Bugout vehicle - M1163 Prime Mover? AKA Growler

[CamoDeafie]

From what I understand, the M1161/M1163 were based originally on a UTV but then evolved (before acceptance) into what they are now. The 1161 is the std wheelbase 4 seat version, while the 1163 is a two seat/two person version made as a "Prime Mover" (i.e., traction unit or 'tractor') for hauling around highly mobile artillery and was used for scouting.

The 4 wheel steering interests me as in the PNW you can get into tight spots that are hard to get out of and 4 wheel steering is handy sometimes. The short wheelbase of the 1163 makes it even more maneuverable. At 2000+ kg, not particularly light when compared to a small off-road purpose built Jeep or a Truggy, but still interesting and much lighter than a HUMVEE.

It is disappointing that it is an automatic, but not surprising.

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As for the Unimog, different beast altogether - I would like to have one of those too - even the smallest Unimog is much larger than the M1161/1163, . They were also sold under the Case brand and some of those were used by the US military as tractors. You see them for sale from time to time often with a FEL and backhoe - which I would find useful - but you don't use them as a bugout vehicle, unless you remove the attachments - they are kind of a "fast" tractor but used to traveling off-road the implements make them kind of awkward.

View attachment 997081

You see them from time to time used by DOTs and utility orgs. Very popular for farmers in Europe.

I thought the M1161 and M1163 were originally based on the architecture of the M151 MUTT, at the least, the very first studies for what eventually became the M1161/M1163. The Marines wanted a vehicle that the MV-22 Osprey could transport internally.. so the company that made the Growlers vehicles started with a M151 based design and it evovled from there?

As to the wheelbase thing.. Jeep CJ2A was 80 inches wheelbase. The M1161 LSV has a longer wheelbase than the Jeep CJ2, but the M1163 prime mover indeed has a short wheelbase, maybe as short as the 80 inches of the CJ2A?

 

[The Heretic]

I thought the M1161 and M1163 were originally based on the architecture of the M151 MUTT, at the least, the very first studies for what eventually became the M1161/M1163. The Marines wanted a vehicle that the MV-22 Osprey could transport internally.. so the company that made the Growlers vehicles started with a M151 based design and it evovled from there?

As to the wheelbase thing.. Jeep CJ2A was 80 inches wheelbase. The M1161 LSV has a longer wheelbase than the Jeep CJ2, but the M1163 prime mover indeed has a short wheelbase, maybe as short as the 80 inches of the CJ2A?

They started there, but the Growler co. makes the John Deere UTVs and used some of that knowledge & tech too - at least from what I have read. Or maybe I misread?

How I got interested in these was today, I saw a FB profile pic of a friend of the family, who was a Marine (now civilian) with his own personal M1163. Looking closely I could see that this wasn't a Jeep, but a mil-surp vehicle (the tie downs/lift points more than gave it away). I am given to understand that these are actually fairly rare as not many were made.

 

[Stomper]

For a "bug out vehicle"..
Consider the location (US vs Europe, Africa, Australia, Asia)

Consider the following problems and see what solutions fits your needs best.

1. Maintenance

2. Ease of work

3. Parts availability

4. Commonality (ties with parts availability)

5. Fuel type

6. Access to shops/skilled mechanics

7. Electronics or lack thereof.

Edit..

8. Your physical abilities and skills

9. How much crap can it carry

10. How agile would it be?

Jeep Wrangler Rubicon with an overland trailer…. done.

 

[CamoDeafie]

They started there, but the Growler co. makes the John Deere UTVs and used some of that knowledge & tech too - at least from what I have read. Or maybe I misread?

How I got interested in these was today, I saw a FB profile pic of a friend of the family, who was a Marine (now civilian) with his own personal M1163. Looking closely I could see that this wasn't a Jeep, but a mil-surp vehicle (the tie downs/lift points more than gave it away). I am given to understand that these are actually fairly rare as not many were made.

Interesting. As to their availability.. yeah, thats the one negative towards the Growlers. Thats why I'd look at any other Side by Side UTVs or old Jeep CJ2 or CJ3s.. actually, the Mahindra Roxor was sort of based on the Willys CJ series but just a lot has changed.... so I aint sure. Me.... well. It'd be nice if one could build a 4wd version of the Honda Odyssey/Pilot single seat "dune buggy" style ATVs that isn't as big as the Polaris single seater lol.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Yerd dog dune buggies, probably very light loads.

Military UTV

Honda FX series Pilots

Unknown buggy, probably Yerf Dog type?
Polaris single seat beasty


Hafligner by Steyr Daimler Puch, related to the Pinzgauer, probably the closest to being as agile as a small ATV while having decent load carrying.. bonus points for that Unimog in background lol

 

[Stomper]

Yerd dog dune buggies, probably very light loads.
View attachment 997110View attachment 997111
Military UTV
View attachment 997112
Honda FX series Pilots View attachment 997117 View attachment 997113

Unknown buggy, probably Yerf Dog type?View attachment 997116
Polaris single seat beasty
View attachment 997115

Hafligner by Steyr Daimler Puch, related to the Pinzgauer, probably the closest to being as agile as a small ATV while having decent load carrying.. bonus points for that Unimog in background lol
View attachment 997114

Clearly, you haven't had to drive a few hundred miles in one of those during winter….. I remember some COLD A$$ slogs aboard M151's in nasty weather ranging "monsoonic" deluges, to 14"/hr snow storms, and howling winds…. Trust me on the Jeep Wrangler Rubicon.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Clearly, you haven't had to drive a few hundred miles in one of those during winter….. I remember some COLD A$$ slogs aboard M151's in nasty weather ranging "monsoonic" deluges, to 14"/hr snow storms, and howling winds…. Trust me on the Jeep Wrangler Rubicon.

