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CHL denial, Multnomah County

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by duldej, Dec 8, 2012.

  1. duldej

    duldej Portland Member

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    I hope you do not mind a brief testimonial in this Legal/Political forum, but I just applied for a CHL in Multnomah County, and was denied. Furthermore, a Lieutenant at the Multnomah County Sheriff's Office, CHL unit revoked my CHL license, notifying me of both the denial and the revocation in the same letter.

    He cited a misdemeanor conviction that I had in California in 2010, which was expunged May 2012.

    I don't think this Lieutenant knew about the expungement, so I sent him a copy of the Dismissal Order in the mail.

    I was arrested for other things, in the past, but have no convictions from any state, at any time, and essentially have a clean record.

    This Lieutenant cited my arrests that turned-up, claiming that due to both the (expunged) conviction, and the arrests that I would be ineligible to be licensed.

    I was hoping to get some input, please, from the NW Firearms community.
     
  2. deen_ad

    deen_ad Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Seems like they determined that you had too many arrests so they pulled your present CHL and denied issuing you a new one.
    Looks fine to me.
     
  3. iusmc2002

    iusmc2002 Colville, WA Active Member

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    If he's had too many arrests, how did he get a CHL in the first place?
     
  4. duldej

    duldej Portland Member

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    There is no legal basis for a denial solely because of arrests, and no convictions. The Lieutenant abused his discretion.
     
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  5. NoAim

    NoAim Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    Here's the legal basis. Your recourse is #5.

    ORS 166.293 - Denial or revocation of license - 2011 Oregon Revised Statutes

     
  6. NoAim

    NoAim Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    ORS 166.291 - Issuance of concealed handgun license - 2011 Oregon Revised Statutes

    It could be a clerical error (misdemeanor came up, but not the expungement), but the sheriff still has the discretion as posted above. You do have an appeals process.

    Additionally, just because it's "expunged" (look up the legal definition) doesn't mean it's destroyed or gone. It just limits access. So for employment, standard background checks it won't show up, but for police and government, it's still there. And you stated you were convicted.

    Personally, I think you're SOL for a few years.
     
  7. accessbob

    accessbob Molalla, OR 2A Supporter

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    Two things if you want to have a chance at succeeding.

    1. Contact an attorney who has experience with these issues.

    2. File the appeal.
     
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  8. duldej

    duldej Portland Member

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    ORS 166.291 (2) states the following:

    A person who has been granted relief under ORS 166.274 or 166.293 or 18 U.S.C. 925(c) or has had the person's record expunged under the laws of this state or equivalent laws of other jurisdictions is not subject to the disabilities in subsection (1)(g) to (k) of this section.

    If you've got a misdemeanor conviction, then due to clause (h), you get denied, so except for the, albeit legal, abuse of discretion that I mentioned above, there is no basis for his denial.
     
  9. duldej

    duldej Portland Member

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    I had hoped I could settle this out of court, but I do plan to do both of those points. Thank You. Can you please recommend an attorney?
     
  10. NoAim

    NoAim Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    Ah, I missed that. Good catch. It may be worth it just to talk to the guy (if you haven't already). However, going in with the attitude of "he abused his discretionary power" likely be successful.
     
  11. Boomerang

    Boomerang Portland area Active Member

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    This. Make an appointment to talk with the guy who denied you. Don't go in with any type of attitude. Be non-confrontational, but simply ask if he would think about reconsidering based on ORS 166.291 (2) concerning expunged records. Don't demand anything, simply ask. If that doesn't work, then go the attorney / appeals route.
     
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  12. PuddleMonkey

    PuddleMonkey Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    Sure, stop getting arrested.


    znap2v.jpg
     
  13. rur862

    rur862 Seattle Active Member

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    Post Deleted.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2014
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  14. nwdrifter

    nwdrifter troutdale oregon Active Member

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    Just an idea

    i think that's the problem, a Dismissal Order might not mean it was expunged it might mean it was dismissed but still on file then he gets to use the "go back 4 years deal" as stated above.

    I would talk to him like a man face to face with full respect, if that doesnt work file for appeal.
     
  15. duldej

    duldej Portland Member

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    To clarify, the Lieutenant has not written me back yet. The only letter I've received from him has been the initial denial letter.
     
  16. Stomper

    Stomper Oceania Rising White Is The New Brown Silver Supporter

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    Yeah, like it has been said, politely stand-up for yourself, present your case and point out the relevant ORS pertinent to your situation. You haven't mentioned what sort of scrape you had with the system, and it mentions they have "discretion" to deny if they suspect you may be a threat to yourself or the public, which implies a bit of latitude is allowed. If the Lieutenant can see first hand a conscientious, rational person who cares enough to present their case, he may be inclined to reverse his decision.

    Back in the early 90's I caught a guy breaking into my house and I broke his back (literally) for his trouble. Strangely enough I got hauled off for Assault-lV and Menacing a few months later, as the Multnomah County ADA was a bleeding heart A-hole, but my lawyer got the judge to dismiss the case.

    Consequently, I never lost my CHL then, nor have I ever been subsequently denied one since.
     
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  17. WhyteCheddar

    WhyteCheddar East of Moscow by the Willamette Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't the type of crime, even if its expunged make a difference?
    Domestic violence etc...?

    Or am I way out in right field here?
     
  18. duldej

    duldej Portland Member

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    He mentioned in his letter that I had once been arrested for "assault," which happened in 2007. I had engaged in a shouting match with some security guards in downtown L.A., and happened to be holding my trumpet in my hand. They called for a citizen's arrest, but no charges ever were filed, and the cops that appeared on the scene, the next day told me, when they saw me on the street, that the incident was "bullsh*t."

    Like rur862 said, above, they arrest you for some ridiculous stuff sometimes. Notable, perhaps, is that Los Angeles police use a Zero Tolerance philosophy of policing, which is different than the Community Policing that they use here in Portland, which means you get hauled off to jail for just about anything. 100% of my scrapes with the law happened there.
     
  19. duldej

    duldej Portland Member

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    Good point, but the case was not DV.
     
  20. PuddleMonkey

    PuddleMonkey Vancouver, WA Well-Known Member

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    According to him he's been arrested multiple times, I somehow doubt he's an angel.