Can a felon ride in a car with a chl holder?

[Nwcid]

There was a time that after you served your sentence you were again a free man.

If a felon is such a bad person not to have his right restored why are they even out of jail :huh: Just something to think about.

 

[CharlesAFerg]

Interesting thread...

ASK a LAW ENFORCEMENT Offical! Get the FACTs.

There's a joke if I've ever heard it.
Those people will tackle open carriers because they don't know better.

 

[CharlesAFerg]

I typically don't have any involvement with felons. This is a exceptional circumstance. I will just say that all felonies are not created equal, and sometimes bad things happen to good people. This is one of those few times.

I couldn't agree more. I know somebody that did something that I can honestly say should NOT be a felony. Ridiculous, really.

I don't like how people demonize them completely, like they're all bad people.
"I don't usually associate with those people." etc. I've never comitted any sort of crime, but sometimes people make bad decisions, and I know that not all of them deserve the harsh consequences of a felony charge.

 

[rsmccsman]

There was a time that after you served your sentence you were again a free man.

If a felon is such a bad person not to have his right restored why are they even out of jail :huh: Just something to think about.

Back 150 years ago once you served your time and your punishment was pretty much done from a legal perspective, they didn't keep a record but communities were small and everybody knew everybody elses business so your reputation was important. Nobody trusted strangers or outsiders either. Now it is easier to be anonymous in the big city which has required computerized record keeping to take over that role that social stigma used to have in maintaining control of certain people's behavior.

A felony record is like the gift that keeps giving. It is like having another class in our society that has different rights and status. Right or wrong felons are treated differently in employment and housing ( not just guns.) In many states felons are not even allowed to vote ever, unless their felony is expunged, however in Oregon only inmates in the state prison are prohibited from voting. If they are serving time in a county facility they can still vote. Go figure. :huh: Those under supervision for Parole or probation have even fewer rights and can have their right to associate or go where they want to limited by the Judge or their PO. Conditions like no entry into bars or taverns, no association with known drug users, no contact with minors, or your spouse or children, submitting to polygraphs, search of person and property and drug testing. are all expectations for offenders serving these sentences. Sex offenders have to register their addresses every year on their birthday and within 10 days of moving or it is a new crime. Many on this forum will say that is far better than what they deserve and maybe that is true, but it is hard for someone to turn their lives around while having to be reminded constantly for life of the bad decisions that have been made, when there is no hope of it ever getting better. They literally never live it down. For repeat predatory career criminals we need these controls and that is the price they pay for their choices. For the 35 year old, who screwed up one time when he was 18 years old but has otherwise lived a good life, not so much. Having a way to earn a second chance and restore a person to full citizenship is a good thing.

I would recommend to anyone with a felony that has turned their life around to check into getting their rights restored.

Merry Christmas

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

That is assuming the LEO knows you have a gun and has a reason to remove you from the car.

I just glanced though the OR laws and dont see that it is required to declare firearms in the vehicle unless asked directly.

However it does come up on the computer that you have a CHL when they run your plates or DL. I don't make it a habbit to get pulled over but in the 4 times I have, twice they asked if I had a firearm in the vehicle and twice they didn't mention it. The two that didn't ask were pretty friendly guys and just gave me a warning, the two that asked were jerks, so I see a pattern there.

 

[el gringo loco]

The only reason I mentioned the chl, is because I carry my gun on my person when I am driving. It is under what I would consider my control at all times. The problem I have, is with constructive posession. They seem to really not define things well. It is hard to obey the law, when you don't know what the **** it is! I have looked up the law, but I haven't found this specific thing. The person has been done with probation for a good while. No restrictions against them as far as probation goes. Just wanting to make sure that they do not get in trouble.

I typically don't have any involvement with felons. This is a exceptional circumstance. I will just say that all felonies are not created equal, and sometimes bad things happen to good people. This is one of those few times.

I would say that the more that you can prove that you have actual possession, the harder it is to prove that someone else has constructive possession.

Every case is different and there are definitely felons who, based on actions over a long period of time after conviction, don't necessarily deserve to suffer a life of stigma. That said, even the kindest studies put most property, drug crime and person crime offenders (felons, not those convicted of a misdemeanor) at a recidivism rate of between 60-80% in the three years after release. I am not passing judgment on your friend, I was just sharing how any LEO that comes in contact with your friend will view him--with a healthy dose of skepticism based on national crime statistics.

