Detailed explanation of why the 45 ACP sucks in a self-defense pistol

[wired]

My days off needing 500 hp on the street and high insurance cost to sit in traffic are many years behind me. Been there done that.

Sorry to hear that. Your'e missing out on the apex of automotive engineering. Fuel injection and precise ignition control, cooling etc have made high HP cars completely streetable. I can drive all day in 100+ degree bumper to bumper traffic all day with no overheating or anything weird happening and still set off every alarm in the grocery store parking lot on my way to the race track and back home again. High insurance costs for a ~50 year year old car? I dont think so.

As far as the 45 ACP this whole conversation is ridiculous. Sure the 9mm has gotten better. It needed to. Good round for shooting stray dogs and such but for serious business if you NEED 14 rounds of 45 ACP in a gun fight your'e doing something wrong. I carry a 9mm if I'm walking my dog in a rural area to fend off troublemaker dogs . If I'm walking downtown Yakima or God forbid going into a Yakima minit mart I'm carrying a 1911.

 

[MrMillspecer]

My 66 wagon pushing over 500hp. Would drive from Lewiston to Spokane and it towed a roadster that ran 9s. The Wagon has ran in the high 11s. Uncap the headers and put on the wrinkle walls and have fun. 454 Built but with carburetor. Sold it a few years ago. The 57 in the background has a 327 with low gears and a Muncie. My driver as a teenager.

Now I play in the woods in my Jeep. Life choices.

 

[H2O MAN]

I'll stick with the .45 Auto

 

[wired]

My 66 wagon pushing over 500hp. Would drive from Lewiston to Spokane and it towed a roadster that ran 9s. The Wagon has ran in the high 11s. Uncap the headers and put on the wrinkle walls and have fun. 454 Built but with carburetor. Sold it a few years ago. The 57 in the background has a 327 with low gears and a Muncie. My driver as a teenager.

Now I play in the woods in my Jeep. Life choices.

View attachment 377956
View attachment 377958

Getting it ready for paint in October...

 

[coop44]

I acquired an '06 gto in early '07, loved it. A mere 400 hp ls2 was enough to propel it to a hundred mph on a freeway onramp. Didn't even feel like I was going fast, until I noticed how slow everyone else was going and looked down at the speedometer and had an " oh crap" moment. Wasn't like the old days when a muscle car would let you know how close to death you were. Fastest I ever had that goat was 140, about what the tires were rated for, wasn't even breathing hard.

Between insurance and payments, it was costing 700 a month, it went away in '10, broke my heart.

Sorry totally off topic, but, with.

 

[DunRanull]

I know that there are many diehards who refuse to accept the fact that the 45 ACP cartridge is now obsolete. This is especially true of many 1911 pistol fans.

But people need to face today's facts: the 45 ACP cartridge is over 100 years old, and is clearly now obsolete. We have better alternatives that are now available.

This video below does a good job of explaining many of the reason why you should not choose the 45 ACP as the cartridge for your pistol:

.

The .45acp is not "obsolete" in any sense of the word, friend. Like the older 9mmP it has been reworked and "adjusted" for performance over the years. Some may argue that because it weighs more than the 9mm it is obsolete. However it was the perceived failure of the 9mmP as a one-shot stopper that caused the development of the 10mm S&W and .40 S&W. The more recent improvements in 9mmP performance do ZIP for the 9mmP simply because the USA chooses to abide by the 1907 Laws of War agreements regarding expanding bullets.
Any improvements in the 9mmP are mirrored in similar improvements in the .40 and .45acp. The 9 is "better" only in that one can carry more 9mm ammo for the same weight (and less bulk) as the .45acp.
Certain Spec ops groups who are given a choice prefer the .45 over the 9, this has been public knowledge for some years. If not for wimmin and panty-waist guys the 9 would have never been considered, in spite of NATO standardisation. Just sayin, YMMV. Personally I don't want to be hit COM by either one...

 

[Crohnos01]

If we're talking about having an effective round that'll stop a threat MUCH more quickly then we're going to have to talk about rifle rounds.

