Bombshell: Biden to meet with NRA!

[dmancornell]

No amount of facepalms can indicate how much you truly, truly don't understand what is going on.

And what I'm saying is your approach to 2A activism will simply result in the final death of the detritus of what was once 2A.

LOL @ "2A as it stands", because the regime cannot simply redefine the status quo as they did in 1934, 1968, 1986 and 1992, or use some mass shooting to cram their criminal bills through their house of lies (Prohibition, Charles Whitman, Luby's Massacre, Newtown?). And your "people in the center" will go along with it, as they always do.

 

[DireWolf]

But kudos on deflecting, again

Dear lord.

 

[BadMotel]

You really don't get it.

 

[chariot13]

You thinking he was a socialist confirms that easily enough.

"The apple doesn't fall far from the tree"

His father "Paul was a socialist, anarchist, and atheist whose views strongly influenced Abbey"

You claim to be akin alike Edward Abbey when the only thing you two share is that you both are very liberal. He on the other hand strongly opposed all gun control. All. "If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns." He said this to mock the idea that the Government is not the outlaw as much as the original saying "If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns."

You agree with this guy yet the one area you seem to disagree with him on is gun control because he wanted none, and your on a gun forum......

"The tank, the B-52, the fighter-bomber, the state controlled police are the weapons of dictatorship. The rifle is the weapon of democracy....If guns are outlawed, only the government will have guns. Only the police, the secret police, the military, the hired servants of our rulers. Only the government and a few outlaws. I intend to be among the outlaws." EDWARD ABBEY

 

[Boats]

I do. I doubt you get the reference beyond the surface.

Be part of the solution, not part of the precipitate.
----------
That whoosh sound you just heard was my point flying over your head.

Lol. Your "point" isn't so mysterious that it flew over my head. Your "point" isn't cogent.

"Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice." Barry Goldwater.

That's where I begin. I am an extremist on this issue and not ever likely to moderate my tone in search of some "solution."

There is no solution. There are the politicians found overwhelmingly on the left who are basically both cowards, and frankly, TRAITORS when it comes to safeguarding the liberty mentioned unambiguously in the Second Amendment.

You talk as if somehow when we are being generally vituperative about the left's other penchants for death policies and liberty sapping initiatives, that we are alienating potential allies. What a load of crap.

There are no true 2A allies on the left. They won't stay bought and paid for in the halls of power, and out in society, it is the lefty "2A supporters" who mock the true nature of the amendment by mentioning hunting and sport.

Who enables these jackwagons? Rank and file lefties.

Offending you and your ilk is inconsequential. We don't want a discussion about our rights and we certainly don't want any further "compromises" wherein it is only the true 2A supporters who are expected to make concessions.

 

[mjbskwim]

Oh I see the girls are calling each other names instead of having any useful argument again

Pass that popcorn around Redcap

There is no use in the NRA talking to a man who thinks they are all idiots who don't see the world as HE wants then to see it.
I mean it sounds cool,like what they say may be influential,but we all must understand that him meeting with them is just for pomp and circumstance

 

[DireWolf]

You agree with this guy yet the one area you seem to disagree with him on is gun control because he wanted none, and your on a gun forum......

Do you make stuff up as you go, or do you have a script?

 

[ZA_Survivalist]

You must have skimmed over the parts about how liberals love rape and murder.

As a pro-2A Left Libertarian (in the flavor of maybe an Edward Abbey) I see crap like that here. On other forums I see people that have no real clue about firearms, and want to ram crap gun control down peoples throats. Rhetoric like the above on both sides is the problem, and continues the "Us vs. Them" mentality that requires maturity and communication to overcome. As I said in another thread, ignorance is louder than reason, and it is alive and well here. The fact that characterizations like that are allowed is surprising, as I would only assume that if the tables were turned and I started saying "Conservatives like rape and murder and genocide and torture", I suspect I'd be banned in pretty short order. Not to mention it solves nothing other than reinforce stupid stereotypes, and keep a nation divided while the established plutocracy pick the carcass clean to line their own pockets.

Wake. Up.

It is US versus THEM. To think we can have some kind of utopian bipartisan agreement on the matter is asinine. It is THEM who are now after our rights and sadly there will be parts of US that through back room deals and extortion will contend to the moronic anti constitutional demands of said THEM. And it will be US who mark down those of "us" that betrayed what they gave an oath to uphold. And we will not forget.

 

[Boats]

You really don't get it.

What doesn't he get?

Tell us where the "center" on abrogating everyone's 2A rights "as it stands" is. Should be an entertaining tap dance.

 

[BadMotel]

What doesn't he get?

Tell us where the "center" on abrogating everyone's 2A rights "as it stands" is. Should be an entertaining tap dance.

