Boy!

Some people just seem to get off on it though. Best not to entertain them, but not always easy not to get sucked in a bit before you actually realize what their real agenda is.🤣
 
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I expected to answer the question you posed about me, not receive some sort of honorarium. I certainly didn't expect you to be rude. Have I been rude to you?

No one is forcing anyone to discuss politics, yet you and everyone else acts like responding to political threads with something other than the party line licences you to be impolite and awful to fellow members.

I never asked you a question, nor was my post particularly about you. You were the one who made it about you.
 
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I never asked you a question, nor was my post particularly about you. You were the one who made it about you.
You were referring to me in specific, which is rude enough considering that it is in a thead we are both participating in.

Just as it is rude to constantly tell ME what my agenda is. What's your agenda, to find people to gang up on because it would get you fired if you acted like this in the real world?

You have no idea who I am. As much as you'd like to slot everyone into neat little stereotypes, reality is often more complicated than red or blue.
 
How 'bout we get the conversation back to the OP topic....?
Andy
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How 'bout we get the conversation back to the OP topic....?
Andy
I agree, and I do apologize for my part in the thread drift.

I don't know why I still find myself caught up in stuff like this. I've been trying to follow my own advice to chill out and scroll past political bickering. No good ever comes from it. I am a little curious about what I said that would get me "fired in the real world"... meh, I'm over it. :rolleyes:

A guy I worked with for about a decade actually got me started down this road of simply letting it go: not worrying about what others think, or being insecure in my own views just because someone else disagrees. He was actually a good enough guy and a friend on some level, but everything was politics for him, and he could get mean whenever the subject came up. He'd insert himself in conversations and was always the "smartest guy in the room". It was exhausting and we all learned to avoid any political comments of any kind. Sometimes I think I see him posting here, and foolishly react. Again, my apologies for the thread drift.
 

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