Estacada fire started by shooters

[DieselScout]

Isn't it required (law?) to have a fire extenguisher/water and a shovel when you're out there to put that stuff out anyways?

I don't know how much time I've spent out there, but the only fires I've managed to cause are the ones I made to cook or warm up.

First, most people don't know this. Second do you think a target shooters who blows apart a TV, old freezer and a few trees are going to care about carrying the required equipment during fire season? My guess is no since they seem like uncaring P0S's in the first place.

 

[U201491]

That origin was tossed out by some JA on tv that has no clue to what started it and just went after shooters. Probably a bloomberg flunkie.
They have no clue how it started yet. Probably some yuppie greenie cooking a boca and tofu burger

 

[bolus]

So I shouldn't be shooting tannerite with my Dragon's Breath rounds on a red flag day? Sheesh, I wish someone tole me sooner.

 

[U201491]

Most people don't put those in grass or brush.
And rock quarries don't burn.
Just some bloombergite running off at the mouth. They plan disinformation tactics like that. Truth isn't in their agenda at all.

 

[Garg]

I wouldn't be surprised if it were irresponsible shooters. There are plenty of them. It also wouldn't surprise me if it were some bloomberger setting up the shooters. Nothing surprises me anymore.

Am I jaded??? LOL

 

[rick benjamin]

http://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/4106/
http://www.deq.state.or.us/aqi/
I used to fish the upper Clack and cut firewood from the slash piles.
Was a fine way to spend the weekends.
I recall it was required to carry a bucket, shovel for fighting fire.
As/of four hours ago, <broken link removed>

 

[U201491]

http://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/4106/
http://www.deq.state.or.us/aqi/
I used to fish the upper Clack and cut firewood from the slash piles.
Was a fine way to spend the weekends.
I recall it was required to carry a bucket, shovel for fighting fire.
As/of four hours ago, <broken link removed>

Yep, We always carried buckets, shovels and axes when cutting firewood, hunting and even fishing.
Just good common sense. .

 

[usagi]

Even with shooting steel, I cant see a fire starting. Its all I shoot and we've even tried to spark a flame..

steel jacketed/steel core ammo + rock = lots of sparks

_all_ 5.45x39 (ak74), nearly all 7.62x54r (mosin, svt, psl, vepr), and nearly all old milsurp ammo (8mm mauser, 30-06, etc) are steel jacket/steel core.

combine that with the extremely dry conditions lately. very easy to start a fire by target shooting.

 

[Provincial]

KGW "News" -reporting "Health officials" - what clowns!:

"Health officials cautioned that anyone with respiratory issues should stay indoors, stay hydrated, stop using candles, gas, propane and wood burning stoves. Smokers should also limit the use of cigarettes due to the added smoke in the air from the fire." (Bold italics mine)

How much smoke is a cigarette going to add to this? Get real! Who is burning a wood stove on 90-degree days? It sounds like at least one segment of government has already adopted "legalized" marijuana.

By the way, WWII black-tip 30-06 ammunition was steel core, copper-jacketed. I am not accustomed to seeing WWII-era small caliber ammunition with steel-jacketed bullets. Eastern Bloc stuff, yes.

 

[Provincial]

KGW "News" -reporting "Health officials" - what clowns!:

"Health officials cautioned that anyone with respiratory issues should stay indoors, stay hydrated, stop using candles, gas, propane and wood burning stoves. Smokers should also limit the use of cigarettes due to the added smoke in the air from the fire." (Bold italics mine)

How much smoke is a cigarette going to add to this? Get real! Who is burning a wood stove on 90-degree days? It sounds like at least one segment of government has already adopted "legalized" marijuana.

By the way, WWII black-tip 30-06 ammunition was steel core, copper-jacketed. I am not accustomed to seeing WWII-era small caliber ammunition with steel-jacketed bullets. Eastern Bloc stuff, yes.

My own PSA:

Oregon health officials are cautioned to avoid smoking marijuana cigarettes before making official pronouncements.

Jock

 

[usagi]

By the way, WWII black-tip 30-06 ammunition was steel core, copper-jacketed. I am not accustomed to seeing WWII-era small caliber ammunition with steel-jacketed bullets. Eastern Bloc stuff, yes.

the surplus 30-06 (greek) that the CMP is currently selling is copper plated steel jacket.

i have yet to find 8mm surplus which _wasn't_ steel jacket (and corrosive to boot). egyptian and turkish ammo for example.

iirc _all_ the current manufacture tula 7.62x39 is bimetal jacket - copper washed steel. it's pretty rare to see non steel 7.62x39 as it's more expensive and everyone wants to shoot their AK as cheaply as possible.

some people have even found winchester white box "fmj" 308 to be copper plated steel jacket.

bottom line -- _far_ more ammo is capable of causing fires than you might think.