No, but then again, I've ridden bicycles in winter in the Valley during their rains when I didnt have a car and didnt have internet at home lol.

 

[CamoDeafie]

Willys CJ3 and CJ2A with hardtops at least I think the top one is a CJ3, maybe CJ5?

 

[The Heretic]

Clearly, you haven't had to drive a few hundred miles in one of those during winter….. I remember some COLD A$$ slogs aboard M151's in nasty weather ranging "monsoonic" deluges, to 14"/hr snow storms, and howling winds…. Trust me on the Jeep Wrangler Rubicon.

I've ridden motorcycles thru thunderstorms and for hours in the rain (from Portland to Seattle). Abso-friggin-lutely not optimum, but it is better than walking. I used to drive a TR3 with a rag top and no side windows in the PNW winter when I was young and could not afford a proper car.

Something with a motor, a windshield and a rag top is preferable to walking. Add on a heater and I would be ok (the M1163 has several heaters - one of which is meant to only be used when it is really really cold).

 

[CamoDeafie]

I've ridden motorcycles thru thunderstorms and for hours in the rain (from Portland to Seattle). Abso-friggin-lutely not optimum, but it is better than walking. I used to drive a TR3 with a rag top and no side windows in the PNW winter when I was young and could not afford a proper car.

Something with a motor, a windshield and a rag top is preferable to walking. Add on a heater and I would be ok (the M1163 has several heaters - one of which is meant to only be used when it is really really cold).

View attachment 997124

Plenty of old Willys and Jeep CJs out here for high prices if you want just motor, windshield, 4x4, maybe heater, maybe a rag top or bikini top

 

[CamoDeafie]

If you can import or find one, a 1960s-1970s Suzuki Jimny? Little smaller than a Willys.

 

[Ura-Ki]

I LOVE my CJ-2A for what it is, but also know it's not the ideal, none really are. With the right power combo, axles and gearing, as well as the right tires and very modest lift, it's more then capable of doing everything I need it to do, and it gets pretty good fuel mileage and is stupid simple and easy to work on! Add the 1/4 ton trailer with the articulated pintle hitch, and I have a pretty decent load capacity in a very compact and agile package! Sure, it's not that comfortable, but when the going gets rough, it's way better then other options!

 

[The Heretic]

Plenty of old Willys and Jeep CJs out here for high prices if you want just motor, windshield, 4x4, maybe heater, maybe a rag top or bikini top

How many have independent suspension, diesel engine, 4 wheel steering?

That said, a Polaris MRZR in mil-spec is $30K new (half that in civilian dress), lighter weight (less than half the weight of the M1163) and almost certainly easier to get parts for (except the engine, the M1163 runs a common Cummins 4 cylinder, the MRZR has a Polaris proprietary diesel engine).

 

[CamoDeafie]

There seems to be a reason all the "best" rock crawlers have solid axles... but all the best dune/desert machines have 4 wheel independent suspension.....wasnt there a civilian UTV/sxs vehicle with a Cummins?
As for @Stomper , when have the Wrangler come in 60" total width? I want to say only the CJ2As had the narrow width??
Edit. The CJ2A-CJ3Bs came up as 59 inch width. The CJ5 went to 68.5 " wide.
Wrangler is wider than the CJ5.

The Growler is 60" wide.
Most UTVs are available in 48" to 60" width.

 

[Certaindeaf]

For a "bug out vehicle"..
Consider the location (US vs Europe, Africa, Australia, Asia)

Consider the following problems and see what solutions fits your needs best.

1. Maintenance

2. Ease of work

3. Parts availability

4. Commonality (ties with parts availability)

5. Fuel type

6. Access to shops/skilled mechanics

7. Electronics or lack thereof.

Edit..

8. Your physical abilities and skills

9. How much crap can it carry

10. How agile would it be?

This is why I drive a '72 Gremlin and carry a book of matches.








lol

 

[JeremyK]

All of you and your "Bug out Vehicles"... here's MY preferred bug out vehicle...

 

[Mark W.]

Ha, I have certainly seen them, but honestly don't really know much about them! I do know they are light weight, super compact and highly mobile, and they are sort of an everything little tractor able to move things around, sort of a modern day Jeep MB, but even smaller!

View attachment 997017

Ah its 32" longer then a Willys MB same width. And it weighs in at almost twice the Willys. So much larger then a Willys MB

 

[Mark W.]

I'll stick with my Bug Out rig

 

[CamoDeafie]

Ah its 32" longer then a Willys MB same width. And it weighs in at almost twice the Willys. So much larger then a Willys MB

Which Growler? There are two distinct versions, the M1161 LSV and the M1163 Prime Mover. The LSV is certainly the longer/larger one but the Prime Mover looks to be nearly the same length as the Willys MB?

 

[thorborg]

prime mover from Grandpa's day