Charter Arms in Auto Cartridges?

[CountryGent]

These have stuck me as interesting as no moonclips are required and a wheelgun in .45ACP would be nice. One of the reasons I never took the plunge is, as far as I know, they only have snub length barrels.

Anyway, has anyone ever shot any of these? How well does the cylinder system work with rimless cartridges?

Read More

 

[Andy54Hawken]

Cool thread....I also would like to see 'em come in a 4 - 5 1/2 inch barrel as well.
Andy

 

[CountryGent]

I was thinking a 4" (or thereabouts) barrel model would make a nice outdoors gun. Loaded with .45 ACP JHP. And since it is a Charter, no real concerns with getting beat up or funky.

 

[The Heretic]

They do come in the longer barrels, or did come in longer barrels, you just do not see many of them configured that way - also, for some of the configurations with a round bull barrel, they are kind of ugly IMO.



Others are not too bad:



And some look good:



Personally, I would want one with at least a 2.5-3" barrel The one immediately above is a 3"

 

[CountryGent]

I was on their site earlier. I saw longer barrels for some calibers, but not the .45 ACP one. IIRC, same for the other automatic cartridges (e.g., 9㎜, .40 S&W).

 

[The Heretic]

I was on their site earlier. I saw longer barrels for some calibers, but not the .45 ACP one. IIRC, same for the other automatic cartridges (e.g., 9㎜, .40 S&W).

What they have at any given time may be dependent on what they are making. I have seen some with longer barrels advertised elsewhere, but not on their site.

E.G., here is one with a 5" barrel:

Charter Arms Mod Pit Bull .40 S & W cal 5 shot Revolver w/ 126 mm bbl [ grey stainless finish, rubbe

Charter Arms Mod Pit Bull .40 S & W cal 5 shot Revolver w/ 126 mm bbl [ grey stainless finish, rubbe - Ward's Auctions

www.icollector.com

 

[The Heretic]

Here's a .45 that looks like a 3" barrel:

 

[JKOLL]

I got a 9mm 5 inch Bull Barreled Pitbull from a member here a few months ago. It chambers and ejects better than expected. Not as good as the Korth 9mm's I've shot, but they are a gazilllion dollars. Mine works pretty much all the time and ejects easily until it gets a pretty dirty , but you could say that about almost any revolver. It is surprisingly accurate, shooting groups as good or better than my 4in K-38 combat masterpiece in .38 special. I mainly got it to do flinch training instead of a K-22 and It's nice to be able to shoot a nice accurate revolver without using up my cherished (and much harder to get) .38 SPL supply. I'd buy another short barreled Pug in 9mm or .45 ACP as an alternative/extra backup to the M-60 J frame, If I found one. I did do an action Job on it, you can get reduced rebound springs for the trigger that make it a bit nicer, but the stock trigger isn't bad either. I was pleasantly surprised at the overall experience as I hadn't tried a Charter before that, thinking they were (despite being american made) along the lines of a cheaper, lower end gun. The finish isn't anything like a Smith or Colt, but it runs well, is well designed, and its a "Good Tool".

The loading seems finicky until you get the muscle memory of sort of canting the rounds into the chamber to depress the spring retainer, but it gets as easy and fast as the others with a little practice.

It's worth looking at one in person though as, If you're expecting S&W, Colt or Ruger finish quality, you will be disappointed or at least unimpressed. but you could look at almost any charter and get the general Idea. Cylinder support is a little wobbly, machining marks on the cylinder are evident but it's a good strong revolver that RUNS! The 9mm is in a smaller frame (like the .38's) than the .45 ACP which I think is the same frame as the .44. Still pretty effing small though for the load.

 

[CountryGent]

Thank you @The Heretic and @JKOLL.

 

[JKOLL]

Let Us know what you find and how you like it. I'm especially interested to see if the .45 ACP is as freaking vicious as the .44mag. Which is decidedly uncomfortable for me to shoot. Too uncomfortable to be practically accurate. But OK w.44 SPL. And if it loads and ejects as easily as the 9mm.