 

[ZigZagZeke]

The Memaloose Rd gravel pit is on the south side of 224. The fire just jumped to the south side of the river today. From what I can see the fire started near 224 further east. Most likely a cigarette tossed out the window of a car. The shooter thing is BS.

 

[misplacedtexan]

Well, my company pulled two helicopters back from Minnesota a little early to shift them over to the fire. If you're in the area look for a Green/white 407 and a Blue/white 206 out there dropping water

 

[ZA_Survivalist]

steel jacketed/steel core ammo + rock = lots of sparks

_all_ 5.45x39 (ak74), nearly all 7.62x54r (mosin, svt, psl, vepr), and nearly all old milsurp ammo (8mm mauser, 30-06, etc) are steel jacket/steel core.

combine that with the extremely dry conditions lately. very easy to start a fire by target shooting.

Perhaps.. But aside from the "mild" 54r the rest of those calibers aren't very likely to be shot, let alone shot in high enough volume. I doubt it was set via that way.

Its a false flag justification.

The primary things Ive seen (aftermath) is cigarette butts sometimes entire vehicle ashtrays..
Gas tanks or open flames paired with tannerite..

Heck even broken glass at the right angle could have been the cause.. Which Im betting my money on. That can be left by campers and loggers alike not just shooters.

Without proper investigation many of us are assuming that it truly was shooters who are to blame.. Ill wait until I see the evidence.

 

[usagi]

Perhaps.. But aside from the "mild" 54r the rest of those calibers aren't very likely to be shot, let alone shot in high enough volume. I doubt it was set via that way.

say what? everyone and their dog has an AK. every single time I go to public land there's some yahoo bump firing their AK from the hip and hollering like a doofus. virtually every projectile that comes out of an AK is steel.

it doesn't have to be high volume. one projectile hitting a rock near dry grass is all it takes.

steel projectiles are no joke, gun owners are our own worst enemy. dismissing the risk -- not good.

 

[Koda]

A study of ignition by rifle bullets....

http://www.fs.fed.us/rm/pubs/rmrs_rp104.pdf

 

[ZA_Survivalist]

say what? everyone and their dog has an AK. every single time I go to public land there's some yahoo bump firing their AK from the hip and hollering like a doofus. virtually every projectile that comes out of an AK is steel.

it doesn't have to be high volume. one projectile hitting a rock near dry grass is all it takes.

steel projectiles are no joke, gun owners are our own worst enemy. dismissing the risk -- not good.

Now are you talking about a steel core or a bimetal jacket?

The misconception is due to your post. I said nothing about bimetal jackets. Of course that exists and is shot frequently.. However you'd be hard pressed to see a fella bump fire true steel core 7.62x39 or 5.45x39 anymore. Not that it doesn't occurs but Ill put money on the fact that other than 54r most guys don't waste steel core ammo thus resulting in a true fire.

Anything can make a "spark". I see it often when shooting steel, but Ive never been able to start a fire, even when we tried.

However there are thousands of variables.. Im not saying it isnt possible its just not likely due to "steel core" ammo.

 

[Rick4070]

A study of ignition by rifle bullets....

http://www.fs.fed.us/rm/pubs/rmrs_rp104.pdf

Interesting that solid copper bullets were also observed to catch the peat medium on fire as well as excelsior....

 

[Will_Power]

Leave it to the idiots and the irresponsible to make it difficult for the rest of us.

Starting a fire, leaving old TVs and microwaves in shooting areas, broken glass and brass everywhere.... it's real goddamn embarrassing sometimes.

 

[3MTA3]

I got curious since I'd never heard of something called 36 Pit in all the years I've lived here. That name refers to mile marker 36 on highway 212 and the location is shown here: http://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/4106/

Sure enough, using Google Earth there is what looks like to be a small overgrown gravel pit at this site with an unofficial parking area. I've driven past it hundreds of times and have noticed the turnout, but I figured it was used mostly by boaters/kayakers.

Scanning the area I can understand the initial conclusion that it was caused by people sighting in their rifles prior to hunting season. I can also see the pit used as a place to stop for lunch or a smoke. I can also see (steep, heavily treed canyon walls) how a cigarette thrown out of any passing vehicle could have caused the fire.

Regardless of cause, this is a real tragedy.