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Don't let one's future lie in somebody else's hands is not a bad prescription.
People in IT have sometimes cautioned about just this. Own your own destiny or be at others mercy. Danger of the cloud and all that. Cloud providers are not doing a good job of positive marketing when they pull shenanigans like this.
 
Never going to happen in the age of Repressive tolerance -- by design they will punish the right for doing what they praise the left for. This is not going to get better by wishing for monopolists to engage in ethical behavior or by chalking up their failure to free markets functioning properly.
Traditionally this is what laws are supposed to be for.
 
As long as the plumbing stays neutral people can always find some way to hang a faucet off it. Things that concern me more are continuing to extend content immunity to companies that are clearly violating the good faith clause of section 230, such as Twitface and Flitter, and even more overarching issues with services such as payment services refusing to do business. Some banking regs are likely in order, and a tightening of the language in section 230.

Amazon and such, meh. That's a symptom not the cause.

AWS IS the plumbing, Parler and such is the faucet. You can't hang a faucet if they burn down the house.
 
Traditionally this is what laws are supposed to be for.

A lot of this is yet to fall into place. Twitler and Facephuk will do as they please until regulation comes along... which they would be happy to write. AWS and GoDaddy will pull conservative and gun websites until they are brought up on anti-trust charges, which may be a rigged game given the willingness of the Judicial branch to act politically instead of in accordance with the laws.
 
AWS IS the plumbing, Parler and such is the faucet. You can't hang a faucet if they burn down the house.
No, that's not the way the internet works.

AWS is an endpoint that connects to the network. It's a massively scaled and robust endpoint, but it's just an endpoint.They have a farm of computers and those computers connect to the network much like your PC does, just at a larger scale. When AWS hosts a service, it means Amazon is contracted to run code from some other entity on their computers, which are connected to the internet. It is, to use the imperfect analogy, a really fancy, reliable, and high capacity faucet.

Resolving a name to an address is a different thing, and has to work for all. The last mile and the backbone of the network is the part that has to be neutral, and so far that's essentially true with the exception of some QoS stuff.


The Solid project, along with Mastodon and Diaspora, is an interesting thing that was underway before all this happened, FWIW. Responses to private firms centralizing the conceptually decentralized internet.
 
No, that's not the way the internet works.

AWS is an endpoint that connects to the network. It's a massively scaled and robust endpoint, but it's just an endpoint.They have a farm of computers and those computers connect to the network much like your PC does, just at a larger scale. When AWS hosts a service, it means Amazon is contracted to run code from some other entity on their computers, which are connected to the internet. It is, to use the imperfect analogy, a really fancy, reliable, and high capacity faucet.

Resolving a name to an address is a different thing, and has to work for all. The last mile and the backbone of the network is the part that has to be neutral, and so far that's essentially true with the exception of some QoS stuff.


The Solid project, along with Mastodon and Diaspora, is an interesting thing that was underway before all this happened, FWIW. Responses to private firms centralizing the conceptually decentralized internet.

Well, I'm not an IT guy.....

But I maintain that in YOUR example, Parler is the faucet, AWS is the plumbing, and the network is the house. I'll admit that "they" are not tearing up the network, but AWS still sucks.

I have no idea about the rest. Not interested in the details since due to diabetes I have a hard time focusing and it's just too much work for me. I'm no longer capable of in-depth discussions of techie stuff, or anything else really. Sorry!! :oops:
 
But I maintain that in YOUR example, Parler is the faucet, AWS is the plumbing
Except it's not, and I am fairly knowledgeable in this field.

Conceptually, the difference between your PC and the server hosting this site is the software running on the two endpoints. You have a device with software (and hardware) that facilitates it being used as an interactive client endpoint. The server(s) hosting this site are configured to serve up content your interactive client can present to you. The 'plumbing' between you allows data to flow both directions, which is probably the major flaw in the water service analogy.

In the case of AWS, they would be the endpoint that's configured to host content. You could configure a machine on your LAN to serve up content(1); it's not magical. It's just not trivial to make it scale out, secure it, and some ISPs have contractual prohibitions about servers.

That last one shouldn't be legal but that's a different discussion.

That's the way it works, from 40K feet as they say.

To make the plumbing example work better, we would have to have a setup where all customers could have a well and add water to the supply, and all the major water suppliers were privately owned. In that scenario AWS, Azure, Google, and the plethora of other hosting providers would be privately owned water producers who, in some cases, allow entities to sublet some of their water supply capacity.

(1) Given a proper ISP contract.
 
Except it's not, and I am fairly knowledgeable in this field.

Conceptually, the difference between your PC and the server hosting this site is the software running on the two endpoints. You have a device with software (and hardware) that facilitates it being used as an interactive client endpoint. The server(s) hosting this site are configured to serve up content your interactive client can present to you. The 'plumbing' between you allows data to flow both directions, which is probably the major flaw in the water service analogy.

