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CCW holder fires warning shot, faces charges.

Discussion in 'Legal & Political Archive' started by jordanvraptor, Jul 14, 2009.

  1. jordanvraptor

    jordanvraptor Oregon City, Oregon Well-Known Member

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  2. Trlsmn

    Trlsmn In Utero (Portland) Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion the guy firing the gun pretty well screwed himself, from what I see he fired the gun while advancing on the crowd of people. It's hard to know the full extent of the situation but I would not want to have to defend myself in court with that video as evidence.

    Personally I wouldn't walk toward a knife just for tactical reasons, I would let the bullet close the distance that's what they're made for. :thumbup:
     
  3. Bajablast

    Bajablast Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    Just what we need, someone who either cannot hold his liquor, keep his cool, or apparently both.

    Just because you are granted a CCW, doesn't give you license to be stupid with it.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------

    If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.
     
  4. chase

    chase Wilsonville, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    A chl license is not a license to kill, as in be offensive and walk toward the crowd. Its meant for defense as a last resort. He should never had pulled out his pistol, unless he was in immediate life threat. Also it is illegal to be intoxicated and carry a pistol. He pretty much messed his life up.
     
  5. Keane

    Keane Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    I'm gonna need some ORS on this one. I've looked through a few times, and never seen this one.
     
  6. Trlsmn

    Trlsmn In Utero (Portland) Well-Known Member

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    I second your opinion on this. Though I've seen this stated repeatedly I've never seen any laws stating this as fact (in Oregon).
     
  7. chase

    chase Wilsonville, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    Im sorry, I meant to say its not illegal to have a pistol and going to a bar or drinking. But it is illegal to have a pistol and be legally drunk of having a alcohol content over .08 BAC. Not sure were the law comes from but thats what my CHL instructor said.
     
  8. Keane

    Keane Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    CHL instructors occasionally spout BS just as much as the bubba at the range. People say the whole "no drunk while carrying", yet I've never seen a law to that effect, and I've read through the ORS quite extensively.
     
  9. chase

    chase Wilsonville, OR Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    So thank you for correcting me, I tried to find anywhere on the web or in government ORS laws, and no where does it say you cant be in possession of a handgun and be intoxicated. Under ORS 166.250 Unlawful possession of firearms, non sub provisions is being intoxicated. Although it may be a good personal choice.

    Many websites under FAQ for concealed handgun information state that it is illegal to carry and be drunk, although non of them will give a statue number.

    House Bill 2415 does Prohibits sale, delivery or transfer of firearm to visibly
    intoxicated person.
     
  10. Keane

    Keane Hillsboro, OR Active Member

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    I'd seen that house bill, but I never saw it said that it was actually passed, it died as a bill.
     
  11. ikona

    ikona west of pdx Member

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    Most gun guys would be better off if they read Miss Manners Guide to Proper Etiquette.
     
  12. Weebs

    Weebs Clackamas County Member

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    having gone to the bar that that happened at I can honestly say I'm not surprised. Gives us all a TERRIBLE name :(
     
  13. milwaukieman

    milwaukieman SE Portland Bronze Supporter Bronze Supporter

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    First of all, IMO not even an ounce of alcohol should be consumed while armed.

    As far as what we see from the video, we really need to see what/how things took place in the seconds before he drew his gun and fired a "warning shot." Remember also that we can watch that video over and over again and judge his actions and say how we would have done this or that differently, but he only had those few short seconds to figure out what was going on make a decision.

    He obviously hasn't had any proper threat management training, because any competent instructor would tell you that a "warning shot" is almost always a horrible idea. If the other guy really "pulled" a knife in a threatening manner at that distance, he would of course be fully justified in covering the guy's pelvis with his front sight and commanding him to drop his weapon.

    I also found it interesting that they didn't specify the additional charges against the shooter. It sounds like if he gets a lawyer worth his law school tuition that he'll get the "firearm related" charge dropped, which would be best.

    Were his tactics horrible? Yes. Is that a crime? No.
     
  14. tionico

    tionico Thurston County Well-Known Member

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    I read all the comments on the news report. Seems there was a bit of complication, noted by a couple of witnesses present at the scene, including the guy who took the video. Seems there were eight toughs, including the guy who pulled the knife, threatening TWO... including the guy with the pistol. Seems likely a strong defense based on "disparity of force" might carry the day. Even firing into the ground (nowhere did it say "concrete", just "ground".. could have been soft earth under grass.... we don't know) as a warning shot could be justified if it were eight big dudes, one or more with a knife, coming after me and my brother. Such a loud and unmistakable noise would cause anyone but a psycho or someone dead on their feet drunk to step back....... a knife against a gun, I know which side I'd want to be on. Like the guy here always used to say, if you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.....

    not sure what I'd have done, but two things I know... first, I'd not have been IN that place, and second, if I had, and things began to escalate, I'd leave long before they reached the boiling point and spilled out onto the sidewalk in front. I also rather think I'd hold off firing a shot to being a last resort... strong verbal warnings, plainly presenting the arm as to show I mean business, trying to back away and get my brother clear of danger as well..... of course, with eight coming after the pair of us, that does rather complicate things a tad.....

    best find a different place to pass the time. Maybe there's a reason the copshop is a hundred feet away?
     
  15. spider

    spider Hillsboro Well-Known Member

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    beer and guns isn't a good combo. CHL is a privilege given to people who can control themselves and not have these manic thoughts, about shooting a warning shot. Its almost as good as a mega horn.
     
  16. Buddhalux

    Buddhalux Hillsboro, Oregon Active Member

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    It's not a privilege, it's our RIGHT according to the second ammendment. Having to obtain a CHL is an infringment to our 2A rights!
     
  17. spider

    spider Hillsboro Well-Known Member

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    Agree!:thumbup:
     
  18. Stomper

    Stomper Oceania Rising White Is The New Brown Silver Supporter

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    +2
     
  19. durango#95

    durango#95 Medford New Member

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    YUP! The 2nd amendment IS our CCP.
     
  20. clyde

    clyde pdx New Member

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    all gun charges agianst this kid were dropped. Scared kid i would assume with no firearm training.