He doesn't get the point I've been making this whole time, that he's going about arguing his case in a detrimental manner.

The "center" is not the group who wants to take away our rights, so I'm not sure what exactly you mean by that. The center is the group of people who want to see less violence in the face of heinous crimes.

The WRONG way to do it is gun control legislation like an AWB. That doesn't help curb gun violence at all. We can see that in FBI statistics. Giving these people in the "center" useful information might convince them of that, and they might also ask for different, actually useful legislation instead of a ban.

Now, if you take these folks in the center and shout at them about how the president is a criminal, how it's only a matter of time until an armed revolution, how it's "US versus THEM", then they think you're crazy and physically flee your locale.

THAT is what I've been saying the whole time, and seriously you just keep proving me right.

 

[Boats]

The "center" is not the group who wants to take away our rights, so I'm not sure what exactly you mean by that. The center is the group of people who want to see less violence in the face of heinous crimes.

Lol. That's the "center" as you imagine it to be. What on earth does that second sentence even mean? NONE of the trial balloons currently being floated by this criminal administration even begin to address what Adam Lanza did. Oh wait, they want to increase the penalty for carrying a gun in a school zone. Maybe they should prop up Lanza's corpse on a gurney and charge him with that. They could even look tough and sentence him to re-death.

My point is that fear, not actual fear, but political fear for their careers is the ONLY thing that keeps congress critters from aggrandizing their power at the expense of your rights. By being far more rabid than those who would take our rights, we will demonstrate to the red state dwelling blue senators that they dare not cross us. By being "accommodating" we get railroaded. It's happened four times in federal lawmaking already.

No more. The only point in talking to a leftist or a "centrist" politician on this topic is to draw the proverbial line in the sand.

I saw Diane Sawyer saying last night that when Gabby Gifford lobbies congress critters and they don't want to do anything, that they'll have to say it to her face. That doesn't take any courage, it takes conviction to one's first principles. A scrupulous pol would politely tell Gifford something like this, "I'm sorry a crazed man shot you, and I empathize with the parents and loved ones of the Sandy Hook massacre, again perpetrated by someone with mental issues, but Ms. Gifford, well in excess of three fourths of what you propose is blatantly unconstitutional and I will refuse to support it or compromise on it."

 

[chariot13]

Do you make stuff up as you go, or do you have a script?

Depends on if I was misled by your liberalism. I like redneck hippies don't get me wrong. The one area i can agree with them on is having zero gun control laws. As long as they are against all forms of gun control especially any type that gets called 'sensible gun control'. I am with you on that single issue.

 

[dmancornell]

The "center" is not the group who wants to take away our rights, so I'm not sure what exactly you mean by that. The center is the group of people who want to see less violence in the face of heinous crimes.

LOL, the "center" are the malleable, gullible dupes who will go along with any government scheme promising them security. The people who couldn't give a damn about liberty as long as the X-Factor is on TV and they can drive their kids to the soccer league. The people who willingly pay protection money to the criminal regime.

Hermann Göring figured that out in an interview with some ignorant reporter:

Gilbert: There is one difference. In a democracy, the people have some say in the matter through their elected representatives, and in the United States only Congress can declare wars.

Göring: Oh, that is all well and good, but, voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country.

Fuhrerprinzip is alive and well in the USA.

 

[BadMotel]

That's the "center" as you imagine it to be. What on earth does that second sentence even mean? NONE of the trial balloons currently being floated by this criminal administration even begin to address what Adam Lanza did. Oh wait, they want to increase the penalty for carrying a gun in a school zone.

You haven't read any of my posts, have you? Because I have not once advocated any of the gun control policy, in fact I've made it clear that I oppose it and I want to help you oppose it without sounding like a complete a$$. Apparently that is not possible, so I will stop attempting to do so.

My point is that fear, not actual fear, but political fear for their careers is the ONLY thing that keeps congress critters from aggrandizing their power at the expense of your rights. By being far more rabid than those who would take our rights, we will demonstrate to the red state dwelling blue senators that they dare not cross us. By being "accommodating" we get railroaded. It's happened four times in federal lawmaking already.

Really? How did that work last election? The fact is the extreme right has alienated themselves from such a large majority of America that not even their own party are voting for them.

No more. The only point in talking to a leftist or a "centrist" politician on this topic is to draw the proverbial line in the sand.

LOL, the "center" are the malleable, gullible dupes who will go along with any government scheme promising them security. The people who couldn't give a damn about liberty as long as the X-Factor is on TV and they can drive their kids to the soccer league. The people who willingly pay protection money to the criminal regime.

These are why, if what you said was put forth to the majority of America, they would think you're crazy. The fact that you disregard communication in favor of attempting for force your views on people only further demonstrate how unwilling you are to be reasonable Americans.

