Poll: Body Armor....What say you?

[jnynetwk]

Especially if you can find it on sale, why not. It's the most passive protection you can do. Doing nothing is not protection.

I've had plates for a while. Unlikely to ever need them. The money I spent is long forgotten. Well under $200 for the set up. I had a daughter at Portland State 2017-18. Anything could have happened.

Plates have a Ninja wannabe stigma. So what? There are dozens of people in Portland alone that may have been saved if only wearing lower level plates.

This was my thought exactly. I saw a sale for a carrier with both plates and soft armor on AR500's web site and pulled the trigger. I don't think I'll ever actually need it but I have the room next to the safe so why not?

 

[Ligito]

I thought about getting armor for a time, but after lugging a plate carrier around for years as a ground-pounder for Uncle Sam I decided I'll probably never want to wear something like that again. My compromise was buying a ballistic shield (linked below) that sits by my bedroom door for those really big bumps in the night.

Alpha Shield™

Might not be as useful or versatile as body armor, but I think it suits my needs adequately.

Looks kinda silly, walking into the bank, with the shield.

 

[Helocat]

#1 plan never need it. But I have body armor with me daily. Have a soft plate in a 17" laptop backpack that I carry. Also, I have an IFAK blow out kit on that pack. Adds very little weight and if it was ever needed, it's nearby. (both the armor and the IFAK)

I then have a IIIA soft armor w/side plates in my office. (IFAK x2 there as well) For home, I have the full IIIA+ carrier. Also with an IFAK kit. Spartan Armor AR550 Level III+ & Flex Fused Core Sentinel Plate Carrier Package

I think total investment all in for both carriers, plates, trauma pads, and IFAK, south of $2k. If I live another 40yrs that's less than 14 cents per day.

Like I said I never plan to need it. But its a low, low cheap price vrs. life if it was ever needed, not just for me but for my family as I will be on point for them. I drop they are soft targets.

 

[fxdc]

Better to have and Not Need than to
Need and NOT Have!!

 

[rick benjamin]

Thanks to folks sharing their experiences with armor
Besides hot and sweaty, involves pain and such.
"I think" if the environment causes you to think twice, you might need...
So, I spend quite a bit of time at an active gun range.
My presence and responsibility (club RSO) co-incide with folks flinging lead.
RSOs are encouraged to wear lime green vests when on duty.
I bought a bigger than normal lime green tee shirt to wear over the vest.
Many folks don't notice the additional bulk. LEO club members notice and grin
Our brothers mentioned the pain of getting hit. I'm allergic to pain.
But I really don't like the thought of a supersonic projectile poking a hole in my manly physique (squishy and phat as it is)

 

[titsonritz]

in all seriousness though, a 10mm hot load out of a PCC would probably defeat most body armor except maybe the Level IV and IV+ hard plates.

Level III will stop it and most likely so will IIIA.

 

[Alexx1401]

Level III will stop it and most likely so will IIIA.

When you look at the ballistic tables where people are testing out the 10mm in 16 inch tubes the good ammo gets into the realm of .44 mag. This is what made me want to get a PCC in 10mm. I like having .44 mag power in 15 round mags and a nice short light rifle. So any armor set up to stop .44 mag is going to stop the 10 also. Assuming as I mentioned someone is not loading up a round made to defeat soft armor. Does not mean the one hit would not be hurting good but they would not have a 10mm hole added to them someplace they don't want it

 

[Defense Minister]

Having taken a shot to the plates at point blank, I can tell you, It ferkin hurts BAD, and will put you down and out for quite a while! Mine was a round of 7.62X39 right square in the sternum, knocked me to the ground and left me gasping for air for several min! I had a bruise for over a month and it still hurt for weeks after! That was Level Iv+ plate, imagine how much worse it would feel if that had been soft armor! That Armor had a dent in it about the size of a baseball, and about 1/4 inch deep! I would imagine a shot from any thing moving along at pistol speed or higher would hurt, and possibly take you out of a fight, at least for a while!

Were your plates stand-alone, or ICW? While perusing the internet in the past I discovered that there are these two types of hard armor and I'm curious how they are manufactured differently and why SA plates don't need the soft armor behind them. I'm definitely not the BA expert...

 

[CaptMarvel]

I have level IIIA, when I am instructing newbees that I don't know and one of my ranges requires it (pistol) IIIA is much lighter than the IV (like 20% of the weight) but obviously if anything greater than handgun ammo is in play you want the heavier plates. A good carrier is really important when it comes to comfort, ease of swapping plates and ease of adornment...

 

[titsonritz]

Having taken a shot to the plates at point blank, I can tell you, It ferkin hurts BAD, and will put you down and out for quite a while! Mine was a round of 7.62X39 right square in the sternum, knocked me to the ground and left me gasping for air for several min! I had a bruise for over a month and it still hurt for weeks after! That was Level Iv+ plate, imagine how much worse it would feel if that had been soft armor! That Armor had a dent in it about the size of a baseball, and about 1/4 inch deep! I would imagine a shot from any thing moving along at pistol speed or higher would hurt, and possibly take you out of a fight, at least for a while!

Wouldn't be feeling it for long, I don't think there is a soft armor that will stop that round.

 

[titsonritz]

Perhaps hundreds of millions, maybe even a billion or more people, maybe even several billion, have been killed by small arms wounds that can now be stopped by a $100 - $500 piece of equipment.

* Do you believe there is a general risk of violence?
* Do you train for self defense?
* Do you carry a gun for self defense?
* Do you have a gun at home for self defense and home defense?
* Do you want to survive a self defense encounter?
* Do you have medical equipment and training to treat wounds, at least until help arrives?
* Can you afford a few hundred dollars in your budget for life saving gear?

