CHL question

[M.Link]

Just got my CHL in the mail yesterday and now I have a question. Now that I have it can I carry a knife concealed that I use to not be able to? Like my Gerber boot knife? I know I can carry my Auto concealed now.

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[Chee-to]

Just got my CHL in the mail yesterday and now I have a question. Now that I have it can I carry a knife concealed that I use to not be able to? Like my Gerber boot knife? I know I can carry my Auto concealed now.

NO, CHL = concealed handgun license...........

 

[jordanka16]

166.240 Carrying of concealed weapons. (1) Except as provided in subsection (2) of this section, any person who carries concealed upon the person any knife having a blade that projects or swings into position by force of a spring or by centrifugal force, any dirk, dagger, ice pick, slungshot, metal knuckles, or any similar instrument by the use of which injury could be inflicted upon the person or property of any other person, commits a Class B misdemeanor.

(2) Nothing in subsection (1) of this section applies to any peace officer as defined in ORS 133.005, whose duty it is to serve process or make arrests. Justice courts have concurrent jurisdiction to try any person charged with violating any of the provisions of subsection (1) of this section. [Amended by 1977 c.454 §1; 1985 c.543 §2; 1989 c.839 §21; 1999 c.1040 §15]

https://www.oregonlegislature.gov/bills_laws/ors/ors166.html

 

[matt_w]

Suprised they didn't cover this along with the other basic laws in your CHL class. :huh:

 

[MarkSBG]

They should have. Cheeto is right, the license says nothing about knives. Or ninja stars for that matter.

 

[M.Link]

The class I took wasn't nessessarly for a CHL. It was the NRA basic handgun class. Thanks.

 

[Partsproduction]

No law against a magic prognosticator though.

A magic prognosticator is a bicycle handlebar handle with a 12" long 1/16" 9X19 aircraft cable attached to lead weight about 1" in diameter.

To use it you spread any paper with print on it and close your eyes and let it stop swaying, then look and see what letter it has stopped over. It's slow but eventually, by throwing out everything that doesn't make sense you can determine the future.
Of course it has religious significance as well, and it's in no way a weapon, and since it's part of your religious heritage you can carry it.

And also of course, if someone attacked you and you swung it just right you might be able to determine the future for him.

 

[MarkSBG]

 

[matt_w]

Or you could just shoot them in the face the old fashioned way

 

[M.Link]

SOOO, how do you go about getting a CWP, Concealed WEAPON Permit? That would cover it all, wouldn't it?

 

[skud_dusty]

SOOO, how do you go about getting a CWP, Concealed WEAPON Permit? That would cover it all, wouldn't it?

You can't get one in Oregon as they are not issued. I'm not a lawyer, but the last time I looked into it you cannot, unless you're active mil/leo, carry any sort of fixed blade or automatic knife concealed. The way the law reads, they seem to have covered their bases well and you're better off carrying a folder to make sure you're within the legal scope of the law.

Your CHL allows you to carry a handgun. The last time I looked, a handgun was a much better fight stopper than a knife

 

[Karma]

Yeah, that is how I understand it too. I think it is absolutely ridiculous that we aren't allowed to carry a concealed pocketknife when we can carry a gun concealed.

 

[el gringo loco]

You can't get one in Oregon as they are not issued. I'm not a lawyer, but the last time I looked into it you cannot, unless you're active mil/leo, carry any sort of fixed blade or automatic knife concealed. The way the law reads, they seem to have covered their bases well and you're better off carrying a folder to make sure you're within the legal scope of the law.

Close, but not quite.

You cannot have, concealed on your person, the following:

any knife having a blade that projects or swings into position by force of a spring or by centrifugal force, any dirk, dagger, ice pick, slungshot, metal knuckles, or any similar instrument

You can have a fixed blade, of any length, concealed on your person as long as it is single edged (ie. not a dirk or dagger which are defined as double edged blades). "Centrifugal force", for all practical purposes, just refers to butterfly knives.

 

[clearconscience]

So what about assisted open knives? I have carried one for about a year, it was given to me as a present by a LEO friend of mine.

I always thought it was stupid that I can carry a gun, but not a stun gun, asp, double edge knife, etc.

Also a reminder as I did not remember
For Washington CHLs
$55.25 for new
$42.00 for renewal after 60 days
and only $32.00 if renewed before it expires.

