JavaScript is disabled
Our website requires JavaScript to function properly. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser settings before proceeding.
Exactly how much profit would that actually generate though? Margins would have to be incredibly thin as well to leave room for the other FFL/FFL's to get a cut off of. I kind of doubt it would generate anything remotly close to offsetting the loses due to no public firearm sales.
The idea I am promoting is to have many FFLs. It's just one piece of the income puzzle the shops are going to have to figure out, if they want to survive. The gravy train days are over and FFLs may have to turn it into a part gig. School bus driver by day, gun pusher at night.
 
The idea I am promoting is to have many FFLs. It's just one piece of the income puzzle the shops are going to have to figure out, if they want to survive. The gravy train days are over and FFLs may have to turn it into a part gig. School bus driver by day, gun pusher at night.
I guess the question would also be... if they are all buying from the same supply network and have access to the same inventory as all the others.. why would one FFL shoot himself in the foot by paying more than he/she has to for a firearm from another FFL? Basically, splitting whatever profit they can make off a gun between each other... vs.. buying from the wholeseller and keeping all the profit for themselves.

I'm not sure how they could generate any meaningful income from that(??)
 
Hopefully they have a good online presence already and can sell guns to those that still reside in the USA.

Otherwise they are going to be an ammo/accessory house for those who can't plan ahead and get it online for 1/3 the cost and 1/3000 the bombastic attitude.

Whether that business model can keep paying the bills remains to be seen.
 
I guess the question would also be... if they are all buying from the same supply network and have access to the same inventory as all the others.. why would one FFL shoot himself in the foot by paying more than he/she has to for a firearm from another FFL? Basically, splitting whatever profit they can make off a gun between each other... vs.. buying from the wholeseller and keeping all the profit for themselves.

I'm not sure how they could generate any meaningful income from that(??)
Let's pretend that State and Federal law requires anybody who wants to buy or sell a firearm to have a CHL. As long as you have a CHL you don't have to do a background check for transfers. CHL holders can buy, sell and trade with any other CHL holder. In that scenerio the more CHL holders the better. All CHL holders are playing on a level field.

Now swap in FFL for CHL and you will understand what I envision.
 
Let's pretend that State and Federal law requires anybody who wants to buy or sell a firearm to have a CHL. As long as you have a CHL you don't have to do a background check for transfers. CHL holders can buy, sell and trade with any other CHL holder. In that scenerio the more CHL holders the better. All CHL holders are playing on a level field.

Now swap in FFL for CHL and you will understand what I envision.
Let's pretend the constitution is applied properly.

End of exercise.
 
Fun exercise, but it's not going to keep small business FFL's going. Maybe a few that specialize in NFA stuff but trading amongst themselves isn't going to generate sh!t.
 
The idea I am promoting is to have many FFLs. It's just one piece of the income puzzle the shops are going to have to figure out, if they want to survive. The gravy train days are over and FFLs may have to turn it into a part gig. School bus driver by day, gun pusher at night.
Sounds like you should quit armchair quarterbacking and become an FFL yourself.
 
Sounds like you should quit armchair quarterbacking and become an FFL yourself.
I would like to but our condo situation, with it's anti business HOA rules and board, is not conducive to operating it here. If anybody opens up a community FFL center nearby for reasonable space rent, I will look into it further. For now I will continue helping out TP4M.
 
Let's pretend that State and Federal law requires anybody who wants to buy or sell a firearm to have a CHL. As long as you have a CHL you don't have to do a background check for transfers. CHL holders can buy, sell and trade with any other CHL holder. In that scenerio the more CHL holders the better. All CHL holders are playing on a level field.

Now swap in FFL for CHL and you will understand what I envision.
I get what your idea is.... it's just not calculating in that a gun shop has reoccuring bills to pay and are trying to support a family. They require a steady and certain level of profit on every transaction. FFL supply prices are also fixed. Unlike CHL's where price depends more on supply and demand and there is room for negotiation.

Buying at a fixed wholesale price to sell at the same wholesale price doesn't generate any profit. No FFL will spend more for a firearm than he could purchase for the exact same price himeself.... no matter how many FFL's there are in the state.
 
I get what your idea is.... it's just not calculating in that a gun shop has reoccuring bills to pay and are trying to support a family. They require a steady and certain level of profit on every transaction. FFL supply prices are also fixed. Unlike CHL's where price depends more on supply and demand and there is room for negotiation.

Buying at a fixed wholesale price to sell at the same wholesale price doesn't generate any profit. No FFL will spend more for a firearm than he could purchase for the exact same price himeself.... no matter how many FFL's there are in the state.
I guess they are all screwed then and should just throw in the towel. RIP LGSs.

