Dangers using cast load data for plated or fmj rifle bullet reduced loads.

[umrek]

It is not so much an issue of a minimum charge weight, rather it is a matter of volume, the reason that some pistol / shotgun powders such as Red Dot, 2400 and some others are more suitable for using in cartridges for reduced loads is the amount of space they occupy in the case due to their bulky nature.

Even then some powders such as 2400 which have been old standards for decades in cast bullet circles have been removed from the data of many cartridges in the latest Lyman cast bullet handbook not because they are unsafe but because in our current litigious day and age , there is too much room and the potential exists for an overcharge .

To put it more simply Lyman is attempting to protect themselves from a liability suit.

Unfortunately Lee did the same thing between revisions.

 

[Dr Prepper]

"To me the physics of it would indicate that a jacketed bullet is harder to push down a barrel than cast / plated so pressure curves are going to be different, possibly significantly."

That was my main concern. I am guessing the difference in friction may not be that great.

Does anyone molycoat cast bullets? Seems like a no brainer to me. Works so well it lowers velocity too!

Glad i stumbled upon this thread been finding primers as well as casting molds and supplies in my cart alot recently.
Was bummed to find out they use completely different powders. Ignorance is bliss until the world has other plans. Looks like im back in the powder market for cast powders..

 

[arakboss]

Does anyone molycoat cast bullets? Seems like a no brainer to me. Works so well it lowers velocity too!

Glad i stumbled upon this thread been finding primers as well as casting molds and supplies in my cart alot recently.
Was bummed to find out they use completely different powders. Ignorance is bliss until the world has other plans. Looks like im back in the powder market for cast powders..

I found an 8 pounder of IMR4227 online, it seems to be pretty widely available compared to many other powders. Lymans cast bullet handbook has loads using IMR 4227 in nearly ever cartridge I load for. I am interested in the moly idea but I have heard it requires extensive cleaning between using it and non-moly coated projectiles. That never made much sense to me, maybe I need to look into it again.

 

[Dr Prepper]

Down load a burn chart if you have questions about powder comparisons and be very careful with any powder you can get a, "double charge" into a case, like BullsEye, etc.

Burn rate charts can vary widely depending on who they are from. They even vary from reputable resources like manuels. And then of course all the manuels disclaim powder burn rates are general guide and vary from lot to lot.
So keep that in mind. But im sure im prechin' to the choir.

 

[Dr Prepper]

I found an 8 pounder of IMR4227 online, it seems to be pretty widely available compared to many other powders. Lymans cast bullet handbook has loads using IMR 4227 in nearly ever cartridge I load for. I am interested in the moly idea but I have heard it requires extensive cleaning between using it and non-moly coated projectiles. That never made much sense to me, maybe I need to look into it again.

Yeah, ive seen midsouth CONSISTANTLY has 4227 EVERY single time i order from there for like the past two months it seems.
Its so obvious its been making me wonder what the heck it was used for.. Begining to think it was garbage powder lol.

I beleive the one main drawback people say about moly is it is a microscopic metal so it can draw in moisture where its present and some say cause rusting. I kinda think thats bs. But idk im no rocnet surgeon. Id think if you cleaned somewhat and oil it like i always do and remove oil before shooting it wouldnt matter. Also wonder if it would even matter in something like a chrome lined barrel.

Yeah, ive been buying all this casting gear lately and dont even have a manual yet. Lol. I got into because of shotgun reloading and casting buckshot and slugs etc out of cheap wally world loads. (And did buy that manual.) But not for straight up casting yet.
Just recently got a .45, 9mm, and 40 cal. Moulds. I need to find some decent ones with gas checks. I want to see how fast i can push the .45's
Just shot my rowland for the first time friday - it was a gas! 1400fps with longshot and 230gn seeds from a 9" glock. Lol. I think my mold is 200gn round balls.

Also recently got .312" 160gr. For all my 30 cal stuff. Pretty sure that is gas checked. Got a sizer for .309" as well so should cover pretty much everything except maybe 30-30.

 

[Dr Prepper]

Unfortunately Lee did the same thing between revisions.

Sucks.. I wish someone would digitize old laoding manuels for upload.

 

[arakboss]

Yeah, ive seen midsouth CONSISTANTLY has 4227 EVERY single time i order from there for like the past two months it seems.
Its so obvious its been making me wonder what the heck it was used for.. Begining to think it was garbage powder lol.

I beleive the one main drawback people say about moly is it is a microscopic metal so it can draw in moisture where its present and some say cause rusting. I kinda think thats bs. But idk im no rocnet surgeon. Id think if you cleaned somewhat and oil it like i always do and remove oil before shooting it wouldnt matter. Also wonder if it would even matter in something like a chrome lined barrel.