Ok, this reminds me of one of my favorite old spagetti westerns.... I wouldn't normally go here because it's all movie make believe and a 45 colt instead of the 45 acp, but hell, this thread ran off I to the weeds with car terminology so I think I am still coloring inside the lines relatively speaking

 

[tac]

Well heck, I don't have a Colt .45 any more, but I DO gots this...



tac

 

[Crohnos01]

So when a man with a pistol meets a man with a Porche? I don't know dude.. it just doesn't roll off the tongue quite the same.... Besides.... the Colt is faster

 

[2Z4]

In ideal circumstances, premium 9MM ammunition has almost caught premium 45 ACP ammunition. 9MM has the advantages of capacity, cost, and controllability. In real world use, it may have an advantage passing through sheet metal due to higher velocity and smaller frontal area.

I've used the 9 at close distance on small animals. I wasn't impressed with the results - this was premium defensive ammo. I've used the 45 on deer multiple times, again with premium defensive ammo. The results were better than the 9 on much larger targets. I've seen gunshot wounds with many different calibers. I prefer the heaviest bullet moving as fast as I can get it.

If someone has a hard time with the .45, 9 is probably better for them. It's important to get a decent hit, first. I just haven't seen the evidence that all other things being equal (shooter, capacity, cost, hit) the 9MM is "better" than the 45. I have seen evidence that all things being equal, the 45 is a more effective handgun round than the 9MM. Just as the .308 is more effective that 5.56, but I've seen people killed by both.

 

[Certaindeaf]

.9MM has the advantages of capacity, cost, and controllability..

Don't forget about range. Curvature of the earth? I laugh at youz. lolz

 

[Certaindeaf]

In ideal circumstances, premium 9MM ammunition has almost caught premium 45 ACP ammunition. 9MM has the advantages of capacity, cost, and controllability. In real world use, it may have an advantage passing through sheet metal due to higher velocity and smaller frontal area.

I've used the 9 at close distance on small animals. I wasn't impressed with the results - this was premium defensive ammo. I've used the 45 on deer multiple times, again with premium defensive ammo. The results were better than the 9 on much larger targets. I've seen gunshot wounds with many different calibers. I prefer the heaviest bullet moving as fast as I can get it.

If someone has a hard time with the .45, 9 is probably better for them. It's important to get a decent hit, first. I just haven't seen the evidence that all other things being equal (shooter, capacity, cost, hit) the 9MM is "better" than the 45. I have seen evidence that all things being equal, the 45 is a more effective handgun round than the 9MM. Just as the .308 is more effective that 5.56, but I've seen people killed by both.

If you want results on small game with the 9mm, use a semi-wadcutter.. like the Lee 140 or 105gr or the Lyman 133gr..








Deer or pigs? Those work.. as do even old school (forty year old offerings) standard pressure hollow points.. let alone more modern ammo in the +p or +p+ category. If you handload, that's called a grain or so a powder extra.
bang flop

 

[wichaka]

I'm not one to tout one caliber over another. If someone took my 45 and gave me a 9 with a well constructed HP, you wouldn't see me crying.

His facts about hole size, length of case, diameter, not penetrating hard barriers, bone etc., shows his ignorance. How many autopsies has he attended...how many actual shootings has he investigated...ugh!

Unfortunately, there's way too many people on the net like this.

Rough figures...
9mm - .355"
40 cal - .400"
45 ACP - .450"

.095" diff 9 vs 45
.050" diff 40 vs 45

 

[User 1234]

View attachment 376909
The heck with it...
I'm just gonna stick with my spear...
( Yep pun intended ! )
Andy

Andy, what is the story behind that spear?

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Andy, what is the story behind that spear?

It was my first issued weapon when I joined the Army....

Actually I am a huge history nerd and just wanted a common weapon that would fit in many time periods.
The spear head and butt cap are from Windlass and are some sort of carbon steel...it does take and hold an edge well at any rate.
I aged the steel with a mix of cold blue and browning.

The shaft is Ash and stained with nitric acid.

Overall its about 76 inches long with a 16 inch spearhead and a 10 inch bladed section.
Andy

 

[User 1234]

That is a nice piece of weaponry. I thought it might be an artifact.

 

[Andy54Hawken]

That is a nice piece of weaponry. I thought it might be an artifact.

Thanks..that was the effect I was going for with my finish.
The spear feels surprisingly good and handles nicely....if you have any experience with military bayonet drills , the spear just seems to respond well those movements...
Andy

 

[User 1234]

I am actually old enough that we still learned bayonet fighting in basic (1996).

 

[Boboclown]

That's nothing. I learned how to use a spear in high school.

 

[User 1234]

That's nothing. I learned how to use a spear in high school.

The women loved the clown makeup?