Ginny Burdick is going to try to ban high cap magazines again

[duane black]

Just saw this non-sense on KATU.com

Being from California I can tell you we need to fight this type of behavior from our representatives right here, right now. We can not give these folks one inch of ground when it comes to this stuff. I'm happy to help in any way I can. I can send letters, emails, call, etc. I'm a WA resident but care enough about Oregon to help any way I can. At Calguns we would organize a response to this type of garbage, I'm happy to participate here as well. We got organized in California 20 something years too late, with the internet and venues like this there is no excuse not to organize and fight these folks.

How likely is it something like this can pass in OR ?

 

[cueball1214]

It would be interesting to see that if you showed someone a .223 round and a 30-06 round and told them one was what the CTC shooter used and one is for a hunting rifle how many people would think the 30-06 was the AR round since everyone seems to by calling this a high power rifle. It would be an interesting social experiment. To bad it would never be shown on tv.

 

[rds801]

Wonder what they'd think if someone used a Mosin Carbine. Only 5 shots and bolt action but with a .311 round (7.62x54R) and the power it has it can cause some serious damage. Or an SK.

At least in this instance, banning "clips" would be the correct term to use

 

[Haysuse]

I noticed that she's afraid of folks "Waltzing into a gun shop". So' I'm going to Tango in and I should be OK, right. Maybe they should just ban dancing?

 

[solv3nt]

Sorry, long winded I know, but I just sent this to Senator Burdick.

Senator Burdick,

After reviewing your statements on banning "high capacity" magazines, I must point out the flaws in your argument. First, I would like to give a little background on myself. I am a 28 year old native Oregonian, and I have called Portland my home since 2003, when I first went to college. I hold a Bachelor's degree in Electrical Engineering and a Master's degree in Business Administration.

Flaw #1:
50 Round AR-15 Magazines are notorious for jamming - The AR-15 used in both Clackamas and the Colorado movie theater utilized "high capacity" magazines. In both cases, lives were spared because of the jams.

Flaw #2:
With training, an individual can be just as deadly with smaller magazines as they can if they had "high capacity" magazines. Please reference the excerpt from the history channel, the world's fastest revolver, which is NOT a semi-automatic handgun, Jerry Miculik fires 6 shots from his revolver, unloads, then reloads his revolver and fires an additional 6 shots in 2.9 seconds. The gun used is a revolver, NOT a semi-automatic firearm.
JERRY MICULIK FASTEST REVOLVER SHOOTER IN THE WORLD IPSC - YouTube

Flaw #3:
Jacob Tyler Roberts is a criminal.... Laws broken:
ORS 166.055 Theft in the first degree
ORS 163.005 Criminal Homicide
ORS 163.095 Aggravated Murder
Portland 14A.60.010 Possession of a loaded Firearm in a Public Place
I'm not a lawyer, but I'm sure that the list goes on...

Jacob Roberts, James Holmes, and all of the other mass shooters have one thing in common, they are ALL criminals. Each individual while committing their crimes, had a blatant disregard for life, and written laws in every respect. I ask you this, had there been a ban on "high capacity" magazines, why wouldn't the criminal simply disregard and ignore the law? It only takes a little bit of practice to reload a semi-automatic firearm, thus the ban will have zero impact on the death toll from mass shootings. Simply stated, by limiting the size of a magazine, you are limiting law abiding citizens such as myself.


