DGU - How many?

[RicInOR]

http://reason.com/blog/2015/03/09/how-to-count-the-defensive-use-of-guns

Defensive Gun Use - how many? Have you heard 2 millions times a year, I had.
Where does that number come from? Is it accurate?

This article looks at those numbers.

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[Koda]

Defensive Gun Use - how many? Have you heard 2 millions times a year, I had.
Where does that number come from? Is it accurate?

Gary Klecks survey listed 2.5 million DGUs per year, extrapolated from a survey of 5000 households. I would love that to be true but some argue this is too high

the National Crime Victimization Survey shows fewer than 1600 reliable defensive gun uses per year. While I might be biased I highly doubt this to be true at all.
(source)

So the million dollar question is which study is *most* accurate?

here is an website with an interactive google map listing lawful DGUs in N America.
http://gunssavelives.net/incident-map/

 

[meener777]

Look for the cdc report from 2013 for something most folks will find credible. It says:

"Defensive uses of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence, although the exact number remains disputed. Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million per year, in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008."

 

[boogerhook]

Look for the cdc report from 2013 for something most folks will find credible. It says:

"Defensive uses of guns by crime victims is a common occurrence, although the exact number remains disputed. Almost all national survey estimates indicate that defensive gun uses by victims are at least as common as offensive uses by criminals, with estimates of annual uses ranging from about 500,000 to more than 3 million per year, in the context of about 300,000 violent crimes involving firearms in 2008."

The problem is that many DGUs do not get reported and don't make the stats. Sometimes it's because the gun owner fears brandishing charges - real or imagined - sometimes he just doesn't bother, and sometimes it does not make it into the police report in a way that could be counted. My neighbor, just 6 months ago, scared a would be burglar/robber out of her own bedroom using a gun. The incident was publicized by our PD, but the report never mentioned the DGU. Sometimes a gun use is just showing your holstered weapon to a would be mugger, and he will take off. People should report it for the stats, but many don't.

 

[chemist]

What he said.

Look at Kleck's site, where he deconstructs a lot of counterarguments like the NCVS survey, and the so-called "counterarguments" (really just denials) disputing the 2-million-per-year number.

The fact is, a well-constructed national survey can and will give totally reliable results to a 95% confidence limit even if only a few thousand individuals are involved. It's all about the sampling - and the Central Limit Theorem.

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdguse.html

 

[boogerhook]

What he said.

Look at Kleck's site, where he deconstructs a lot of counterarguments like the NCVS survey, and the so-called "counterarguments" (really just denials) disputing the 2-million-per-year number.

The fact is, a well-constructed national survey can and will give totally reliable results to a 95% confidence limit even if only a few thousand individuals are involved. It's all about the sampling - and the Central Limit Theorem.

http://www.guncite.com/gun_control_gcdguse.html

Thanks for the link. Yes the 100,000 low ball is ridiculous. Guns are presented (holstered or drawn) many more times than shots are fired. The DGU war is only on because anti-gunners want to prove that the harm done to society by guns is larger than the benefits guns provide. It's an abolishment tactic.

 

[meener777]

It is an important part of the discussion. The narrative in the media is one of negative consequences. If people aren't familiar with firearms, see no need or desire to own them themselves, and aren't familiar with DGU incident rates then they will easily reach the logical conclusion that the cost isn't justified. However, when they think about the cost/benefit of automotives they have a personal frame of reference for the utility of the object in question and regardless of the fact that cars are way more dangerous than guns they accept them as worth the risk. So the DGU question is critical to opening minds to the utility of armed law abiding citizens.

 

[Koda]

So the DGU question is critical to opening minds to the utility of armed law abiding citizens.

Absolutely 100%

 

[bakersman345]

Even the lowest estimate for a dgu is 10x higher then the murder rate with firearms so they can cram it.

 

[NoFlinch]

Remember my post about the incident last summer?

I reported it to the police, to cover my butt and to inform them....

No report was ever generated.

That's 1 unreported, in one little town in America.
I bet there are a few more out there................

 

[1Asterisk]

http://reason.com/blog/2015/03/09/how-to-count-the-defensive-use-of-guns

Defensive Gun Use - how many? Have you heard 2 millions times a year, I had.
Where does that number come from? Is it accurate?

This article looks at those numbers.

Consider this: "There are three kinds of lies: Lies, Damn Lies, and Statistics." ~ Unknown

Or this: "Facts are stubborn things, but statistics are more pliable." ~ Laurence Peter

Or this: "There are two kinds of statistics, the kind you look up, and the kind you make up." ~ Rex Stout

Ok, Ok. I'll stop

 

[NoFlinch]

Or this one;

"People who quote quotes shouldn't quote others quotes, but should originate their own quotable quotes."~NoFlinch

 

[etrain16]

Or this one;

"People who quote quotes shouldn't quote others quotes, but should originate their own quotable quotes."~NoFlinch

"Don't believe everything you read on the internet." ~ Abraham Lincoln

 

[1Asterisk]

Or this one;

"People who quote quotes shouldn't quote others quotes, but should originate their own quotable quotes."~NoFlinch

OK to quote you on that?