Meanwhile I will continue to support my favorite shop and encourage them to diversify and fight to the last breath.
 
Last Edited:
I guess they are all screwed then and should just throw in the towel. RIP LGSs.

Meanwhile I will continue to support my favorite shop and encourage them to fight to the last breath.
Obviously it's not quite the time to up and quit while litigation is just starting, but if it's apparent this will be a long term prohibition... and their only revenue stream is firearms sales/support/repair... it certainly might be wise to cut their losses and shutter their doors.

It doesn't do them any good to stay open until every last dime they own has been spent and they are leveraged as deep into debt as their creditors will allow. That's just bad business.

It's certainly a sad state of affairs, but reality is often cruel. Thank you OR voters!
 
Obviously it's not quite the time to up and quit while litigation is just starting, but if it's apparent this will be a long term prohibition... and their only revenue stream is firearms sales/support/repair... it certainly might be wise to cut their losses and shutter their doors.

It doesn't do them any good to stay open until every last dime they own has been spent and they are leveraged as deep into debt as their creditors will allow. That's just bad business.

It's certainly a sad state of affairs, but reality is often cruel. Thank you OR voters!
They could always transition into being a pot shop. Being a drug dealer has become more socially acceptable than selling guns.
 
Parts sales for AR, Glock, P320 & other customizable arms. Optics, ammo, 10rd magazines... coffee, Tshirts, classes(ccw)...
There will be ways initially for shops with lower overhead to stay in business for the near term. They may even make more money on the higher margins available from upgrade parts than they did selling high volume/low margin firearms.

It depends on how long it takes to get an injunction or licensing scheme in place.
For those that want to retire, this last month may have been a gift. For the little guy or those with high overhead, they will end up closing.

My local guy is looking forward to a vacation.
 
I feel bad for all of you affected in Or. and hope some injunctive relief is on the way. I assume Wa is taking notes and licking it's chops to do something similar. It was kind of interesting talking to the owner of the pawn shop I have used for the last couple transfers here in Wa. He said he is pulling out all tools and other misc. crap and going to all firearms. It is a bold maneuver but I will fully support him the best I can.
I'm also in Wash., don't know the Ore. gun shop scene. Around here, independent gun shops have already become kinda scarce due to a combination of factors.

1. Rent. Which has been driving many small businesses of all sorts out. Unless you own the building (which has costs of its own), you've got to do X amount of business in a month just to break even on rent. Kitchen table FFL's don't have this issue, but most of them don't do much volume anyway. And if their main sales venue is a gun show, forget about it.

2. Regulation. Some area pawn shops have dropped dealing in guns due to the paperwork, waiting periods, I-1639, potential liability, etc.

3. If the courts back up Ore. 114, in my view it will have a stifling effect on retail. Even after it gets property set up and in place. Because many nimrods who'd just buy a gun for the heck of it no longer will. Many just won't want to fool with it. Which leaves harder core gun people. Many of whom have already expressed a desire not to participate under 114. Which might change some with time. But without many new, occasional buyers, sales will be well reduced, I'd think. Transfers at their current customary fee levels aren't enough to keep most shops alive. But that could change as well, with fees climbing significantly.

4. I must add this anecdote. A highly organized, well-motivated shop can do very well on transfer fees. The shop I used to help liquidate much of my holdings was one such. He is more in the business of transferring and receiving firearms than he is in selling them. He's got it down to an art, his fees are very reasonable which attracts people from several counties around, AND -- he owns his own building.

5. Larger gun shops that also have an indoor range on premises have an advantage of bringing people in, but they also have more expenses to deal with.

6. In my opinion, Ore. 114 may have the unintended effect of encouraging black market gun sales. Ordinarily law-abiding people will be overly tempted to engage in private sales without doing a legal transfer.

7. Lastly, I was wondering just how many people this might concern in the way of making a living. I looked up online, as of June 2021, there were 2,152 in Ore. Which isn't a big number. Unless you are an employee who is losing his job. I suppose this number includes the chain stores. Do they need a separate license for each location? I don't know. In any case, likely some people stand to lose their work but it won't be thousands.
 
I'm also in Wash., don't know the Ore. gun shop scene. Around here, independent gun shops have already become kinda scarce due to a combination of factors.

1. Rent. Which has been driving many small businesses of all sorts out. Unless you own the building (which has costs of its own), you've got to do X amount of business in a month just to break even on rent. Kitchen table FFL's don't have this issue, but most of them don't do much volume anyway. And if their main sales venue is a gun show, forget about it.

2. Regulation. Some area pawn shops have dropped dealing in guns due to the paperwork, waiting periods, I-1639, potential liability, etc.