In the case of AWS, they would be the endpoint that's configured to host content. You could configure a machine on your LAn to serve up content(1); it's not magical. It's just not trivial to make it scale out, secure it, and some ISPs have contractual prohibitions about servers.

That last one shouldn't be legal but that's a different discussion.

That's the way it works, from 40K feet as they say.

To make the plumbing example work better, we would have to have a setup where all customers could have a well and add water to the supply, and all the major water suppliers were privately owned. In that scenario AWS, Azure, Google, and the plethora of other hosting providers would be privately owned water producers who, in some cases, allow entities to sublet some of their water supply capacity.

Did I NOT tell you I'm not capable of detailed discussion on this...

Didn't read. I give up. I'm at the "I don't care" point in this discussion. You win. No more. OK???
 
Traditionally this is what laws are supposed to be for.

This is a post-law world. If the laws applied, when $2B in damage occurs, rioters would be prosecuted not rotated through with automatic dismissals.

We live in a world where laws are applied selectively according to partisan ideology.

Welcome to the last day in America.
 
I''m not arguing to change any laws regarding contracts. Two parties can pretty much agree to whatever they want. Cases will be decided in court.

Just saying that when AWS shuts one company down for supposed contract violations and doesn't shut down others that have even worse violations, they are engaging in anti-competitive and possibly anti-trust activity for political reasons. I hope it comes back to bite them in the azz!!!

I can remember that time.....
When a certain website had in it's Terms Of Service.....
That one would forfeit their soul to the devil for eternity to use their website/service.

YES.....many people agreed to the Terms of Service.

Rrrrright.....it's not like everyone actually reads the "Terms of Service". Or maybe, they just don't believe or care?

But a contract is a contract.:s0139: So tonight, we dance in ___________ .

Aloha, Mark
 
I can remember that time.....
When a certain website had in it's Terms Of Service.....
That one would forfeit their soul to the devil for eternity to use their website/service.

YES.....many people agreed to the Terms of Service.

Rrrrright.....it's not like everyone actually reads the "Terms of Service". Or maybe, they just don't believe or care?

But a contract is a contract.:s0139: So tonight, we dance in ___________ .

Aloha, Mark


 
This is a post-law world. If the laws applied, when $2B in damage occurs, rioters would be prosecuted not rotated through with automatic dismissals.

We live in a world where laws are applied selectively according to partisan ideology.
Indeed, police can even commit murder without consequence, as long as they're killing the right people. BLM protesters are met with tear gas and rubber bullets, while police pose for selfies with insurrectionists attacking the core of American democracy.

But this is nothing new; the rich and powerful have aways been above the law in America.
 
I am thoroughly enjoying the discourse in this thread (and others like it on other sites) but I can't help but be a little perturbed: I am, and and have been, a huge advocate for complete net neutrality, and did whatever I could a few years back to spread a warning of things to come - but back then the overwhelming sentiment in most of the places in which I "preached" seemed to be that companies should be allowed to police their own content however they see fit. Then BAM - the purge after the 6th of January happens, and there's an immediate reversal of that prior opinion. I don't know where I'm going with this. I guess I just wish that more people had cried out for net neutrality before now, and when the movement still had a lot of momentum. Now we are playing catch up, and we may be way too late.

Rant over :s0159:.
 
Indeed, police can even commit murder without consequence, as long as they're killing the right people. BLM protesters are met with tear gas and rubber bullets, while police pose for selfies with insurrectionists attacking the core of American democracy.
This is mostly false narrative. Did you know a white person interacting with police is more likely to be killed than a person of color in the same circumstances? That's a verifiable fact, based on FBI statistics and ferreted out by a major media outlet. BLM has done billions of dollars of damage looting and rioting for months. A few idiots run through some mostly ceremonial buildings for a couple hours and they are the big threat. Right.
 
BLM protesters are met with tear gas and rubber bullets, while police pose for selfies with insurrectionists attacking the core of American democracy.
Wait, I'm pretty sure the insurgents you mentioned in DC were met with real bullets, since it was announced that 1 woman was killed there. Maybe I just didn't hear about any of the BLM riots resulting in death via police issued live rounds?
 
I am, and and have been, a huge advocate for complete net neutrality
Most people don't understand how computer networks operate, and confuse the network and the endpoints pretty thoroughly. The network, other than some QoS stuff, is pretty neutral. There are some peering agreement things but that's more a matter of scaling and not connection. In any case, the actual network is a lot like a utility and could use (and does have some) regulation.

THe endpoints are not the network, and the current fuss is all about the endpoints.
 
Wait, I'm pretty sure the insurgents you mentioned in DC were met with real bullets, since it was announced that 1 woman was killed there. Maybe I just didn't hear about any of the BLM riots resulting in death via police issued live rounds?
Imagine the death toll if police had been killing 1 rioter per every few hours over the summer.
 
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