Discussion in 'Rifle Discussion' started by whutdidyousay, Aug 20, 2009.
Bolts more accurate if your good at staying still, but never hurts to come up quick with that follow up shot from a semi.
i vote semi
One shot one kill. Bolt rifles will save you money in the long run, because you would not be wasting ammo. Also, gives the animal a sporting chance to escape if you miss. :gun13:
The ability to place a quick second (follow up) shot is nice. However, there are entirely too many "hunters" willing to embrace the spray and pray mentality. My own experience (with ducks and geese) has been that one aimed shot is more likely to succeed than three shots from the hip.
U.S. Sniper records from the VietNam conflict claim 1.3 rounds expended in combat per kill. The infantry claim was 200,000 rounds expended per enemy killed by gunfire. I tend to disbelieve both numbers. Still the concept is valid.
Do you want to hunt woods where a buck running through might have an adrenaline junkie with a 20 round magizine AR10 shooting at him as he is running through the brush you are hiding in?
I vote for a BAR or a bolt gun with a 4 round Magizine.
Bolts are usually thought to be more accurate, but, modern autoloaders (such as the Browning BAR) have a more robust and repeatable locking mechanism. I don't think they are quite as accurate, although "minute of deer" is within reach. This was not always the case - some of the early autoloaders, including the Remingtons, could be accurate or not so much.
I prefer the semi-auto in dense brush and close-in work where the animals are typically fast moving and I might need a second shot. I like to keep the weapon mounted. I prefer the bolt when I'm going to take one shot over a longer distance.
For my hunting gun I got rid of my semi auto 30-06 and got a bolt action. I could never get "accurate" (sub 1" groups) consistently with the semi auto. For a deer or bear, this really isn't an issue, as the kill zone is significantly greater than 1" however, when that long shot you will occasionally be confronted with, I wanted something I could trust would make a cold bore shot, and go where I expected it to. At 100 yards a miss by 1 1/2" isnt that big of a deal, but you compound that out to 350 or even 400.. you missed the entire vital area or the animal completely. Personally I feel that for any hunting rig (bow or gun) less moving parts is better.
Your choice of .270 is a good one and I think you'll find it suits your needs well, until you go after something bigger..... Keep in mind that its absolutely critical to make sure your shots are accurate if you expect to drop any thing larger than a deer with it. Down south (Texas, New Mexico, Oklahoma) the deer are quite a bit smaller size/weight wise, and shot placement a little more forgiving so the .270 is more than enough gun for them. Up here, in Washington and Oregon, the Mulleys get big.. real big and thats not even talking about the Elk! I have seen a black bear take a hit at just over 120 yards with a 300 win mag, WITH a well placed shot, and still run for well over a hundred yards, in thick cover and it was no picnic trying to locate, blood trail and all.
Good Luck on your Hunting this Year!!! :thumbup:
I prefer bolt action guns. Specifically controlled round feed bolt guns. Simple, reliable. I hunt both west where it's all wet & tangly and the east where I might stretch a shot.
A "mulley" is referring to a Mule deer. Definitely learn your wildlife species. I've heard stories of a new hunter walking back to his group after having shot an animal. He asked the other guy in the group something along the lines of, what is the difference between a deer and an elk? Fortunately he got the right animal. The three main species of deer in the US are Whitetail, Blacktail, and Mule. You can encounter all three of these in Oregon depending where you are hunting.
I recommend you go and pick up a big game hunting pamphlet (rules and regs) and read it cover to cover. Then read it again. It will clearly define Mule Deer, White Tail and Elk, and how to determine whats a legal buck and whats not. Here in Washington they have changed rules regarding "spike" elk, and what and what not constitutes a TRUE SPIKE or a regular spike... (apparently there is a difference) There are also a lot of critters up here that are NOT legal to kill (or shoot at, pester, molest)... (badgers and a few species of rabbits here in Washington). The Game regs will also cover all the courses that you will need to take, and locations that you sign up for. If you haven't taken a hunter safety course, then your going to have to do that, but don't count on doing it this year... Most if not all are already over, and you'll have to sign up and get it taken care of next summer.
