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English Pit

Discussion in 'Outdoor Shooting Areas' started by ryerle23, Feb 21, 2010.

  1. ryerle23

    ryerle23 SW WA Member

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    Just went for the first time a couple of days ago and I am wondering if the experience I had was typical or not. The guy taking the money was quite rude and the two other guys I was with agreed that was probably the worst they have ever been treated not just at a gun range, but any place. The actual shooting was good, enjoyed the use of the spotting scope and sleds. The pistol range officer was great as well. Just trying to figure out if other people have had similar experiences or if I should go with my gut and not go back.
    Thanks
     
  2. The Duck

    The Duck Oregon Active Member

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    I have gone to the pit only once and pretty much never again... I do admit that the range is pretty nice for being in the middle of town and the price was really cheap, I remember paying only $5.00 for entry?

    The person taking the money was the only one there and really rude. I told him that this would be my first time at the range and wanted directions where to go to "zero" in a scope and rifle...

    He directed me to the range and watched via a spotting scope... I loaded two rounds to get a quick cluster and move from there... I put two rounds into the wood beam holding the target (within 1/4 inch of each other), started to adjust the scope when I heard over the loud speaker (or maybe a bull horn), "SHOOTER ON LINE BLA (forget what he said), YOU HAVE PUT ROUNDS INTO THE BEAMS ON PURPOSE, YOU ARE DONE FOR THE DAY"!

    I went up to the man to ask him what was going on and he stated, "you had your rilfe on the wrong range and you fired into the wood frame". Once again he told me, "You are done for the day".

    I explained to him that I asked which range I should go to, he directed me and watched me setup on said range. I also explained to him that I was going to zero in a scope and I would not put another round into the beam after the first adjustment. He only stated to me, "You are done for the day, you can come back on another day".

    This was a few years ago, but after that, I would never go back...

    But, this just might be my experience and the range master could be a really nice guy? :paranoid:
     
  3. dobeman

    dobeman Hillsboro Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    the heavily tatooed guy working the ramshackle shack at the top of the hill? I went to the Pit three weeks ago and met Mr. Friendly. Once I got past him and hiked down into the pit, I enjoyed my shoot. Some older guy came along later sweeping and stuff - he was really nice and thanked me for coming.
     
  4. ryerle23

    ryerle23 SW WA Member

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    Seems you had almost an identical experience to me. I am not a business man, but it would seem to me the first person to greet your customers should be kind and courteous. Just a thought
     
  5. dobeman

    dobeman Hillsboro Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Yeah, I don't know. I'll go back. It's cheap enough. I'll just grunt and act tough as I pay my $15 and move on down to the pit. Small talk is not the gate keeper's forte.
     
  6. gnarkill

    gnarkill Richland, WA Member

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    Yeah I've had the same experience the guy is an a-hole he hardly acknowledges you As you walk up and then is a total dick. The rangemaster guy is great though he walked me through everything my first time there.
     
  7. spectra

    spectra The Couve Moderator Staff Member Bronze Supporter

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    Everyone I talk to has the same thing happen. You first meet mr personality then after that it gets better. Last time I was there the guys on both ranges were great but as stated the first guy:(
     
  8. hevymetlhed1982

    hevymetlhed1982 portland New Member 2016 Volunteer

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    i went there with my wife for the first time the other week. everyone there was helpful, even the front guy with all the tats. they had a decent set of ranges and its open to the public. the rangemaster was also good to both of us so we have no complaints and hope to go back soon. if my only issue was the guy you pay but the shooting was good i agree with doberman here...id grin and bear it so i can do what i came to do-shoot. sorry to hear you had a problem there ryerle, what happened?
     
  9. Throckmorton

    Throckmorton Florence,Ore ah gone Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if it has changed hands? The original owner that I talked to seveal months ago...Randy..was as nice a person as I"ve ever talked to.If he has dickheads working for him I'm sure he'd like to know about it.You can enforce rules without haveing 'THE ENFORCER' attitude.
    the 503 phone number listed on their website ..I"m pretty sure that is his cell no.
    Everyone who had a bad time,give him a call.As I say,I've talked to him a couple of times and he could not be more friendly and helpful,AND he'd want to know who is costing him business by being 'badge heavy'.

    http://englishpit.com/
     
  10. HahnsXD

    HahnsXD Battle Ground WA Active Member

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    The first time I went a few weeks ago the nice guy was working the booth (Doug) I think his name was (grey beard?), very friendly, had no problem showing me around.

