DIES, Lee vs. RCBS vs ?

[mjbskwim]

Whole thing for nickel casings (pistols)
But you can just buy the sizing plugs/rods for your regular dies

(waits for right answer)

 

[deadshot2]

I have a question I feel I should probably know the answer to, but I don't. A cursory look in the internet didn't yield my answer, so at the real risk of sounding dumb:

In carbide die sets, is it the sizer die only that has the carbide "ring" or sleeve? Are the seater and expander dies steel or carbide also?

The only die that needs "carbide" is the sizing die. In pistol dies it's so the loader doesn't have to lube the cases before sizing. The expander or seater doesn't need to be carbide as there isn't the same amount of pressure/friction involved. That said, there are different "rules" for "bottleneck" rifle cases. Due to their complex shapes lube is required when sizing so carbide isn't a benefit with the exception of those dies used for producing commercial quantities of ammo. Even if a bottleneck rifle die is a carbide die, lube is still required. The die is just made from carbide in order to resist the wear high loading speeds and high volumes would inflict on a standard die. They are darn expensive. Consider a Lee sizing die for .223 vs a Dillon .223 carbide die. Over $100 more for the Dillon and it's not because of the "Blue Box".

That said, some die manufacturers, Redding in particular, offer a carbide expander ball. When the case is squeezed back to size, when the case is being withdrawn from the die the expander ball makes sure the neck is the proper size for desired neck tension. Conventional dies with hardened steel expanders often need lube inside the neck (usually dry like ground mica or graphite) to keep it from chattering or squeaking when drawn through the neck. A carbide ball is highly polished and hard enough where it doesn't drag on the inside of the case neck thus eliminating the need for lube. As for straight walled rifle cases, they're just longer pistol cases and carbide "no lube" dies are also available for them.

 

[SPU]

Thank you Deadshot. A very complete answer that was concise. I now know what I need to purchase for the .357 ammo I'm going to start to load. When I get to bottlenecked rifle cases I will be revisiting what parts of the case need lubing (NOT the shoulder). Thnaks for not making me feel like an idiot.

I bought a used set of RCBS .357 magnum non-carbide dies thinking it was a carbide set. It appears if I replace the sizing die with a carbide die my life will be made simpler. I now know for my aplications I don;t need the expense of carbide bottleneck rifle dies -- thanks for that.

Thanks again.

 

[PaulZ]

https://factorysales.com/ Can't beat it!

 

[vwtech103]

I've been using RCBS for 30 plus years & tried others. My vote is RCBS, spend the money, you won't be sorry.

 

[ripcity]

My first choice would be redding, but they are spendy. I usually go with rcbs and they work fine for me. Once I got a set of carbide lyman dies for my .44 mag; they weren't centered or something because it would shave a little bit of my case off the one side and not touch the other side of the case. Needless to say I returned them spent the extra few bucks and bought the rcbs dies.

 

[mjbskwim]

I've been using RCBS for 30 plus years & tried others. My vote is RCBS, spend the money, you won't be sorry.

Yeah and they made stuff right back then. I my short time of reloading I have seen a lot of inconsistencies in RCBS and won't buy much from them
I will however buy Redding dies.

 

[Mikej]

Yeah and they made stuff right back then. I my short time of reloading I have seen a lot of inconsistencies in RCBS and won't buy much from them
I will however buy Redding dies.

I'd like to know specificly what inconsistencies you've found in your dies, if you don't mind.

So far I've reloaded about 300 each 9mm, .38sp and .45acp with three different brand dies. I don't really notice and difference except for the 9mm takes a lot more energy to de-prime/size than the others, that is the one new set of dies from Lee.

Seems like getting FREE bullets, when I sit down to do the final prime/charge/seat!

Smj

 

[mjbskwim]

I was doing both 270 and 223. The 223 wasn't seating without scratching the bullets
Just a minute here,yeah here we go
http://www.northwestfirearms.com/ammunition-reloading/70872-how-many-round-will-bullet-seater-seat-if-bullet-seater.html

So basically the sizing pins were 3 different diameters and weren't opening the necks enough to let the bullet in without squishing it some.The primer rod that goes into the press broke off,the top of the die has that cheezy little blade screwdriver adjustment that breaks off
Maybe not that big of a deal as the pins are cheap,but lots of other manufacturers to choose equipment from and the Redding has the thumb screw adjustments.

And like I've said before,many long time reloaders have used RCBS for years.Maybe they know how to overcome the inadequacies or maybe they have older equipment that was built better

 

[deadshot2]

When I get to bottlenecked rifle cases I will be revisiting what parts of the case need lubing (NOT the shoulder).