Don't wait!!!!

 

[Malibu38368]

You can carry a concealed pocketknife. Unless I'm horribly out of date and pocketknives no longer have folding blades?

You can have a fixed blade, of any length, concealed on your person as long as it is single edged (ie. not a dirk or dagger which are defined as double edged blades). "Centrifugal force", for all practical purposes, just refers to butterfly knives.

I wouldn't rely on that "definition" of dirk and/or dagger to defend yourself in a court. Historically, early daggers and their European predecessors (the seax and similar instruments) had single-edged blades in a pronounced triangular section. Some forms of dagger (the rondel/roundel and misericorde come to mind here) never developed an edge and were intended as thrusting weapons only. The idea that daggers had two edges and knives one is a gross oversimplification applied by people who haven't really bothered to study medieval arms in any detail. But more to the point, the ORS doesn't bother to give a legal definition of those terms, and as a result, even if a dagger did have two edges, the "similar instrument" referenced in ORS 166.240 could be taken to include "fixed blade knives", or swords for that matter.

 

[skud_dusty]

You can have a fixed blade, of any length, concealed on your person as long as it is single edged (ie. not a dirk or dagger which are defined as double edged blades). "Centrifugal force", for all practical purposes, just refers to butterfly knives.

So by spring assisted they cover most automatic knives correct?

And I'm going with Malibu38368 on the rest of it. They left the law pretty open to interpretation and I'm not going to chance getting the right cop and the right judge to see things my way. I'll continue carrying my small folder and Glock 26. I think that should about cover me

 

[matt_w]

Spring assisted is ok to carry concealed.

 

[skud_dusty]

Spring assisted is ok to carry concealed.

I think they cover spring assisted...

Oregon Public Order Offense 166.240 Carrying of concealed weapons. (1) Except as provided in subsection (2) of this section, any person who carries concealed upon the person any knife having a blade that projects or swings into position by force of a spring or by centrifugal force, any dirk, dagger, ice pick, slungshot, metal knuckles, or any similar instrument by the use of which injury could be inflicted upon the person or property of any other person, commits a Class B misdemeanor.

From http://www.knife-expert.com/or.txt

 

[matt_w]

That is referring to switch-blade type knives, where you apply no force to help the knife get into place. Spring assist uses a spring + the force of your finger to open. I believe this is why almost all knives are marketed as "spring assist" now. I could be wrong, but I've never seen any evidence to the contrary.

I agree with your previous post that the law is very open ended and could be abused by law enforcement. By that text, it's also illegal for me to carry a screwdriver concealed because it is ice-pick like and could be used to cause injury. I served on a grand jury for awhile, and there were quite a few "menacing" charges filed because someone showed a screwdriver.

 

[el gringo loco]

You can carry a concealed pocketknife. Unless I'm horribly out of date and pocketknives no longer have folding blades?


I wouldn't rely on that "definition" of dirk and/or dagger to defend yourself in a court. Historically, early daggers and their European predecessors (the seax and similar instruments) had single-edged blades in a pronounced triangular section. Some forms of dagger (the rondel/roundel and misericorde come to mind here) never developed an edge and were intended as thrusting weapons only. The idea that daggers had two edges and knives one is a gross oversimplification applied by people who haven't really bothered to study medieval arms in any detail. But more to the point, the ORS doesn't bother to give a legal definition of those terms, and as a result, even if a dagger did have two edges, the "similar instrument" referenced in ORS 166.240 could be taken to include "fixed blade knives", or swords for that matter.

See STATE v. McJunkins

This case defines dirk and dagger rather specifically as instruments designed to stab. A large hunting knife with a single edge does not meet this requirement. [Although, a T-handled single edged knife might?]

Looking for a link to this case, I also found State v. Ruff, which I was previouslyunfamiliar with (recent case), that did allow for a sword, although single edged, to be considered specifically designed for stabbing and, thus, a dirk or dagger.

I had a conversation with a Multnomah County DA about this subject several years ago. My understanding when I walked away from the conversation was that in order to be specifically designed for stabbing (and, thus, a dirk or dagger), a knife pretty much had to be double edged. As I noted above, a t-handle knife might meet that requirement with a single-edge (at least I think a good case could be made for it).