    I went a couple of weeks ago and the heavily tatooed guy was working the booth, he wasn't "rude" to me but he was a little abrasive. Doug down on the range continued to be very couteous. Overall I like the place, it's close and it's cheap.
     
  11. garripputo

    garripputo vancouver, wa Member

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    i have been shooting with jeff... or as you guys refer to him "the tattoo'd guy".... for almost 3 years now. he is a nationally certified combat focus shooting instructor had all the other credentials you would expect from someone managing a range. he lives and dies by his job, just because he doesn't do a good job taking your 15 bucks isn't something to judge him by... he isn't a greeter at walmart... he is an instructor... some people might not like how serious he is on a range, he is the first guy to tell you if you screwed up. some people have a problem with it, but sometimes you have to put your ego and preconceived ideas aside and realize that the range has rules and you need to abide by them. from the times that i have seen it most of the time when he's is in the booth and is "rude" to someone, is when he hands them the range rules to read and they hand it back to him 7 seconds later... this range has rules different than other ranges and most people don't know that.... so when someone doesn't read the rules it can make any of their employees a bit on the grumpy side... and trust me that happens everyday. give him another chance, him and randy are great guys, take a class from jeff, ask him a technical question about shooting a handgun, i assure you that you will be impressed.

    i am not saying that this is the exact cause of your experience here, but remember most "public ranges" have people operating them with a stern attitude, there is much more risk and liability in their job than 90% of the jobs out there.
     
    Nightshade and (deleted member) like this.
  12. CCGC

    CCGC Vancouver Member

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    Sorry for the long reply in advance.

    I am the operator of The English Pit Shooting Range and appreciate all of your inputs. As they say, there are always two sides to every story. And, as Paul Harvey would say, ‘Here is the rest of the story’.

    I don’t know how many of you have tried to operate a public shooting range but for those who haven’t I can attest that it is no simple task! A private range has the advantage of screening applicants in a private setting. A public range, well, we never know who we are going to encounter.

    We are seeing more and more new shooters coming to the range as the weather improves. Most are very attentive and have a positive attitude about gun safety and a desire to follow range rules and etiquette. But, the rule of 80/20 applies. I would say that 80% of the people coming to the range fit that positive category and be behave in a manner you would be comfortable shooting next to. This leaves those 20% that fail to show safe handling skills, have negative attitudes, openly display wanton arrogance to range rules or repeatedly show a general lack of safety.

    When we notice a displayed range behavior that needs to be altered, we will take control of the range and then educate. Should we or the range rules be challenged or our efforts be ignored, our attitude turns more towards a ‘Doberman effect’.

    As an example, we have had situations when someone on the handgun range swept their muzzle past people. When reminded not to do that, most people would apologize and say they know better (and we can tell from their body language what they say is true). It’s those who will say, often in an arrogant manner, ‘its ok, the gun is unloaded’ is when we launch into a more intense discussion. Our attitude and approach will turn from education to more demanding and gruff. If someone were to step in as we are having that discussion, they could think we are the meanest people on Earth. I beg to differ – as would others who might have witnessed the entire event would say we are doing our jobs – keeping everyone safe.

    But maybe I am wrong – are you ok with someone you have never met pointing a gun at you? Tell me!

    We had several incidents this past weekend where someone began ignoring or challenging the range rules and safety procedures in vocal and sometimes arrogant fashion. In one case, this resulted in us refusing to provide people access to the range. While we need and want the business, we do not want jeopardize safety by having people with a negative or careless attitude on the range!

    I authorize all of the Range Safety Officers to keep their Grizzly Bear Suit close at hand. That they are to be polite, courteous and helpful to everyone; but when it is warranted, they are to jump into that suit and come down on a one showing carelessness towards safety like so many pounds of dinner. They are expected to take unequivocal control of the range and then address the situation. That is not a nice task and will spark shock on a casual observer.

    Having to do this naturally causes a lingering negative mood. If you came to the range and were met with a ‘bad tempered’ staff person, we most likely had a recent negative encounter with a guest. I am sorry if that is what you witnessed or experienced and hope you give us another opportunity.

    Most will tell you that we try our best to run a laid-back range. To enjoy a pleasant day there is simple. Follow the rules, be polite and courteous to others and they will return the favor. Display arrogance, suggest the rules don’t apply to you or partake in a repeated general lack of safety and that too will be rewarded by a not so friendly exchange from our staff. Period.