When you buy your rifle dies, check the sizing die. Remove the lock nut and examine the threaded area where the shoulder of the case would be when fully inserted in the die. Many manufacturers, Lee especially, are now drilling a hole in this area about 1/16" or so. It allows any excess lube to escape thus reducing the tendency of "lube dents" forming in the case. It also breaks the vacuum that may form around the case making it difficult to extract the sized case. Remember, lube not only makes for slippery cases, it also forms a good "seal".

When you do get to rifle reloading, avoid the spray lubes. Look to Imperial Sizing Wax or Hornady's Unique Case Lube. Works better than the sprays as it's easier to control the amount of lube needed. Problem with sprays is you either get too little and end up with a stuck case or two or too much that gives you a messy work area and lube dents. Just a thin film is all you need, and I mean thin. Just a side note, the Hornady lube is also good for waterproofing leather shoes and boots. Says so right on the container

 

[Mikej]

Sheesh....With your issues makes me glad I'm doing only handgun! I did have the slightest issue setting up the crimp die on the .38 special, folded cases on a couple or three. Only took less that a 1/4 turn to get perfect.

Mike

 

[orygun]

I have several sets of Lee carbide pistol dies. Never had a single problem with one of them. I originally bought them cuz they were less expensive that the other brands on the dealers shelves. Call it cheap if you want, but I found out that I got far more than I paid for. I also have Redding and RCBS. And to be fair, I found that the RCBS seating die has better range of adjustment, at least in the 38 Special-357 mag, than the Lee. Also, my RCBS has two seating stems that allow for differently shaped bullets. The Redding die I have is for my 45 ACP and probably sees the most use. They have been perfect every time.

That's for pistol.

For rifle I have RCBS and Hornady. I agree with Spitpatch about the floating collar of the Hornady seating die. I do like that, but one of my Hornady sizing dies didn't size the brass correctly until I removed material off of the bottom so I could ram the brass further into the die. It's the only die of any kind that I've ever had trouble with.

 

[mjbskwim]

I see wholesale has lyman pistol caliber dies now,what about those? (carbide)

 

[Greenbug]

I see wholesale has lyman pistol caliber dies now,what about those? (carbide)

I have used the Lyman pistol dies from Wholesale. They are every bit as good as RCBS + they come with a free shellhohlder!

 

[orygun]

I have used the Lyman pistol dies from Wholesale. They are every bit as good as RCBS + they come with a free shellhohlder!

That's another plus for the Lee's. They come with the proper shell holder. If you're using a progressive press, that means nothing, though.

 

[deadshot2]

That's another plus for the Lee's. They come with the proper shell holder. If you're using a progressive press, that means nothing, though.

It does mean that when you start buying dies for any cartridge based on the 30-06 base dimensions you end up with a lot of "spare" shell holders.

 

[orygun]

It does mean that when you start buying dies for any cartridge based on the 30-06 base dimensions you end up with a lot of "spare" shell holders.

True, but more is better than none.

 

[MarkAd]

I like my Lee 40 and 45 dies. I just started loading 38 SPL today and am not sure about the 38/357. It may the brass.
Love the Lee FCD. In fact I had a "bluehead" tell me this morning he prefers the LEE FCD over all others.

I use RCBS locks rings that I got on sale at Midway. If i recall the 15 pack was about 25 bucks. Totally superior to Lee's lock rings. When I get my dies set they don't get moved. Of course i will need a new set for 357Mag.

 

[Mikej]

What is it about the Lee .38/.357 you're not sure about?

As I said above, the Hornady .38 seater die took a bit of tweeking to get perfect for me, a beginer to boot. I used a magnifying glass to match the crimp on factory ammo.

Mike

 

[deadshot2]

I just started loading 38 SPL today and am not sure about the 38/357.

What is it about the Lee .38/.357 you're not sure about?

As I said above, the Hornady .38 seater die took a bit of tweeking to get perfect for me, a beginer to boot. I used a magnifying glass to match the crimp on factory ammo.

Mike

As I read, he may not have loaded any .357 yet using the .38/.357 die. Lee supplies a spacer ring that you just add for the longer cartridge. Some say you don't even need to readjust the die locknut but that's never been my experience.

As for crimping, I'm a major fan of the Lee Factory Crimp die. Yes, it does add another step but the results are often worth it. It makes the process a lot more simple and the cost is minimal.

An added note, most people don't trim pistol cases but in the case of the .38 and .357, the uniformity of the crimp from round to round will depend on a uniform case length. Trimming is a good idea if you are fussy about the finished crimp.