I also ask you to consider the following:
31,347 individuals were killed by firearms, 18,735 of which were suicide
25,562 individuals were killed by falls
34,485 individuals were killed by occupying a motor vehicle
12,349 individuals were killed by riding a motorcycle
2,688 individuals were killed by cut/pierce
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr60/nvsr60_03.pdf

In Japan, where it is illegal to own a firearm, nearly 33,000 Japanese killed themselves.
Suicide Rate In Japan Still Climbing Despite Government Measures

An early 1990's study done by Gary Kleck, suggests that law abiding citizens use a gun for legal self defense somewhere between 830,000 and 2.45 million times annually.
Disarming the Myths Promoted By the Gun Control Lobby - Forbes

According to Gun Policy, there are apprixmately 270,000,000 firearms held by private citizens. This calculates to being .85 guns per US Citizen (US Population 314,934,163. Approximately 32% of US households have guns in 2010, with the average household size at approximately 2.5 individuals, this means that 251,947,000 individuals either have a gun or have access to a gun in their household. 12,612 individuals are murdered by firearms, not including suicides, which leaves 251,934,000 law abiding citizens that AREN'T committing a crime with their firearm.
Guns in the United States: Facts, Figures and Firearm Law
<broken link removed>
Analysis: Fewer U.S. gun owners own more guns - CNN.com
Average Household Size statistics - States compared - StateMaster

According to MADD, in 2012, more than 9,855 individuals are killed by drunk driving, this doesn't include the 63,000 victims and survivors served by MADD in 2011.

Two weeks ago, Christopher Krumm stabbed his live in girlfriend to death, then went to Casper College in Wyoming and shot his father in the head with an arrow, then proceeded to attack him with a knife.
<broken link removed>


If you follow your theory through to the end, we should also ban ladders of 4' tall, this alone will save more invidiuals than are murdered by firearms. Almost as many people are killed by alcohol than are by guns, by this logic, alcohol is a major killer. The number of firearm murders only account for 27% of individuals killed by automobile accidents. The same logic applies that people shouldn't drive due to the likelihood of death. Christopher Krumm used a bow and arrow, shall we ban bows? What about kitchen knives, 2,688 people are killed by a knife.

There are approximately 20 mass shootings in the US every year, on average, lets say that there's one shooter at each, this means that your proposed legislation is aimed at .0000000793818 of the total households that own guns. However, as it has been shown, criminals don't follow laws....
<broken link removed>


"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" - 2nd Amendment, United States Constitution.

June 26, 2008, District of Columbia vs Heller, the Supreme Court ruled that the 2nd amendment confers the individual the right to possess a firearm for traditional and lawful purposes such as self defense.

We live in a Country void of tyranny. We live in a country where we have the right to our own personal defense from both criminals and the tyrannical government. If we take away our freedoms, how far will it take us? In essence, we trade our freedom with the potential of tyranny. I read a lot of history, especially WWII, Nazi Germany, the citizens weren't allowed guns, and resistance was next to impossible. Are you truly willing to trade our American freedom for the illusion of security?



I hope that you will reconsider your proposed ban and I look forward to hearing from you

 

[osterr1999]

I bet you will get something like thanks for the information, but in reality she doesn't care. Most people that want to ban guns do not use facts, they use emotion. We all know the facts and so do they, which is why you will rarely try to hear some anti-gun person try and argue facts. The second amendment, like all the other amendments, was meant to be a balancing act. What I mean is that the framers obviously knew that murders with firearms happened, but they determined, by using logic, that the good that firearms would do far outweighed the bad. Thank you for taking the time to send her an email, but I doubt it will get through to her. Some people just can't handle the truth.

 

[solv3nt]

I have no grand illusions of changing her mind, but I know that her job relies on votes, not mine obviously, which means that it only takes enough of her dissenting populace voicing their disgruntled opinion to sway her mind.

I bet you will get something like thanks for the information, but in reality she doesn't care. Most people that want to ban guns do not use facts, they use emotion. We all know the facts and so do they, which is why you will rarely try to hear some anti-gun person try and argue facts. The second amendment, like all the other amendments, was meant to be a balancing act. What I mean is that the framers obviously knew that murders with firearms happened, but they determined, by using logic, that the good that firearms would do far outweighed the bad. Thank you for taking the time to send her an email, but I doubt it will get through to her. Some people just can't handle the truth.

 

[ZA_Survivalist]

Sorry, long winded I know, but I just sent this to Senator Burdick.