As to a person "doing their time" and being done with it, I would argue that a felon should never regain the right to bear arms and that is part of the original punishment. A gun owner should be responsible and show a pattern of good decision making. In our country, all citizens are presumed to have these qualities and to be eligible to own firearms until they have proven otherwise. A felon, based on their conviction has proben most decidedly otherwise. We have a system that allows for someone to make a mistake early on and then move on and still own own firearms. That would be our misdemeanor statutes. In most of Oregon, it is fairly difficult for a first time offender, except for serious property or person crimes, to get a felony conviction. Most are allowed to plea to a misdemeanor.

 

[Karma]

Believe me, I understand the statistics involved. You will just have to believe me that this is one of the few people that isn't a career criminal or repeat offender. He made one mistake. Because of the specific circumstances involved, he got in a lot more trouble than he probably should have. That was years ago, and NOBODY would ever think of him as a felon/dirtbag.

Accidents happen, and mistakes are made in life. I have to admit at one time to being someone who thought of anyone who was a felon as a dirtbag. I guess bad things happen sometimes. I would venture a guess that most people have driven while intoxicated at least one time. The only difference between anyone who has done that, and a convicted felon is the way the drive ends. That is not the circumstances involved, but it is something most can relate to.

I would trust this person with my life, and their isn't many people I would say that about. I want to make damn sure no further trouble comes their way, that is why I started this thread. I was curious if anyone else has dealt with a situation like this.

 

[mjbskwim]

Nobody else but permit holders can have access* to any gun in the vehicle.
As long as they don't have access to firearms,why would it matter?

And what are you hangin' with felons for?

*Have access to loaded weapons*

 

[Karma]

Nobody else but permit holders can have access* to any gun in the vehicle.
As long as they don't have access to firearms,why would it matter?

And what are you hangin' with felons for?

*Have access to loaded weapons*

Have you read the rest of the thread? lol. I don't hang with felons. This is the one person I have ever been around who has a felony. I just know all of the circumstances, and I know the person. Not looking for a uninformed judgement call on the person, just the legalities involved.

P.S. I get where you are coming from, it is a comment I would have made at one time.

 

[mjbskwim]

Karma
Quote:
Have you read the rest of the thread? lol. I don't hang with felons. This is the one person I have ever been around who has a felony. I just know all of the circumstances, and I know the person. Not looking for a uninformed judgement call on the person, just the legalities involved.

P.S. I get where you are coming from, it is a comment I would have made at one time.

I guess I came to party late

here's a similar question.
Could a person with a felony live in the same house as a person who legally owns guns (roomate type situation)

I didn't go through the rest of the tread either,but this is a very interesting one here.
Be carefull for yourself and your buddy.It would suck for him,if a PO or such came over and saw gun paraphernalia and busted him.
Especially if he's on his way up.

 

[Martini_Up]

ASK a LAW ENFORCEMENT Offical! Get the FACTs.

HA hahha HA HA hahahah and HA HA!!

 

[Karma]

Ya, police officers don't always know the law. I was in a conversation with a guy I know who is a police officer a while back. During the course of the conversation he told me it was illegal to sell a gun without doing a background check on the buyer, even for a private party. There are a lot of damn laws out there, and they can't know all of them by heart. They damn well better know the ones they try to enforce though!

 

[rsmccsman]

I didn't go through the rest of the tread either,but this is a very interesting one here.

Originally Posted by Stick View Post
here's a similar question.
Could a person with a felony live in the same house as a person who legally owns guns (roomate type situation)

Be carefull for yourself and your buddy.It would suck for him,if a PO or such came over and saw gun paraphernalia and busted him.
Especially if he's on his way up. [/QUOTE]

This comes up more than you think for POs. (I used to be one years ago.) The way it was generally handled was during a home visit where the offender lived with others who were not felons or under supervision and there was a gun present, it would depend on a number of factors. If the gun was secured in the bedroom of the offender's roommate then it was not considered to be under the offender's control and he wouldn't get Detained (arrested). If it was in the offender's room, he would be arrested and the gun confiscated. In a common area like the living room. It is a little more of a gray area. In any case most POs I know get real uncomfortable in a stranger's house when they know there are guns laying around. Most would probably excuse themselves and leave in a hurry for officer safety.

 

[mjbskwim]

Ya, police officers don't always know the law. I was in a conversation with a guy I know who is a police officer a while back. During the course of the conversation he told me it was illegal to sell a gun without doing a background check on the buyer, even for a private party. There are a lot of damn laws out there, and they can't know all of them by heart. They damn well better know the ones they try to enforce though!

