Educate me on private sales at PDX gunshows...

[Nwcid]

How does anyone who does a FTF sale know jf the buyer is legal....???

Again that is NOT the requirement by law.

The requirement is to "not know" or "have reasonable" cause. So depending on how and where you sale that can vary. Say you make a deal with someone on here and they live in a different state and dont use an FFL you HAD "reasonable cause" and should not have sold FTF. Or say you put an ad in the paper and a buyer shows up in a car with WA plates on, that should give you "reasonable cause" and should not make the sale unless they can prove otherwise say with an OR DL. Say the person makes some remark that makes you think it might not be on the level, pass on the sale.

On the other hand I have refused some sales to people who were 100% legal because it did not "feel" right.

 

[jbett98]

If you have any reservations about a private sale, get a signed bill of sale that includes the buyers drivers license.
If the buyer complains, then find another buyer.

 

[Nwcid]

If you have any reservations about a private sale, get a signed bill of sale that includes the buyers drivers license.
If the buyer complains, then find another buyer.

That fully is an option and the nice thing about living in a mostly free county.

Many people buy in FTF sales for "no records" as they believe in following the law (BOS and DL are not required), and/or they believe in keeping themselves private, and/or they are worried about what the "gov" could do, and/or ect.

This is on of the reasons I will never join WAC, https://washingtonarmscollectors.org/ as they are a "pro-gun" group the has rules that go above and beyond state or federal laws in an effort to keep you "safer". Sounds like exactly what the anti gun groups want.

 

[telero]

Here are the relevant Oregon Statutes:

ORS 166.438 - Transfer of firearms at gun shows - 2011 Oregon Revised Statutes
ORS 166.436 - Firearm transfers by persons other than gun dealers - 2011 Oregon Revised Statutes
ORS 166.441 - Form for transfer of firearm at gun show - 2011 Oregon Revised Statutes

 

[CoastRange57]

No private gun sales in the parking lot. There are undercover cops looking for illegal transactions.

There are also Federal agents there, ATF as well.

I saw two of the scuzzy looking dudes you ever saw, looked like complete rednecks, make contact with both buyers and sellers, pull their Federal shields up out of their shirts, and escort the buyer and seller outside or to a room. Removed them from where you could see what was going on. I have seen them seize weapons as well.

Lees contact with any LEO for official reasons about firearms is a good thing.

 

[U201491]

But that is NOT what the law says.

Firearms - Frequently Asked Questions - Unlicensed Persons | ATF

Q: To whom may an unlicensed person transfer firearms under the GCA?
A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.
[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(d), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]

Very true, that is not required by law, but is good sense for self preservation and retaining freedom and keeping your financial resources intact. If we do not guard ourselves the AH leftists will use it as a weapon for control. It is taking personal responsibility for your actions and not having controls jammed down your throat.

 

[U201491]

How does anyone who does a FTF sale know jf the buyer is legal....???

It is your responsibility morally at least to make an effort to find out.

 

[U201491]

Well, as I see, on a regular basis in the fire arms for sale sections of NWFA, ask to see a current CCP.

That is one way.

 

[U201491]

But not all people who are legal to own a firearm have a permit. I dont have one and have never set foot in jail or been in any kind of trouble does that mean I shouldnt be allowed to buy a gun private party?

A DL, And a phone call to get a simple check works. Nothing is 100%, but it shows your intentions and will keep you from staying awake at night wondering if you sold to someone that may have intended to use in crimes. Also, if you buy from someone you dont know and they just want money and dont seem to care who they sell it to....... had they just murdered someone with it ? Remember that bullets can be tracked to individual arms by comparing the marks on the bullet and comparing to the lands and groove marks. Also
From casing feed marks and firing pin markings. In combination they are like fingerprints.
If you purchased one like that, a good barrel lapping or replacement might be good to do.
Also a good bill of sale with ID and even veh lic number is always a good thing to do.
With the number of idiotic laws and how easy it is for civil litigation it is just good CYA.
Failure to do those things only feeds the anti AH's ammo to use against us all.

 

[telero]

There are also Federal agents there, ATF as well.

ATF wouldn't be there to deal with a FTF transaction, that's state level issue. If feds were involved it would have been something bigger.

 

[Nwcid]

So by reasonable efforts that sounds like everyone here wants to do what the anti gunners think we should be doing.................... So if it is such a good idea why are we fighting so hard for it not to happen?

 

[NWGlockgal]

Sale was initiated at the gun show and the parking lot is part of the property.

166.433 Findings regarding transfers of firearms. The people of this state find that:

(1) The laws of Oregon regulating the sale of firearms contain a loophole that allows people other than gun dealers to sell firearms at gun shows without first conducting criminal background checks;

(2) It is necessary for the safety of the people of Oregon that any person who transfers a firearm at a gun show be required to request a criminal background check before completing the transfer of the firearm; and

(3) It is in the best interests of the people of Oregon that any person who transfers a firearm at any location other than a gun show be allowed to voluntarily request a criminal background check before completing the transfer of the firearm. [2001 c.1 §1]

Most interesting.......thanks!

 

[U201491]

So by reasonable efforts that sounds like everyone here wants to do what the anti gunners think we should be doing.................... So if it is such a good idea why are we fighting so hard for it not to happen?

A damned mandate vs voluntary is the difference.
Besides, the DOJ will make sure criminals have their guns. Look at the job they do arming the Mexican cartels and how well obama arms Americas enemies................

 

[308]

So does this mean that "gun buy back" programs are breaking the law if more than 25 transactions occur?

Of course it does, but when anyone asks the sponsors of such events PDX PD/Ceasefire Oregon, it's "pffffttt, we are not having a gun show here"

 

[Mikej]

But not all people who are legal to own a firearm have a permit. I dont have one and have never set foot in jail or been in any kind of trouble does that mean I shouldnt be allowed to buy a gun private party?

Not one bit. I've just seen on the site that (some) people will only sell FTF if the person has the permit.

Personally, I'm going to get a feel for the person, see a drivers license, have a good little chat not just texts (I don't text), and a phone call or three to set up the meeting that WON'T be late at night behind the bowling alley or such.

Mike

 

[MinnesotaORnewbie]

Sale was initiated at the gun show and the parking lot is part of the property.

166.433 Findings regarding transfers of firearms. The people of this state find that:

(1) The laws of Oregon regulating the sale of firearms contain a loophole that allows people other than gun dealers to sell firearms at gun shows without first conducting criminal background checks;

(2) It is necessary for the safety of the people of Oregon that any person who transfers a firearm at a gun show be required to request a criminal background check before completing the transfer of the firearm; and

(3) It is in the best interests of the people of Oregon that any person who transfers a firearm at any location other than a gun show be allowed to voluntarily request a criminal background check before completing the transfer of the firearm. [2001 c.1 §1]

Hmmm, the word "request" seems flexible. What is the difference from doing a contact, negotiation, and then sale at a gun show or in the parking lot of one as compared to contact using the internet, word of mouth, or anything else and than meeting at a store parking lot and then making the sale or purchase. I have never thought about this question.

 

[MinnesotaORnewbie]

This was a good post. I was also unsure of the rules pertaining to a transaction at a gun show. I never personally have bought or sold at a gun show, but very good info from people. Thank you OP for the question.