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Century Arms CETME Sporter problems

Discussion in 'Rifle Discussion' started by mjbskwim, Feb 5, 2012.

  1. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    I bought this gun a while back.I inquired on here about it and got it cheap enough that I figured I could put a little into it and have a decent shooter.
    And it is a decent shooter alright.....for one mag.

    The first time I took it out,I let the bolt down too easy and it wouldn't fire.Automatically thought the worse.
    Then while trying at home I realized what had happened.Needed to let the bolt slam home to close the bolt all the way.

    OK that problem is done.Shoot it yesterday and run through a 20 rounder like butta.Perfect and I'm smiling.

    My friend wants to shoot it and we can't get the bolt open again.This happened before and I couldn't see what was hanging up when I took it apart.It just won't move now.

    What do I need to look at inside?

    Thanks
    Mike
     
  2. mkwerx

    mkwerx Forest Grove, OR Well-Known Member

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    Been a while since I had my HK pattern gun. I only had one incident where the bolt felt "stuck" - it took a LOT of extra effort to get it to open. Never did figure out why it did that. Previous owner said it happened to him once every few thousand rounds. I field stripped the gun - checked the bolt for odd wear (saw none) - made sure the rollers were properly lubed. Never had that issue again. Have you checked the op rod (I'm forgetting the proper term here) to make sure it's not peened or burred and hanging up somehow? If you take the butt stock off - can you get the bolt to unlock then?
     
  3. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Yeah I took it completely apart,except the fore end and clean and cleaned and cleaned again.It wasn't gritty but it was dirty.I've had the bolt apart and it seems to work perfect.
    So now it slides and need to get back up to the woods to shoot
    And I saw nothing on the rod to make it no work.

    Heat problem?
     
  4. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    Did you inspect it for a ground bolt? what is the bolt gap set at? what condition is your locking pc? Is the cocking tube straight ?

    are you able to pull the cocking handle out of the locked position and if you can do you feel the bolt release out of battery and then it binds up ?

    if they put it together with too much gap between the cocking support and the carrier and it does not fully disengage the bolt it will be very difficult to open and the bolt is still locked
    too little gap and the carrier is slamming into the cocking support not good either
    may be just a worn part . The cocking handle using leverage when its pulled open to disengage the bolt making it able to open.

    I think if i remember correctly that not enough bolt gap or ground bolt or worn locking piece can cause this problem as well.
     
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  5. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    is it still locked up or have you forced it open?

    also look for ware on the contact point of the charging handle where it meets the metal part inside the tube that it presses on causing it to push the bolt out of battery

    if either is excessively worn that could be the cause as well.

    Its kind of hard to trouble shoot without it in hand but check what was mentioned to narrow it down.
     
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  6. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    Thanks.
    I can't get the cocking handle out of the gun but I'll look a little closer at that.
    Oh it came apart with that 12# hammer! jk
    The bolt released easily after taking the stock off and the trigger group out.Making me wonder if something in the trigger group would cause this...????
    The bar looks real good and straight,the bolt may have seen better days.

    And where is the best site/store to find a new bolt,other parts to these?

    Thanks again for looking.Gives me more to look at.
     
  7. mkwerx

    mkwerx Forest Grove, OR Well-Known Member

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    I've seen Cetme/HK91 parts in the CDNN catalogs recently - you might start there.
     
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  8. trainsktg

    trainsktg Portland OR Well-Known Member

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  9. Russianfist

    Russianfist Sweet home, Oregon Active Member

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    Do you have a recoil buffer? I wonder if that would be putting presure on the spring. I had a cetme and it would act like this after a couple mag dumps. Once it cooled down it would charge just fine.
     