 

[The Heretic]

Let Us know what you find and how you like it. I'm especially interested to see if the .45 ACP is as freaking vicious as the .44mag. Which is decidedly uncomfortable for me to shoot. Too uncomfortable to be practically accurate. But OK w.44 SPL. And if it loads and ejects as easily as the 9mm.

I had a CA .44 special Bulldog Pug.

It wasn't bad - I shot Win Silvertip 200 gr in it

I don't think the .45 would be much worse - it is only 100 fps faster in that load.

But then my SIG 227 with 185 gr loads at about the same velocity as the .40 180 gr loads I shoot in my 226, is noticeably more recoil than the .40 loads. I don't know why - there is more going on there than just velocity, energy and bullet mass. The guns are almost identical in size/weight and grips.

There is also the slide mass and the recoil spring differences. Then there is the sectional density and cartridge case size - plus I would guess the powder is different.

To me the recoil is quite different.

 

[deadeye]

I like mine just fine, I haven't changed the grips yet though. Plan to change to barami hip grip to use as a back up to my 45acp carry options instead of the 38 I usually carry in my pocket. Bought it when I saw it at a local shop, never go into a shop when your bored and have a pocket full of cash..........one day I'll learn that.

 

[JKOLL]

Heretic,

Yup!

As you note, In Auto's there are a lot of dynamics that Revolvers lack. Rate of burn matching up with slide movement and lockup etc. that make the feel quite a bit less predictable/intuitive. I can run +P .45 in a Beretta Cougar all day, but in a (heavier) untuned govt 1911 the same thing is pretty darned uncomfortable after a couple mags. Semi-Auto handgun designers/tuners really earn their money. I still think the Cougar 8045 is underappreciated.

I shot a charter in .44 mag. It hurt. I could have just shot .44 SPL, i guess. I think the .45 would be interesting because I already reload .45 ACP (one less caliber to worry about) and if it works as well as the 9mm rimless system on the 9mm Pitbull, without the moons of a Smith .45ACP (just something else to worry about). As countrygent has noticed, It should make a great reasonably priced tool that lives in my preferred caliber selection, and a stainless one could ride easily for years in a car, airplane or boat and still be expected not to grunge-up too badly and should work when needed. This is a premise that is often missed in the evergoing revolver .vs Auto debate. Leave either one rolling around under the seat of a truck, airplane or boat for for a year getting frozen, thawed, a little wet, bounced and bumped and the revolver probably comes out in front as far as which one will most likely go bang when needed.

SO the .45 ACP Charter, I think,
Based on my experience with the Pitbull 9
Not a showpiece, but a good back-up/utility piece. I'm thinking a "Flying Ashtray" 180-200 gr bullet medium load would shoot pretty sweet out of that frame in a 3-4 inch barrel. I considered the .44 mag as an airplane gun in Alaska because everyone up there figured they needed something that would kill a bear...which was probably folly combined with some ego and status appeal. I couldn't see lugging around a $2K Python or Smith as a tool and settled on a stainless carbine instead. The .45 rimless Charter for economical urban CC, country/woods, or backpacking or even a vehicle gun, pretty versatile. That 3" pictured above #7 looks just about perfect!

 

[Lennie]

Let Us know what you find and how you like it. I'm especially interested to see if the .45 ACP is as freaking vicious as the .44mag. Which is decidedly uncomfortable for me to shoot. Too uncomfortable to be practically accurate. But OK w.44 SPL. And if it loads and ejects as easily as the 9mm.

A 45 ACP in my Ruger 4.62" barrel is just a mild recoil plinking round. I enjoy watching experienced 45 ACP semi auto shooters discover the mild recoil of a 45 ACP in a wheel gun. When Browning did the 1911, his goal was to replicate a the 45 Colt round. Standard velocity 45 Colt rounds are also very mild recoil rounds in a wheel gun.

 

[meb]

A friend has one (45 acp), recoil about the same as my 44 bulldog.
Don't shoot steel case ammo, had to use a hammer to get them out.