    My name is Randy. I am the President of Clark County Gun Cub, Inc. and the operator of The English Pit Shooting Range. Your emails are appreciated because I know that we can always improve what we are doing!
     
  13. CCGC

    CCGC Vancouver Member

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    I hear many old time users of English Pit share this type of story. This routinely happened under the previous management.

    We are new operators and the person who formerly watched everyone from a spotting scope, bark out commands through the PA system and eject people from the range for relatively minor infractions is no longer associated with the range. I would invite you to come back and give us another try!
     
  14. Cougfan2

    Cougfan2 Hillsboro, OR Well-Known Member

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    I know longer shoot at English Pit, but not because of any negative experience I had there. I joined Douglas Ridge which is out near where I work. On the few times I did shoot at English Pit, I had nothing but positive experiences.

    The only negative I would say is the hike down to the pit. This old man's bad knees don't take to it so well. :laugh:
     
  15. FreshAir

    FreshAir Washington Member

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    I have only been to the pit 3 or 4 times and only shot next to the "the tattoo'd guy" on one occasion at the pistol range. He was watching a couple of shooters who i think were relatively new and he was very helpful. And even let them put a couple rounds through his personal CT Kimber which i thought was pretty :cool:.

    Like i said i have only been a few times but my overall experience has been 100% and i tell everyone i talk to that they should check it out. The only bubblegum i have about the place is I wish they had a longer rifle range :D
     
  16. Kain

    Kain Vancouver, WA Member

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    I rarely visit English Pit. I've never had a bad experience there, personally, since the new management took over. Friendly people above and below, both RSO's and shooters. For me, the only draw is the 100 yard range and the benches.

    Considering most of my target shooting is defensive in nature, there is only so much standing at a line and squeezing off one shot per second at a bullseye at one of a few static distances will do for me.

    Now, don't get me wrong, I understand and agree that safety is paramount above all else. But unfortunately, unless the Pit starts making provisions for practical defensive shooting practice for someone other than police departments and SWAT teams, most of my handgun, shotgun, and AR-15 practice will have to continue to be done deep in the hills.
     
  17. JRV

    JRV Vancouver,Wa Member

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    Well I'm the "tattooed guy" everyone is referring to.

    Let me start by saying I apologize if you felt you were treated rudely at the range.

    That being said I think it was said very well above I am not a Walmart greeter. I am the guy responsible for everyone's safety at the range. So yes I can be abrupt and or short at times. I deal with everyone from first time gun owners to the guy who has been shooting his whole life and thinks he doesn't need to read or listen to the range introduction. So as Randy said a prior incident may roll over in my attitude to another guest.

    If you come in again introduce yourself and I will gladly talk to you about any issue you have with the range, its operation and or me and try to resolve the issue.
     
  18. dobeman

    dobeman Hillsboro Oregon Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Thanks CCGC and JRV for clarifying any misgivings I may have had. It was my first visit to the Pit. I'm definitely coming back. And in light of garripputo's endorsement - I'd love to take lessons from someone with Jeff's expertise.... are such lessons available, and where? thanks
     
  19. JRV

    JRV Vancouver,Wa Member

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    We hold Combat Focus Shooting classes at least once a month and I can do private instruction also. You can go to http://www.englishpit.com or http://www.icetraining.us all the Vancouver, Wa classes on the I.C.E Training Co site are taught by me at English Pit. Besides the class June 11,12,13. That will be taught by Rob Pincus and I will assistant instruct. Or go to my profile on here and email me directly.
     
  20. NWPilgrim

    NWPilgrim Portland area Member

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    Thanks for letting me know English Pit is open again! I went out this afternoon. Jeff/Tattoo :) was a nice guy at the booth and answered all my questions, and was brief but helpful.

    Great little range. $15 for the day (includes two targets and they have hearing protection available), informal as long as you follow the safety rules. There were three other shooters on the rifle line and it went smooth with everyone cooperating on the hot/cold range calls.

    l'd like to say it was a horrible place and nobody should go there (except me!), but it was great. They have one scope set up, a community stapler, lots of different rifle rests from carpeted wood blocks, Caldwell shot bags, steel rifle rests and even a Caldwell lead sled rest. I appreciate the daily rate and no annual fee REQUIRED.

    Worth supporting to keep around!