Senator Burdick,

After reviewing your statements on banning "high capacity" magazines, I must point out the flaws in your argument. First, I would like to give a little background on myself. I am a 28 year old native Oregonian, and I have called Portland my home since 2003, when I first went to college. I hold a Bachelor's degree in Electrical Engineering and a Master's degree in Business Administration.

Flaw #1:
50 Round AR-15 Magazines are notorious for jamming - The AR-15 used in both Clackamas and the Colorado movie theater utilized "high capacity" magazines. In both cases, lives were spared because of the jams.

Flaw #2:
With training, an individual can be just as deadly with smaller magazines as they can if they had "high capacity" magazines. Please reference the excerpt from the history channel, the world's fastest revolver, which is NOT a semi-automatic handgun, Jerry Miculik fires 6 shots from his revolver, unloads, then reloads his revolver and fires an additional 6 shots in 2.9 seconds. The gun used is a revolver, NOT a semi-automatic firearm.
JERRY MICULIK FASTEST REVOLVER SHOOTER IN THE WORLD IPSC - YouTube

Flaw #3:
Jacob Tyler Roberts is a criminal.... Laws broken:
ORS 166.055 Theft in the first degree
ORS 163.005 Criminal Homicide
ORS 163.095 Aggravated Murder
Portland 14A.60.010 Possession of a loaded Firearm in a Public Place
I'm not a lawyer, but I'm sure that the list goes on...

Jacob Roberts, James Holmes, and all of the other mass shooters have one thing in common, they are ALL criminals. Each individual while committing their crimes, had a blatant disregard for life, and written laws in every respect. I ask you this, had there been a ban on "high capacity" magazines, why wouldn't the criminal simply disregard and ignore the law? It only takes a little bit of practice to reload a semi-automatic firearm, thus the ban will have zero impact on the death toll from mass shootings. Simply stated, by limiting the size of a magazine, you are limiting law abiding citizens such as myself.


I also ask you to consider the following:
31,347 individuals were killed by firearms, 18,735 of which were suicide
25,562 individuals were killed by falls
34,485 individuals were killed by occupying a motor vehicle
12,349 individuals were killed by riding a motorcycle
2,688 individuals were killed by cut/pierce
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr60/nvsr60_03.pdf

In Japan, where it is illegal to own a firearm, nearly 33,000 Japanese killed themselves.
Suicide Rate In Japan Still Climbing Despite Government Measures

An early 1990's study done by Gary Kleck, suggests that law abiding citizens use a gun for legal self defense somewhere between 830,000 and 2.45 million times annually.
Disarming the Myths Promoted By the Gun Control Lobby - Forbes

According to Gun Policy, there are apprixmately 270,000,000 firearms held by private citizens. This calculates to being .85 guns per US Citizen (US Population 314,934,163. Approximately 32% of US households have guns in 2010, with the average household size at approximately 2.5 individuals, this means that 251,947,000 individuals either have a gun or have access to a gun in their household. 12,612 individuals are murdered by firearms, not including suicides, which leaves 251,934,000 law abiding citizens that AREN'T committing a crime with their firearm.
Guns in the United States: Facts, Figures and Firearm Law
<broken link removed>
Analysis: Fewer U.S. gun owners own more guns - CNN.com
Average Household Size statistics - States compared - StateMaster

According to MADD, in 2012, more than 9,855 individuals are killed by drunk driving, this doesn't include the 63,000 victims and survivors served by MADD in 2011.

Two weeks ago, Christopher Krumm stabbed his live in girlfriend to death, then went to Casper College in Wyoming and shot his father in the head with an arrow, then proceeded to attack him with a knife.
<broken link removed>


If you follow your theory through to the end, we should also ban ladders of 4' tall, this alone will save more invidiuals than are murdered by firearms. Almost as many people are killed by alcohol than are by guns, by this logic, alcohol is a major killer. The number of firearm murders only account for 27% of individuals killed by automobile accidents. The same logic applies that people shouldn't drive due to the likelihood of death. Christopher Krumm used a bow and arrow, shall we ban bows? What about kitchen knives, 2,688 people are killed by a knife.