That is probably true .....in Massachusetts,New Jersey,and a few other like minded states.

 

[jim97701]

Why doesnt your friend just go get his record expunged?. My wife had a felony when she was in her 20's for a very silly and non violent offense. Years ago we had her record expunged and she now has an Oregon CHL and has bought 2 new handguns with a full background check with no hang ups. If you arent a career criminal and simply made a stupid mistake in your earlier years it is possible to get your rights restored, You just have to follow the proper channels, and stay out of trouble after its done and it is like it never existed. It would be well worth his time to check into it.

 

[Swedish K]

I recall a few years ago when I was working the warrant office for Corrections we had a cop pull over a car in south central with 6 guys in the car. 4 of the guys were parolees and the other 2 had outstanding warrants. They found one 9mm round on the floor of the passenger side. All 4 parolees were charged with possession/access to ammunition. They were also charged with associating with known felons. Yes it is a crime in CA for felons to associate with one another. There are exceptions - such as they can attend the same rehab meetings or if they are related or happen to work together and aren't part of the same street or prison gang.
Oh BTW - felon in possession of ammunition in CA is a Felony - so that's another strike toward the 3 strikes law.

 

[Swedish K]

Why doesnt your friend just go get his record expunged?. My wife had a felony when she was in her 20's for a very silly and non violent offense. Years ago we had her record expunged and she now has an Oregon CHL and has bought 2 new handguns with a full background check with no hang ups. If you arent a career criminal and simply made a stupid mistake in your earlier years it is possible to get your rights restored, You just have to follow the proper channels, and stay out of trouble after its done and it is like it never existed. It would be well worth his time to check into it.

+1 he should request the court restore his rights/expunge his record. A cousin had to do this after a stupid move 2 weeks before he was 18. The record should have been sealed as he was technically a minor at the time of the offense (had a bit of a temper when he caught his girlfriend cheating on him - left the dorms and went out to the parking lot to leave - busted out the windows of what he thought was his car - wrong car) The problem came about 12 years later when he decided he wanted to start deer hunting. He was buying a 30-06 and denied the purchase for a felony on his record. After contacting the court it took them a few weeks to fix it but the problem was that while he committed the crime prior to 18 his court case occurred after he was 18. They failed to include it in the sealing of his juvenile record. He now has his rights fully restored.

 

[Karma]

Why doesnt your friend just go get his record expunged?. My wife had a felony when she was in her 20's for a very silly and non violent offense. Years ago we had her record expunged and she now has an Oregon CHL and has bought 2 new handguns with a full background check with no hang ups. If you arent a career criminal and simply made a stupid mistake in your earlier years it is possible to get your rights restored, You just have to follow the proper channels, and stay out of trouble after its done and it is like it never existed. It would be well worth his time to check into it.

I don't know. I don't know a lot about this stuff. He was a adult when this crap happened, but it has been probably 8 years or better since it happened, with no further issues. I will mention that. I will also do a bit of reading on what it takes to get a record expunged.

 

[SBC97281]

ASK a LAW ENFORCEMENT Offical! Get the FACTs.

Fixed to:ASK a lawyer who specializes in this area, LAW ENFORCEMENT Offical! Get the FACTs.

Both answers are right. A LEO is going to tell you how they are going
to deal with the situation in the field when they encounter it. That is
a great starting place.

Your own attorney should be a valuable resource also, but not all
attorneys are firearms friendly. You may need to do a bit of work to
find the right attorney.

But, above and beyond all else the princible that "Ignorance of the law
excuses no man" always applies.

So read for ones' self at:

<broken link removed>

-sbc

 

[Karma]

Both answers are right. A LEO is going to tell you how they are going
to deal with the situation in the field when they encounter it. That is
a great starting place.

Your own attorney should be a valuable resource also, but not all
attorneys are firearms friendly. You may need to do a bit of work to
find the right attorney.

But, above and beyond all else the princible that "Ignorance of the law
excuses no man" always applies.

So read for ones' self at:

<broken link removed>

-sbc

I already had read the ordinances. The only problem is this line.

"who owns or has in the person’s possession or under the person’s custody or control any firearm commits the crime of felon in possession of a firearm."

I haven't been able to find what constitutes under a person's custody or control. I would imagine that if I have the gun in a holster on my person, that there would be no way for it to be in the other persons custody or control. I have talked to a couple of police officers that agree. I have also talked to a couple of officers who have no clue whatsoever.