Yeah, ive been buying all this casting gear lately and dont even have a manual yet. Lol. I got into because of shotgun reloading and casting buckshot and slugs etc out of cheap wally world loads. (And did buy that manual.) But not for straight up casting yet.
Just recently got a .45, 9mm, and 40 cal. Moulds. I need to find some decent ones with gas checks. I want to see how fast i can push the .45's
Just shot my rowland for the first time friday - it was a gas! 1400fps with longshot and 230gn seeds from a 9" glock. Lol. I think my mold is 200gn round balls.

Also recently got .312" 160gr. For all my 30 cal stuff. Pretty sure that is gas checked. Got a sizer for .309" as well so should cover pretty much everything except maybe 30-30.

Which sizer dies are you using? If lee brand are you using the old style or the new style?

 

[Dr Prepper]

Which sizer dies are you using? If lee brand are you using the old style or the new style?

Lee, i assume the new ones as its still in the mail! i didnt know they had revised them, but then again I'm still wet behind the ears in the casting game.
I have shot a few of my own .441" rb with patches, But thats all. (Want to get back into that but priorites..)

 

[arakboss]

Lee, i assume the new ones as its still in the mail! i didnt know they had revised them, but then again I'm still wet behind the ears in the casting game.
I have shot a few of my own .441" rb with patches, But thats all. (Want to get back into that but priorites..)

The originals look like these and can be used in any standard press.

Lee Precision, Inc.. Bullet Sizing Kit

Lube and Sizing Kit

leeprecision.com

The newer sizers look like this and are for Lee breech lock presses.

First you buy this doohickey:

Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit

Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit by Lee Midsouth now carries the Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit. The Lee Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit sizes cast bullets and also seats and crimps gas checks. The Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit is to be used in conjunction with the Bullet Sizer & Punch for your...

www.midsouthshooterssupply.com

Then you buy one of these for each size projectile you want to size. Saves space and money over the old sizers.

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/search?SearchTerm=lee+sizer+bushings

 

[arakboss]

The originals look lie these and can be used in any standard press.

Lee Precision, Inc.. Bullet Sizing Kit

Lube and Sizing Kit

leeprecision.com

The newer sizers look like this and are for Lee breech lock presses.

First you buy this doohickey:

Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit

Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit by Lee Midsouth now carries the Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit. The Lee Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit sizes cast bullets and also seats and crimps gas checks. The Breech Lock Bullet Sizer Kit is to be used in conjunction with the Bullet Sizer & Punch for your...

www.midsouthshooterssupply.com

Then you buy one of these for each size projectile you want to size. Saves space and money over the old sizers.

https://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/search?SearchTerm=lee+sizer+bushings

I believe if you buy this you could use the newer lee breech lock sizer system in a conventional press:

Lee Breech Lock Bushing Press Conversion Update Kit 1-1/2-12 Thread

The Lee Breech Lock Update Kit will convert your green or red press to allow use of Lee's Breech Lock quick-change bushing feature. Kit...

www.midwayusa.com

Here is one review on this adapter:

"My only complaint is that it's aluminum and not steel. I got it for my RCBS rock chucker so I can size bullets with the new Lee sizing bushings and it's holding up well after sizing some seriously oversized bullets cast with hard alloy."

 

[whiskeybill]

I found an 8 pounder of IMR4227 online, it seems to be pretty widely available compared to many other powders. Lymans cast bullet handbook has loads using IMR 4227 in nearly ever cartridge I load for. I am interested in the moly idea but I have heard it requires extensive cleaning between using it and non-moly coated projectiles. That never made much sense to me, maybe I need to look into it again.

I have used Moly bullets and they are much easier to clean up than traditional cast and lubed bullets if you have a leading issue in a revolver throat. It is WAY easier to clean up than copper fouling. Hoppes' #9 and a few passes with a bronze brush and patch, you're finished.

 

[Dr Prepper]

I have used Moly bullets and they are much easier to clean up than traditional cast and lubed bullets if you have a leading issue in a revolver throat. It is WAY easier to clean up than copper fouling. Hoppes' #9 and a few passes with a bronze brush and patch, you're finished.

Yeah moly truly is magical fairy dust, Truly amazing.
Huh thats good info about the sizer arak, but unfortunately i had to be unique and have a forster with the yoke handle that goes over the die. Im planning on testing out some kinda soon. I cant fit any container up top. Im planning on buying a clear flex hose and 'piping' it onto the bench top for a bucket or something. So the old ones that i have I'm thinking will be easier to cram a hose ontop of. I hope.. Appreciate the info and all the links I had no idea.