There are approximately 20 mass shootings in the US every year, on average, lets say that there's one shooter at each, this means that your proposed legislation is aimed at .0000000793818 of the total households that own guns. However, as it has been shown, criminals don't follow laws....
<broken link removed>


"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" - 2nd Amendment, United States Constitution.

June 26, 2008, District of Columbia vs Heller, the Supreme Court ruled that the 2nd amendment confers the individual the right to possess a firearm for traditional and lawful purposes such as self defense.

We live in a Country void of tyranny. We live in a country where we have the right to our own personal defense from both criminals and the tyrannical government. If we take away our freedoms, how far will it take us? In essence, we trade our freedom with the potential of tyranny. I read a lot of history, especially WWII, Nazi Germany, the citizens weren't allowed guns, and resistance was next to impossible. Are you truly willing to trade our American freedom for the illusion of security?



I hope that you will reconsider your proposed ban and I look forward to hearing from you

well said!

 

[DMax]

The test has begun. All we hear on this forum from democrats that love their guns that their are lots of them and they stand up for 2A rights. Well now is their time to shine and really show us uniformed crazy right wingers if we are wrong about the pretend 2A rights. Will lefties stand up to their party? We will all see if there are actually enough of them to make a difference against an Oregon democrat controlled legislature. I am just giddy holding my breath on this one. Logic is irrelevant in this situation. You can take burdick out to a 100 ranges and she could care less it's the ideology period. Hope is not a strategy to defeat this BS

 

[GOG]

"But it's for the children."


Brilliant letter solv3nt.

 

[Muddslinger12]

We can only hope she will actually READ it! But even so very nicely written and great job controlling you emotions and delivering just the facts i am sure it took alot to not tell her what you think of her, but that would have just given her an excuse not to read it...

So whats gonna happen in the (I pray HIGHLY unlikely) chance this junk does pass, will all you law abiding citizens just hop across the pond to my neck of the woods and LEGALLY purchase all the "high cap mags" when and as you want them? Wouldnt it be legal for you to come here and by them from Vancouver since it would only ban "sales" of high cap mags? just like when WA decided to jack up taxes on booze and everyone just started to buy from P town. Sales in portland (right by the "border") skyrocketed thanks to WA.

I hope ppl realize what an ignorant person she is and that she doesnt care about the facts, she is just feeding off ppls fear isnt there a word for that like sociopath or...?

 

[bellarum]

I saw this on the news this morning and was worried for a minute. I checked my safe for the common 50 round clips she was describing and all I found were several 5-10-20-30-40 round magazines and a 100 round drum. The only common clip I could fnd was a stripper clip and I looked around a bit more and couldnt find the commonly found 50 round clips anywhere.
except here;
<broken link removed>

Instead of burning calories with "click it or ticket" campaigns they should try producing PSA's about how if you are a cowardly POS that cant handle being alive one day longer...go crawl off under a bush and die like a cat and leave everyone else out of it!
I'd say go hang yourself but, as soon as these dummies decided to go that route she would try to ban rope and knots. Glad that loser didn't have a solid skill set. Hope hes being dry raped in hell. (sorry....just venting)

 

[netcarrier]

See What they are trying to pass in Oregon!

Sen. Ginny Burdick has proposed a bill that would make it illegal to own, buy or sell any gun that can hold more than 10 rounds of ammunition, and she began promoting it the day after the shooting at Clackamas Town Center left two victims dead and one injured.

The draft of the bill is dated Sept. 20. But Burdick emailed her colleagues on Wednesday to drum up support for the bill.

What do you think about this one?

Tony Portland, Oregon Area

 

[ilike9s]

Sorry, long winded I know, but I just sent this to Senator Burdick.