*** Sorry... just read the hunting thread and saw I repeated a bunch of stuff already stated....********
I'm traditional so I'd say bolt action. It really depends on what gun you feel you can make the shot with. If you trust the bolt, you're going to shoot better with it.
Either way, get practicing. Hunting season is around the corner.
Excellent choice on the 270 vanguard. I thought about buying it if you didn't. That should work well for most anything around here. Happy hunting!
Choose what you like and or are comfortable with shooting. I prefer bolt for several reasons one of which is they are a little less finicky to reload for and I am an accuracy oriented shooter (it does not really matter for big game at normal ranges however)....just like to squeeze all the accuracy out I can. To each their own on this one.....
I think you made the correct choice. 270 is a fantastic, flat shooting hard hitting cartridge. As for the bolt vs. semi. I personally refuse to hunt with a semi( I will save the semi's for the zombies) Sub consciously people know that the second shot is just a trigger pull away, therefore they dont take the time to make the first shot really count. I am not a pro, I have only been hunting for 22 years. I just know that I hunt with people that shoot auto loaders and it commonly sounds like ww3 when they see a deer. About 75% of the time they bag one. And I have personally never taken more than 1 shot to kill any big game animal.
Bolt action. If you insist on something with a faster second shot capability, consider a pump action, like the Remington 740/760.
Grass eaters.. a bolt gun is more than enough.
All ya need is one good shot. Besides lots of bolt action rifles have ben used in a hurry when needed.
Meat eaters... Semi auto .308 or bigger.
I have been packing a sporterized 1917 Eddystone for the last 20 years.
It was my Grandmothers rifle.
I mostly shoot 22lr. I shoot semi autos, bolts, levers and breaks. When I shoot varmints I get way more kills with the bolt than a semi. I spend more time aiming and less time wasting ammo and reloading. I also think it is funner to shoot the bolt. A lot of bolt guns are lighter, shorter and easier to clean. I have stabed my barrel into the mud and cleaned it out in a big puddle. this is not a good idea but if you do it, it is much easier to do with a bolt gun in the field.
I would look into a lever or pump gun also. have some of the advanges of both.
I would never consider a semi auto for hunting big game. People tend to take a "quick" second shot if they miss with a semi. with a bolt, people seam to aim. If you learn your gun and how to shot it, you will probably have another one jacked in before you are ready to pull the trigger again anywheys.
I'm surprised at all the talk regarding accuracy and it not mattering much in "normal" close ranges. Growing up in WI and primarily bowhunting, this was indeed the normal thought process of most. They had one pin set at 20 yards and usually practiced just a couple times before the season to make sure their sight was still on target.
First, I practiced out to 60 yards with my bow. Why? Not because I planned on shooting animals at that range, but because 10 and 20 yard shots were a cake walk if you were comfortable at 60 yards. Second, because YOU OWE IT to the animal you are trying to harvest to be as accurate as possible and to make the kill as quick as possible.
2 personal examples early in my hunting days to drive that home:
First weekend of archery season and I had a decent buck 15 yards away. I pulled the shot and missed the vitals though I was well within the general chest cavity/vital area. I searched and searched but lost the blood trail within 75 yards. I still don't know if he survived or if he died somewhere. In any case, I felt terrible.
Second was during gun season. The area I hunted was shotgun/pistol/black powder only and shots were typically close. During the last minutes of shooting light a buck walked about 40-50 yards away - I made the shot with my 12 gauge slug. Tracked for the next 3 hours in the dark with no luck. Spent the next day chasing specs of blood and spent most of my time marking the last pin drop of blood and making circles until I found another. Still no luck... Again, I went out the following morning determined to not relive that feeling of loosing a deer to a poor shot. After a couple more hours I finally found the buck still alive and very weak. One more shot and he was done. Turns out my original shot was simply low by a few inches.
Point is that close enough is sometimes not enough. Not worrying about a few inches while shooting? Yes the vital area is larger than your standard 1" bullseye, but it ain't that big. And in any case, you are still harvesting a living creature and it should be pursued with respect. I don't care if it's an auto-loader or a bolt gun or a single shot - make sure whatever you carry into the field is a gun you can always shoot with 100% confidence! Don't forget how much adrenaline is charging through you when it's time to make the kill shot. That unsettles all but the most experienced hunters adding to the challenge!
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