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I might have been looking at it through ethical glasses. If you meant creating additional revenue streams by locking someone into a transfer before they have their permit, and best case, they don't get one and the FFL can steal a firearm out from under someone for a hefty profit... then, yeah! That would work. ;)
Assuming the best case is they won't get one seems like a half glass empty view on the subject but yes your arguments are from an ethical perspective. I am looking at it from a nuts and bolts perspective.
 
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Assuming the best case is they won't get one seems like a half glass empty view on the subject but yes your arguments are from an ethical perspective. I am looking at it from a nuts and bolts perspective.
There is absolutely no advantage for the customer to do a pre deal that I can see. For the FFL there is if the customr fails to get a permit, but knowingly taking advantage of customers to practically steal their P2P transfer only firearms I would about bet would cost that FFL more than they could make off that scam in the long run.

No a very sound long term business model, for sure.
 
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There is absolutely no advantage for the customer to do a pre deal that I can see. For the FFL there is if the customr fails to get a permit, but knowingly taking advantage of customers to practically steal their P2P transfer only firearms I would about bet would cost that FFL more than they could make off that scam in the long run.

No a very sound long term business model, for sure.
This is not a scam and you are mischaracterizing the intent of offering a prepaid transfer service. One advantage to buyer is that they can offer less to the seller because there will be fewers buyers competing to buy firearms. Another advantage could be that Tigard Pawn would agree to run the prepaid transfers first, if relief from the court is provided down the road. There will be a rush to do transfers again if temporary relief is provided.
 
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Clearly I’ve needed to charge allot more for transfers. It’s never been a gravy train.
Not one to tell you what to do...
Nor is the gunshop I'm about to talk about in Oregon.....

However....
The nearest FFL to me that does private party transfers , charges $50 to do so.
Now I understand that a transfer takes time...at least one employee...and can run the risk of delay or denied.
Also they need to pay their employees...bills ...rent....and the like.

But that $50 transfer fee charge does make think twice before I buy things like ammo , accessories or even a new gun from them.
Andy
 
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Clearly I’ve needed to charge allot more for transfers. It’s never been a gravy train.
FFLs are going to have more work involved with transfers under Measure 114 rules so yes you should consider raising your transfer fees to cover the extra work involved.
 
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Don't see why. It'll be the same as adding a CHL number.
(c) The dealer may not transfer the firearm unless the dealer receives a unique approval number from the
department and, within 48 hours of completing the transfer, the dealer shall notify the state that the transfer to the permit holder was completed.

I didn't think this was currently required but I could be wrong?
 
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It seems like many of you FFL guys are resigned to just accepting the end of revenue streams. Carry on as you like, that will lead to more business for the FFls who haven't given up.
LOL, I make ammo, lots and lots of ammo. That's what an 06 FFL does. The 114 has given me more job security than ever before. Every gun sold needs at least 2 boxes of ammo and then there is the fear that soon Oregon with implement a permit for ammo just like California. Giving up I am not. Adapting I am all the way to the bank.
 
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Transfer fees are probably more of a way of generating good will for future sales of guns, ammo, and accessories than a profitable activity. I think the real issue is whether gun stores can make enough on ammo and accessories to survive months or maybe a year or more of hardly any gun sales because nobody has permits to buy. My understanding is margins are fairly low in guns and much better on ammo and accessories, or at least were. But its probably the new guns that inspires much buying of accessories. In addition, these days its easier to get accessories on line. I think we are going to lose a lot of dedicated gun shops unless we get legal relief fast.
 
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This is not a scam and you are mischaracterizing the intent of offering a prepaid transfer service. One advantage to buyer is that they can offer less to the seller because there will be fewers buyers competing to buy firearms. Another advantage could be that Tigard Pawn would agree to run the prepaid transfers first, if relief from the court is provided down the road. There will be a rush to do transfers again if temporary relief is provided.
The conditions set if 114 stays creates the "buyers market" condition... not through any action or facilitation TP could make. Offering as part of the package to process their BGC's first after obtaining a permit "could" be an advantage but at the risk of losing 60% of the cost of the firearm they wish to purchase, it's a drop in the bucket and I don't know that anyone would fall for that type of risk. It does nothing to affect what they pay, what would be required of them, how long it would take, or any determination on the final outcome of their intended purchase. (IE., increasing the odds or assuring they will in fact be issued a permit)

Remebering too that permit issuance will be a trickle, not a flood. The danger that the BGC would suddenly be overburdened is remote... so being #1 in line of, say, 20... or even 100... that's not a big sell/benefit.