Senator Burdick,

After reviewing your statements on banning "high capacity" magazines, I must point out the flaws in your argument. First, I would like to give a little background on myself. I am a 28 year old native Oregonian, and I have called Portland my home since 2003, when I first went to college. I hold a Bachelor's degree in Electrical Engineering and a Master's degree in Business Administration.

Flaw #1:
50 Round AR-15 Magazines are notorious for jamming - The AR-15 used in both Clackamas and the Colorado movie theater utilized "high capacity" magazines. In both cases, lives were spared because of the jams.

Flaw #2:
With training, an individual can be just as deadly with smaller magazines as they can if they had "high capacity" magazines. Please reference the excerpt from the history channel, the world's fastest revolver, which is NOT a semi-automatic handgun, Jerry Miculik fires 6 shots from his revolver, unloads, then reloads his revolver and fires an additional 6 shots in 2.9 seconds. The gun used is a revolver, NOT a semi-automatic firearm.
JERRY MICULIK FASTEST REVOLVER SHOOTER IN THE WORLD IPSC - YouTube

Flaw #3:
Jacob Tyler Roberts is a criminal.... Laws broken:
ORS 166.055 Theft in the first degree
ORS 163.005 Criminal Homicide
ORS 163.095 Aggravated Murder
Portland 14A.60.010 Possession of a loaded Firearm in a Public Place
I'm not a lawyer, but I'm sure that the list goes on...

Jacob Roberts, James Holmes, and all of the other mass shooters have one thing in common, they are ALL criminals. Each individual while committing their crimes, had a blatant disregard for life, and written laws in every respect. I ask you this, had there been a ban on "high capacity" magazines, why wouldn't the criminal simply disregard and ignore the law? It only takes a little bit of practice to reload a semi-automatic firearm, thus the ban will have zero impact on the death toll from mass shootings. Simply stated, by limiting the size of a magazine, you are limiting law abiding citizens such as myself.


I also ask you to consider the following:
31,347 individuals were killed by firearms, 18,735 of which were suicide
25,562 individuals were killed by falls
34,485 individuals were killed by occupying a motor vehicle
12,349 individuals were killed by riding a motorcycle
2,688 individuals were killed by cut/pierce
http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr60/nvsr60_03.pdf

In Japan, where it is illegal to own a firearm, nearly 33,000 Japanese killed themselves.
Suicide Rate In Japan Still Climbing Despite Government Measures

An early 1990's study done by Gary Kleck, suggests that law abiding citizens use a gun for legal self defense somewhere between 830,000 and 2.45 million times annually.
Disarming the Myths Promoted By the Gun Control Lobby - Forbes

According to Gun Policy, there are apprixmately 270,000,000 firearms held by private citizens. This calculates to being .85 guns per US Citizen (US Population 314,934,163. Approximately 32% of US households have guns in 2010, with the average household size at approximately 2.5 individuals, this means that 251,947,000 individuals either have a gun or have access to a gun in their household. 12,612 individuals are murdered by firearms, not including suicides, which leaves 251,934,000 law abiding citizens that AREN'T committing a crime with their firearm.
Guns in the United States: Facts, Figures and Firearm Law
<broken link removed>
Analysis: Fewer U.S. gun owners own more guns - CNN.com
Average Household Size statistics - States compared - StateMaster

According to MADD, in 2012, more than 9,855 individuals are killed by drunk driving, this doesn't include the 63,000 victims and survivors served by MADD in 2011.

Two weeks ago, Christopher Krumm stabbed his live in girlfriend to death, then went to Casper College in Wyoming and shot his father in the head with an arrow, then proceeded to attack him with a knife.
<broken link removed>


If you follow your theory through to the end, we should also ban ladders of 4' tall, this alone will save more invidiuals than are murdered by firearms. Almost as many people are killed by alcohol than are by guns, by this logic, alcohol is a major killer. The number of firearm murders only account for 27% of individuals killed by automobile accidents. The same logic applies that people shouldn't drive due to the likelihood of death. Christopher Krumm used a bow and arrow, shall we ban bows? What about kitchen knives, 2,688 people are killed by a knife.

