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Firearms on Tri-Met?

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by Pukwudji, Mar 16, 2009.

  1. Pukwudji

    Pukwudji Hillsboro, OR Member

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    Can you carry on Tri-Met? According to their policies it says 'No', but Tri-Met is a 'municipal corporation' with board members selected by the Govorner. If this is a government agency doesn't that preclude them from limiting firearm rights in Oregon? Obviously in Multomah cty you can't open carry, but I'm wondering about rifles.

    Normally I take Max from work downtown to the Expo when there is a show. This week, however, I'm planning on purchasing a rifle or two. Obviously this is a little hard to conceal. If the rifle is in a case and unloaded does Tri-Met have the authority to deny me access?

    Here is the relevant text from the Tri-Met regs: No person, except a peace officer, shall bring or carry aboard a District Vehicle any firearm, knife (except a folding knife with a blade less than 3 ½ inches in length), or any other instrument, article, device, material or substance specifically designed for, or attempted to be used to, inflict or cause bodily harm to another, except in accordance with administrative rules as may be promulgated by the General Manager or otherwise provided by law. Where possession of such weapons cannot be prohibited by law, a person in possession of a weapon may not display or carry the weapon in a manner which is likely to result in fear or alarm by other persons or District employees.

    Thanks,
    Brian
     
  2. Trlsmn

    Trlsmn In Utero (Portland) Well-Known Member

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    Regulations are not law, sure they can kick you off but they cannot charge you. As for open carry in Mult Co. it is legal with a CHL.
     
  3. Pukwudji

    Pukwudji Hillsboro, OR Member

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    Here's what I have found so far.

    The relevant section of Tri-Met regs says:

    No person, except a peace officer, shall bring or carry aboard a District Vehicle any firearm, knife (except a folding knife with a blade less than 3 ½ inches in length), or any other instrument, article, device, material or substance specifically designed for, or attempted to be used to, inflict or cause bodily harm to another, except in accordance with administrative rules as may be promulgated by the General Manager or otherwise provided by law. Where possession of such weapons cannot be prohibited by law, a person in possession of a weapon may not display or carry the weapon in a manner which is likely to result in fear or alarm by other persons or District employees.
    However, Oregon law:

    166.170 State preemption. (1) Except as expressly authorized by state statute, the authority to regulate in any matter whatsoever the sale, acquisition, transfer, ownership, possession, storage, transportation or use of firearms or any element relating to firearms and components thereof, including ammunition, is vested solely in the Legislative Assembly.

    (2) Except as expressly authorized by state statute, no county, city or other municipal corporation or district may enact civil or criminal ordinances, including but not limited to zoning ordinances, to regulate, restrict or prohibit the sale, acquisition, transfer, ownership, possession, storage, transportation or use of firearms or any element relating to firearms and components thereof, including ammunition. Ordinances that are contrary to this subsection are void. [1995 s.s. c.1 §1]

    166.174 Authority of city, county, municipal corporation or district to regulate possession or sale of firearms. Notwithstanding any other provision of law, a city, county or other municipal corporation or district may not adopt ordinances that regulate, restrict or prohibit the possession or sale of firearms in a public building that is rented or leased to a person during the term of the lease. [1995 s.s. c.1 §5]
     
  4. Pukwudji

    Pukwudji Hillsboro, OR Member

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    You sure about that last? My understanding is that even with a CHL you still can't open carry in MC. You must carry concealed.

    -Brian
     
  5. Trlsmn

    Trlsmn In Utero (Portland) Well-Known Member

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  6. Pukwudji

    Pukwudji Hillsboro, OR Member

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    I've sent an email to Tri-Met with relevant statutes and their regulation asking for clarification. We'll see if I get a response.
     
  7. CharlesAFerg

    CharlesAFerg Beaverton Active Member

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    On the opencarry.org site, in the Oregon section, there is a recent story about some of their members being arrested for it. It's technically legal, but it's a similar situation to campus carry. Surely you can conceal your sidearm, but if you open carry they will do everything they can to detain and/or arrest you. Read up on it.

    Basically, they were arrested, and then found they were not technically in violation of their firearms laws, so tri-met or the police (I don't remember which) filed charges against them for recording the entire incident. Like I said, they found some little thing to screw them with, it's absolutely unacceptable.

    I found the thread..
    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum45/9080.html
     
  8. Trlsmn

    Trlsmn In Utero (Portland) Well-Known Member

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    They were criminially cited under Oregon's "wiretapping" law, ORS 165.543 for recording the conversation with the police not for Open Carry.
     
  9. korntera

    korntera Oregon Member

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    I took an AK home on the max, It left the show with me in a brown unmarked box and nobody knew what it was, just because the box SAYS remington doesn't mean its really a gun, you could just be using the box. Not saying what I did was legal, just saying if nobody knows whats in the box and there is no ammunition loaded with it what should it matter?
     
  10. Reco

    Reco Portland Oregon Active Member

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    Concerning open carry in Multnomah county basically if your working and in uniform aka Security etc then its ok. But to take it further Security Officers in uniform are regulated under the state of oregon DPSST. Publicly I traveled into many areas of the city openly while working only restrictions were airports and courts and hospitals that had solid rules manily governed by the Feds. It is a must to to have a conceal carry permit with your Armed Security License. They go hand in hand and the police are more friendly that way.