3. If the courts back up Ore. 114, in my view it will have a stifling effect on retail. Even after it gets property set up and in place. Because many nimrods who'd just buy a gun for the heck of it no longer will. Many just won't want to fool with it. Which leaves harder core gun people. Many of whom have already expressed a desire not to participate under 114. Which might change some with time. But without many new, occasional buyers, sales will be well reduced, I'd think. Transfers at their current customary fee levels aren't enough to keep most shops alive. But that could change as well, with fees climbing significantly.

4. I must add this anecdote. A highly organized, well-motivated shop can do very well on transfer fees. The shop I used to help liquidate much of my holdings was one such. He is more in the business of transferring and receiving firearms than he is in selling them. He's got it down to an art, his fees are very reasonable which attracts people from several counties around, AND -- he owns his own building.

5. Larger gun shops that also have an indoor range on premises have an advantage of bringing people in, but they also have more expenses to deal with.

6. In my opinion, Ore. 114 may have the unintended effect of encouraging black market gun sales. Ordinarily law-abiding people will be overly tempted to engage in private sales without doing a legal transfer.

7. Lastly, I was wondering just how many people this might concern in the way of making a living. I looked up online, as of June 2021, there were 2,152 in Ore. Which isn't a big number. Unless you are an employee who is losing his job. I suppose this number includes the chain stores. Do they need a separate license for each location? I don't know. In any case, likely some people stand to lose their work but it won't be thousands.
"4. I must add this anecdote. A highly organized, well-motivated shop can do very well on transfer fees. The shop I used to help liquidate much of my holdings was one such. He is more in the business of transferring and receiving firearms than he is in selling them. He's got it down to an art, his fees are very reasonable which attracts people from several counties around, AND -- he owns his own building."


This is very true. Tigard Pawn has also turned transfers into a big part of their revenue streams. M114 is going to hit them especially hard and they will have to diversify to survive.
 
I am throwing this idea out there for motivated FFLs. Once the permit to purchase process is developed, an FFL could sell a training package at the time they sell a firearm or a transfer service.

It might work like this. Two people come in and want to do a transfer. You explain that the buyer needs to have a permit to purchase to initiate a background check. If the buyer doesn't have one then you require them to buy the training package in order for you to proceed with a transfer service. If the buyer agrees to buy a training package then you agree to provide a transfer service and take possession of firearm. The buyer can then wrap up his deal with seller. As the FFL you will hold the firearm while the buyer gets the training completed, applies for and receives his permit. Once he has his permit then he comes back to your shop and you proceed with the background check process.

This will require you to sit on the firearm for much longer than normal and will probably only work for shops with generous storage space.

The training package could be something you provide if you're approved to offer the training or it could be something that you contract out and take a cut of of it.

Nothing is going to be normal with firearm sales and transfers anymore, so start thinking about how you are going to adapt.
 
I am throwing this idea out there for motivated FFLs. Once the permit to purchase process is developed, an FFL could sell a training package at the time they sell a firearm or a transfer service.

It might work like this. Two people come in and want to do a transfer. You explain that the buyer needs to have a permit to purchase to initiate a background check. If the buyer doesn't have one then you require them to buy the training package in order for you to proceed with a transfer service. If the buyer agrees to buy a training package then you agree to provide a transfer service and take possession of firearm. The buyer can then wrap up his deal with seller. As the FFL you will hold the firearm while the buyer gets the training completed, applies for and receives his permit. Once he has his permit then he comes back to your shop and you proceed with the background check process.

This will require you to sit on the firearm for much longer than normal and will probably only work for shops with generous storage space.

The training package could be something you provide if you're approved to offer the training or it could be something that you contract out and take a cut of of it.

Nothing is going to be normal with firearm sales and transfers anymore, so start thinking about how you are going to adapt.
I heard this too many times when visiting FFLs about fighting 114. "Business opportunity" and "I believe people should have more training" seemed to be the most popular catchphrases.
 
I heard this too many times when visiting FFLs about fighting 114. "Business opportunity" and "I believe people should have more training" seemed to be the most popular catchphrases.
If these guys are going to survive they will have to adapt to what current rules and regs are in place. We as individuals can choose to ignore Measure 114 restrictions, FFLs can not unless they want to risk losing their license and potentially their livelihood.
 

Upcoming Events

Tillamook Gun & Knife Show
Tillamook, OR
"The Original" Kalispell Gun Show
Kalispell, MT
Teen Rifle 1 Class
Springfield, OR
Kids Firearm Safety 2 Class
Springfield, OR

New Resource Reviews

New Classified Ads

Back Top