There are approximately 20 mass shootings in the US every year, on average, lets say that there's one shooter at each, this means that your proposed legislation is aimed at .0000000793818 of the total households that own guns. However, as it has been shown, criminals don't follow laws....
<broken link removed>


"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed" - 2nd Amendment, United States Constitution.

June 26, 2008, District of Columbia vs Heller, the Supreme Court ruled that the 2nd amendment confers the individual the right to possess a firearm for traditional and lawful purposes such as self defense.

We live in a Country void of tyranny. We live in a country where we have the right to our own personal defense from both criminals and the tyrannical government. If we take away our freedoms, how far will it take us? In essence, we trade our freedom with the potential of tyranny. I read a lot of history, especially WWII, Nazi Germany, the citizens weren't allowed guns, and resistance was next to impossible. Are you truly willing to trade our American freedom for the illusion of security?



I hope that you will reconsider your proposed ban and I look forward to hearing from you

She'll just dismiss you, because you are just a common lay person. She is inlightened how dare you question or rebutte her...

 

[Simonpie]

That's not how I read it. According to this http://media.oregonlive.com/politics_impact/other/LC1031_DRAFT_2013_Regular_Session.pdf
it would affect magazines, not guns. I'm not saying I like it, just that we need to try to be accurate.

 

[drew]

There's a thread talking about the magazine ban: http://www.northwestfirearms.com/showthread.php?t=110575

 

[pokerace]

Sen. Ginny Burdick = Slime ball

using a tragedy to push her agenda.

 

[RifleEnthusiast]

Read it today, I think in the Oregonian and was arguing with a co-worker about it...What can we do to stop this, other than supporting the NRA? call? are there grassroots movements/campaigns against these kinds of bills?

 

[MikeE]

I wonder if the Liberal Gun Club has an official position on this?

I have no idea what the 'Liberal Gun Club' thinks of this, but I will tell you what THIS liberal thinks FWIW.

This situation is what you get when you marry what should be an independent movement for the protection of a civil right, A2, with the Republican Party, and associate the RTKABA with every right wing bigoted and stupid 'conservative' cause of the last thirty years. When the Republican Party has an epic FAIL, like the Oregon Republican Party has, then you got nothing.
No relationships with the other party.
No trust for A2 supporters among people that could be our allies.
And most importantly, no understanding of the opposition.

For example - the left of the Democratic party is really pissed off at Ginny Burdick for supporting Kitzhaber's 'special session' to extend Nike's sweetheart tax deal. Labor does not like this at all. But how can A2 supporters make common cause with labor after associating with a right wing movement that calls union members scum and thugs and supports anti-labor legislation? Despite the fact that union members have a large percentage of gun owners in the ranks.

This is what you get when your politics is completely self-indulgent.

Furthermore, you can't beat something with nothing.The high cap magazine ban is stupid, but it exists. Suddenly, the combination of an event - the mall shooting - and a lopsided political alignment makes this bill very possible. How are pro A2 organizations going to stop it - by calling people names? Good luck with that.
These shootings have been going on along time. Poor kids killing other poor kids over drug deals has been happening even longer. But the A2 movement has yet to come up with a coherent response, relying instead on political bullying and inertia. Now the political balance is shifting against that tactic, and again, we got nuthin'.

In a perfect world, the A2 movement would propose an anti-violence agenda that could draw support from the right and left. It's long past time that A2 supporters gave that some thought.


I'm sure this post will attract the usual nasty invective, to which i do not give a rat's rear end. It is the real world, muchachos, and you are in it.

 

[MountainBear]

Ban all 50 round "clips". They look weird and are hard to charge. Especially since most of the rifles I have that use clips only hold five or eight rounds. Those 50 round clips are just confusing...