Honestly, I think you'd all do yourselves a solid and move to a warlord dominated 3rd world country like Somalia. I'm not kidding. It has just what you want, the guy with the most, biggest guns has all the power! If you disagree with someone, SHOOT THEM! You'd fit right in! Seriously, I'll help pack you bags if you want.

 

[dmancornell]

These are why, if what you said was put forth to the majority of America, they would think you're crazy. The fact that you disregard communication in favor of attempting for force your views on people only further demonstrate how unwilling you are to be reasonable Americans.

LOL, if the "center" aren't the gullible dupes as you say, then how the hell did we end up the kind of regime we have today? Also LOL @ reasonable, because kowtowing to the criminal cabal and refusing to question their legitimacy should be the basis for any debate on liberty.

Honestly, I think you'd all do yourselves a solid and move to a warlord dominated 3rd world country like Somalia. I'm not kidding. It has just what you want, the guy with the most, biggest guns has all the power! If you disagree with someone, SHOOT THEM! You'd fit right in! Seriously, I'll help pack you bags if you want.

Why should I move? I didn't vote for any of these traitors. Furthermore, implying the power of the federal government isn't backed solely by threat of violence and actual violence, just like the Somalian warlords. Except the warlords have the decency not to lie about it.

 

[BadMotel]

LOL, if the "center" aren't the gullible dupes as you say, then how the hell did we end up the kind of regime we have today? LOL @ reasonable, because kowtowing to the criminal cabal and refusing to question their legitimacy should be the basis for any debate on liberty.

And why should I move? I didn't vote for any of these traitors.

Implying that's not how things are here in the US.[/COLOR]

You don't understand how our country works. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean that they didn't get voted into the offices they're in. They don't have to be, you could do something about it and get someone else voted it, but you refuse to.

Why should you stay? You hate it here. You hate our countries leaders. You hate the majority of America. You hate the way our system works, and how rules and leaders come to be. I don't care how much you call yourself a patriot, on the sole reason that you stand by the second amendment, but you hate America. You don't understand that there can exist individuals that hold their rights precious yet aren't extreme anarchists.

I'm done with this. We've (I think) both been arguing the whole time that mounting gun control is bad. It should have been left at that, so I'm leaving it there now.

 

[dmancornell]

You don't understand how our country works. Just because you don't like them doesn't mean that they didn't get voted into the offices they're in. They don't have to be, you could do something about it and get someone else voted it, but you refuse to.

Hah, that's rich. Protip: the garbage you were taught in public school civics class isn't how the country works.

Why should you stay? You hate it here. You hate our countries leaders. You hate the majority of America. You hate the way our system works, and how rules and leaders come to be. I don't care how much you call yourself a patriot, on the sole reason that you stand by the second amendment, but you hate America. You don't understand that there can exist individuals that hold their rights precious yet aren't extreme anarchists.

Never called myself a patriot. I prefer radical libertarian.

Hating the state is a moral imperative. If you look at the vast crimes perpetrated in history by "systems", be they dictatorial, monarchical or democratic, you'd understand that.

I'm done with this. We've (I think) both been arguing the whole time that mounting gun control is bad. It should have been left at that, so I'm leaving it there now.

Yeah, same here. You can fight the hopeless rearguard action defending the detritus of 2A. Teaching people to hate the state is the only real way to fully restore 2A.

 

[Norm0931]

Biden said today that executive orders would be used along with legislation from Congress. If Obama signs an executive order about guns the House will try to impeach him. However, given the Senate is controlled by his own party I can't see him being convicted. However, the order might be thrown out.

 

[Boats]

Lol. WE don't understand how our country works?

". . .the right of the people to keep and bear arms SHALL NOT be infringed." You might not want gun control, but the people you vote in and enable certainly do.

"SHALL NOT. . . " It isn't hard. The Federal Government is PROHIBITED from having actual or implied institutional power over this topic in terms of banning the ownership of military grade personal arms. The 14th Amendment makes the Second enforceable against the several states too.

AND YET, we have "reasonable folks" arguing that this right is not immune to being circumscribed by the federal and state authorities. These "reasonable people" are usually "progressives." As one's rights are not alienable without due process, legislating one's rights away in a manner befitting of "prior restraint" is traitorous. If lefties want gun control, they should get on with the heavy lifting of repealing the 2A outright.

Yet you enable the left. Are we supposed to be impressed that you oppose what you help to make possible? That'd be like congratulating you daily on not pulling the trigger on the gun you put to your own head.

 

[RICKRWS]

Biden said today that executive orders would be used along with legislation from Congress. If Obama signs an executive order about guns the House will try to impeach him. However, given the Senate is controlled by his own party I can't see him being convicted. However, the order might be thrown out.

I hope he tries it and they impeach him and biden.