To be "ethical" there has to be a balance of equity between both parties. The benefit to the buyer being miniscule at best to nill... while at incredible risk... while the benefit to a failed permit application would be hugely beneficial to the business, actually desireable, and at no risk to business... there is no balance of equity. AKA, Predatory practice. Borderline theft by deception. "Scam".
 
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The conditions set if 114 stays creates the "buyers market" condition... not through any action or facilitation TP could make. Offering as part of the package to process their BGC's first after obtaining a permit "could" be an advantage but at the risk of losing 60% of the cost of the firearm they wish to purchase, it's a drop in the bucket and I don't know that anyone would fall for that type of risk. It does nothing to affect what they pay, what would be required of them, how long it would take, or any determination on the final outcome of their intended purchase. (IE., increasing the odds or assuring they will in fact be issued a permit)

Remebering too that permit issuance will be a trickle, not a flood. The danger that the BGC would suddenly be overburdened is remote... so being #1 in line of, say, 20... or even 100... that's not a big sell/benefit.

To be "ethical" there has to be a balance of equity between both parties. The benefit to the buyer being miniscule at best to nill... while at incredible risk... while the benefit to a failed permit application would be hugely beneficial to the business, actually desireable, and at no risk to business... there is no balance of equity. AKA, Predatory practice. Borderline theft by deception. "Scam".
I think the market will let us know whether there is a demand for a prepaid transfer service or not.
 
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I think the market will let us know whether there is a demand for a prepaid transfer service or not.
Undoubtedly! People fall for auto and payday loans all the time. The question really becomes, is it a sound long term business plan? For me, if I knew TP was engaging in that type of activity... I can guarantee... I would openly make it known what they are doinge, discourage folks from shopping there and not one hot red cent will find it's way from my wallet to theirs.

You kinda have to ask yourself the question too... do you "really" want to piss off a person that likely owns more than just that one gun they are trying to purchase through you??🤣

What I've always wished to see from LGS is hunting or shooting packages. In the scuba industry... it constitutes a substantial income stream, encourages folks to enter the sport and drives sales like you wouldn't believe.

I've often wondered why they haven't tapped into that stream for a long time.
 
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""I would openly make it known what they are doinge, discourage folks from shopping there and not one hot red cent will find it's way from my wallet to theirs"

Well, that is one way to help FFLs to survive. I chose to go in and help out in the store. But we all have our own ways of doing things.
 
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Well, that is one way to help FFLs to survive. I chose to go in and help out in the store. But we all have our own ways of doing things.
You're assuming I don't? 🤣

I absolutely want them to survive! But certainly not by eating their own and to the detriment of the community they serve. Biting the hand that feeds you is a piss poor plan for success, IMHO.

In a cost to benefit analysis that should fall somewhere in the realm of "common sense".:s0155:
 
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What I've always wished to see from LGS is hunting or shooting packages. In the scuba industry... it constitutes a substantial income stream, encourages folks to enter the sport and drives sales like you wouldn't believe.

I've often wondered why they haven't tapped into that stream for a long time.
It is very common, at least around here, to get a box of ammo with the purchase of a handgun.
 
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It is very common, at least around here, to get a box of ammo with the purchase of a handgun.
By hunting/shooting packages I meant organized events/trips. Like... organizing... say... a nutria or field rat shoot. A public land paper punchers get together and barbecue. Seasonal group hunting packages that folks newer to the area or gun world would benefit from. How many times do we see on here, "where can I go shooting?", "anyone know of a good place to duck hunt?", "I want to elk hunt but don't have anyone to go with." Etc, etc.

On the larger scale... a MT big game party hunt or even an African safari.

Providing opportunities for gun owners to participate in activities or in locations they might not have the means, knowledge or connections to undertake on their own.

All for reasonable compensation, of course, but it also drives firearm, accessory and ammo sales.

I mean... I might not be thinking about going to louisiana for a hog hunt all by myself, but if a local shop advertised an all inclusive 2 day package for $1200 and all I gotta do it show up at the aiport and go shootin... I would probably be pretty tempted. 🤣
 
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