  10. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    I would not take the cocking handle out as the spring is a PITA to put back in correctly use a flash light and see if you see indentions on the metal or ware on the elbow of the handle . my first guess from the way its described is too much space in the cocking tube caused by ware or the tube being welded just a hair too far forward.
    or not enough bolt gap so its locking really tight , and heat does cause metal to expand so it may be just enough to cause inconsistancy
    the tube is a major job start with checking bolt gap and checking to make sure its not a ground bolt then check the locking pc inside the the bolt and carrier

    RTG has very few Cetme parts that address this issue try these guys but before throwing a bunch of money check bolt gap and inspect the shoulders of the locking pc
    if the locking pc is fine and the gap is not you may need + size rollers.

    https://www.apexgunparts.com/index.php/cPath/23

    i highly doubt and never heard of anything in the lower that could cause it to bind up like that . something would have to be damaged bent way out of wack to even possibly do so
     
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  11. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    The spring comes out with the upper receiver (oh that spring Yeah hard to get to the pin also)
    My dogs are waiting but since y'all are being helpful,I took more pictures,but guessing it is the wear and tear has made it sloppy

    001-14.jpg
     
  12. mkwerx

    mkwerx Forest Grove, OR Well-Known Member

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    Maybe it's just the lighting - but that bolt does look worn. The first pic even looks like it's got some odd pitting going on.
     
  13. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    Cetme parts are naturally ugly even new parts are all that nasty worn black and metal color

    the problems will not be visable in those photos

    have you ever separated the bolt from the carrier ? btw its really difficult to put them back together you'll want to find a Utube video on that as its hard to discribe

    also look a utube video on checking cetme or G3 bolt gap

    this is what you need to do in this order visually check for ware on the contact points of the cocking handle elbow and the contact point on the metal thing in the front of the cocking tube that it presses against to unlock the bolt . if its not worn deep then

    check your bolt gap with feeler guages see Utube, google,

    if thats bad separate the bolt head from carrier and inspect shoulders of locking pc if good then install + size rollers based on gap size

    If bolt gap is good you will still need to separate the bolt head from carrier and inspect the area between the bolt and carrier to look for any grind marks google ground cetme bolts for reference

    if its ground you'll need to check back here or google what to do with cetme ground bolt

    if all thats good you may need to have someone who knows cetme and 90 series hks take a look at it as the cocking tube may be welded too far forward so that the cocking handle is not able to fully unlock the bolt

    so its very difficult to pull

    you will need to good how to put the bolt back on the carrier i will tell you until you do it a few times it can be very difficult to do so check the gap first.

    and you need to know how to do that anyway as it does require some occiasional cleaning in there as well
     
  14. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    cetme bolts are just ugly like that not all polished like a G3 bolt

    its not a worn bolt . possibly a ground bolt but not a worn one.
     
  15. mkwerx

    mkwerx Forest Grove, OR Well-Known Member

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    Definitely an ugly bolt if nothing else. The Century HK clone I had had a much better looking bolt, and I don't recall the weird pitting or voids that the top pic seems to show. Badly cast part? Hard to imagine a forged part looking like that unless it was dragged behind a truck or likewise treated roughly before someone decided to install it in a gun.

    These types of issues are the biggest reason I dig AR's more than HK pattern guns anymore. Still love the way the HK's shoot.
     
  16. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    but the exterior appearance has nothing to do with the problem he is having . it may show condition of parts but not the cause. a pitted bolt head or even carrier will not cause it to lock up like that

    [video=youtube;MFESb8TK7ZA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFESb8TK7ZA[/video]

    another problem could be the barrel is pushed in too far but i doubt that one.
     
  17. mkwerx

    mkwerx Forest Grove, OR Well-Known Member

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    You have a good point - but if it's actually worn that badly, what are the chances that it's also a ground bolt or has improper gap?
     
  18. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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    thats my guess but he will need to check gap then open it up before we can make that assumption as these are the most common problem found with these rifles
     
  19. eldbillbo

    eldbillbo clackamas New world samurai and a redneck none the less Bronze Supporter

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  20. mjbskwim

    mjbskwim Salmon,Idaho Well-Known Member

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    FINALLY
    So a friend of a friend had a couple guns she wanted to get rid of and the friend wanted to go shoot 1 of them.And I took the CETME
    Man did it run nice! I had taken it apart as far as I could and cleaned it again,as big of brush as would fit everywhere.Then lots of lube.
    But when the mag was empty,and they don't hold the bolt open,I made sure to pull the slide back.
    Then the bolt dropped perfectly with the next round and buzzed through it.Seems to want to put the rounds exactly where you point the gun too;)
    All in all I am very happy with it .Now to find some more magazines.

    Thanks again for the help guys
    Mike