    Remember the key word is "your Working"
     
  11. Pukwudji

    Pukwudji Hillsboro, OR Member

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    Remember, I'm not talking about carrying a rifle for defense. I'm talking about buying a couple rifles at the show and riding the max out to the park-n-ride so I don't have to pay to park (I'm a cheap *******).

    -Brian
     
  12. Reco

    Reco Portland Oregon Active Member

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    lol wear over coat ehhe park at closest max stop ftw
     
  13. Keane

    Keane Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    According to the LAW, anyone with a CCW can carry a firearm anywhere in the state short of courthouses, jails, and secure parts of the airport.

    PRIVATE facilities can request that you leave, under penalty of misdemeanor Tresspass, but if you leave when asked, they cannot charge you.

    The TRIMET is a public entity, therefore has zero right to stop you from having firearms on it. The case above, the police were intentionally trying to hassle them, and found that they were in violation of no law, so in order to keep them off the trimet, they arrested them for another BS charge.

    NOTE: It was found later that they were actually NOT in violation of the wiretap law either, but they both plead no contest, because of the cost to fight.

    So, short answer: You are 100% allowed to carry on the TriMet by law. However, "how the law is written" and "How the boys with badges enforce the law" are two separate things.
     
    chemist and (deleted member) like this.
  14. ZombieAssassin

    ZombieAssassin Oregon Member

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    OFF dealt with this issue years ago.
    http://www.oregonfirearms.org/toolbox.html
    "Tri-Met's" Rule Book. No matter what you've been told, you can't be thrown off the Portland buses and trains if you have a handgun and a CHL.

    If in doubt, contact OFF.
     
  15. swoop

    swoop Milwaukie, Oregon Well-Known Member

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    I would pay the $7.00 bucks and avoid the hassel if you are buying weapons. As for max, wouldn't go:paranoid: on or around loading area without your carry if you have chl.
     
  16. Pukwudji

    Pukwudji Hillsboro, OR Member

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    Here is the letter I sent to Tri-Met:

    ->comment=I have a question on carrying firearms on Tri-Met. The relevant
    section of Tri-Met regs says:

    No person, except a peace officer, shall bring or carry aboard a District
    Vehicle any firearm, knife (except a folding knife with a blade less than 3
    inches in length), or any other instrument, article, device, material or
    substance specifically designed for, or attempted to be used to, inflict or
    cause bodily harm to another, except in accordance with administrative rules
    as may be promulgated by the General Manager or otherwise provided by law.
    Where possession of such weapons cannot be prohibited by law, a person in
    possession of a weapon may not display or carry the weapon in a manner which
    is likely to result in fear or alarm by other persons or District employees.

    However, Oregon law:

    166.170 State preemption. (1) Except as expressly authorized by state
    statute, the authority to regulate in any matter whatsoever the sale,
    acquisition, transfer, ownership, possession, storage, transportation or use
    of firearms or any element relating to firearms and components thereof,
    including ammunition, is vested solely in the Legislative Assembly.

    (2) Except as expressly authorized by state statute, no county, city
    or other municipal corporation or district may enact civil or criminal
    ordinances, including but not limited to zoning ordinances, to regulate,
    restrict or prohibit the sale, acquisition, transfer, ownership, possession,
    storage, transportation or use of firearms or any element relating to
    firearms and components thereof, including ammunition. Ordinances that are
    contrary to this subsection are void. [1995 s.s. c.1 1]

    166.174 Authority of city, county, municipal corporation or district to
    regulate possession or sale of firearms. Notwithstanding any other provision
    of law, a city, county or other municipal corporation or district may not
    adopt ordinances that regulate, restrict or prohibit the possession or sale
    of firearms in a public building that is rented or leased to a person during
    the term of the lease. [1995 s.s. c.1 5]



    If the firearm is secured and unloaded (for instance a rifle in a gun case),
    is it permitted to carry a firearm on Tri-Met provided it is not brandished?
    Based on the laws cited above so long as it isn't loaded Tri-Met as a
    municipal corporation cannot pre-empt my rights to transport or possess
    firearms. Am I missing anything?

    _________________________________________________________

    Here is the response:

    Dear Mr. Vanderzanden:

    Looks like you've accurately summed it up.

    Thanks,
    Shelley Devine
    Senior Deputy General Counsel
    TriMet
    4012 SE 17th Avenue
    Portland, OR 97202
    _________________________________________________________

    Good to know.

    -Brian
     
  17. Keane

    Keane Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    You neglected to notice that these same laws cover a CCW holder from both open and concealed carry of a loaded firearm on the trimet.

    Unloaded firearms anyone can carry.
     
  18. CharlesAFerg

    CharlesAFerg Beaverton Active Member

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    Nobody should be open carrying unloaded unless it's about making a statement, preferably with more than a few people at one time.
     
  19. BlvdKing

    BlvdKing Almost Boring Member

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    I would never think of riding a bus or max without some sort of gun or weapon on me
     
  20. Pukwudji

    Pukwudji Hillsboro, OR Member

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    I agree. The driver behind my question, however, was if I bought a long-gun at the show if I could take it on Tri-Met. Now I know for sure. I'll keep a copy of her response and contact information if I need to do this again just in case.

    -Brian