If you answered yes to any of the above questions, it is illogical to not have 1 or several sets of body armor.

I have 1 concealable vest, and several variants of plate carriers and plates depending on if I am stationary at home, or if I have to venture out in a chaotic situation or WROL type situation. Some are level III+ and up to level IV, and a total upper body kit with soft and hard armor, extra kevlar over groin, sideplates, etc. Also have a couple kevlar brain buckets for home defense or patrolling in a WROL situation.

You're obviously a psycho.

 

[SKN]

Level II for kids, IIIA for wife, ceramic IV plates in IIIA carrier.

 

[Powderman]

If I may venture a comment or two, from a professional user of body armor:

1. It's restrictive. If you wear it a long time, carry some antacid with you because you will catch heartburn like you won't believe.
2. It's HOT. Properly worn body armor is like wearing a sauna. You will radiate some serious funk when you take it off at the end of the day. And--you won't be playing around in it for a long period of time...it is entirely possible to go into heat exhaustion while wearing the stuff.
3. I wear IIIA on duty. It is rated to stop 12 Gauge slugs, and .44 Mag 240 grain JSP, pushed hot. Which brings me to the next point:
4. You will NOT walk away unscathed and unaffected by a hit on your armor. Consider getting punched by the biggest, strongest person you know wearing brass knuckles. If you're hit in the wrong area, expect bruised or broken bones. Will it save your life? YES. But expect some colorful marks afterward. This leads me to the final point...
5. Properly worn body armor is NOT one size fits all. You do NOT go to buy it off the rack. You get fitted for it. The panels are made for YOU, and the carrier is fitted TO you. Moreover, you're talking about something that is meant to STOP a bullet and save your life. Why are some folks talking about going on the cheap? If you're going to do it, do it the RIGHT way.

If you do a survey of the people who wear the stuff on a daily basis, you will hear two names: Safariland and Second Chance, with Second Chance being in the great majority.

The founder of Second Chance used to do demonstrations where he would put on a Level IIIA vest, put a thin telephone book under it, and then cap himself with a .44 Mag. His products work, and they work well. They are also NOT cheap. My Department paid over $1000 for my vest...but it is a tool that will help me to come home after my shift should the worst occur.

I noted a poster above who said something like, "Level II for the kids, IIA for the wife..." Why in heaven's name would you do that?

Get the best for EVERYONE...if you're going to use it, do it right.

 

[dirtyd]

I have a Pig carrier with level IV US army issue front/back/side plates.

 

[2A2Dend]

My having a hard time justifying not have BA, comes from viewing BA in the same realm of carrying my pistol.
Therefore I carry always. Given that, that's where my reality lies.

There's a wealth of great input in the topic, from all involved.
Some, really stand out with the words they share.

Sure I can (and have been) click the "thanks" button.
I figure this is more deserved.

On that,
Thanks

I'm teetering on the fence.

 

[CamoDeafie]

To expand on the points made by @Powderman ; gently or lightly used carriers can be OK priced, but better to buy new armor panels/inserts for the right carrier.
A 9x12 plate, while among the lowest priced "full size" options; is certainly not going to fit everyone. Even less so if say, you are over 6 ft and past 300 pounds... then that plate is gonna be uncomfortably small on you. That is the biggest reason companies have larger sizes, all the way up to 11x14 I think? Soft armor can be had that can fit a dude wearing 2xl-3xl t shirts, but they are NOT CHEAP for quality soft armor or larger plates

I used to have a Monarch 2 soft carrier and level 2 kevlar inserts with the K-15 steel trauma plate.. it was a gift from my father when he left the police department... the dept qm told him to keep the armor... because at that time, it had technically expired and they were buying new.

I currently have a Land-CIRAS XL carrier, and am always on the look out for decent deals on good SPEAR/BALCS cut soft armor inserts for the vest and lightweight plates.. right now its just display but has a use eventually it does fit me a little tight, but may be due to outer cummerbund... which i am considering making larger/longer or completely remove and run buckle side straps.

For minimal concealed armor protection, simple soft plates and steel or titanium trauma inserts (6x7 to 8x10 size) maybe doable?
I see that there are soft Level 3A plates, and hard level 3/3+ plates.

Hm. RMA offers a 6x6 Level 4 armor hard plate. Adding that to the vital zone area in front of a 3A soft armor, maybe good idea, maybe terrible idea?

 

[Blastin]

1) Yes.
2) III-A because it stops the most (of soft panels) and isn't much more than II. It's a bit stiffer but, again, not much more than II.

I don't wear it on a daily basis. Still have it from the armed security days.

Another thought for anyone spending a lot of time in a easy/common target... Throwing a ballistic panel in a briefcase or backpack if you keep one on or near you isn't a bad idea. They're in the $100 range and slip in the back of a bag and aren't too intrusive.
The end result is, without wearing armor, you can flip a backpack around to your front and be pointing a gun in someones face and have a ballistic panel between yourself and them in a few seconds.

 

[RetiredLEO]

We never had vests when I was working in uniform and by the time we got them I was an Investigator in Miami...too humid and hot to wear the one I was issued so I don't know anything about them (including the two I have).
I have one 2nd Chance soft w/ plates (Level 2, small-fits my wife-she's 5'6", 125 lbs) which is very flexible, and one Military Frag Vest, OD, men's small, also with inserts, (fits me 5'10", 170). Both are like new, appear not to have been worn. If anyone who wants them is coming to the Coos Bay, North Bend area they can have them both for $50.00.
Semper Fi

 

[RetiredLEO]

I know gun grabbers don't care, but has body armor ever been used criminally to any statistically relevant degree? I'm guessing the answer is no.

South Miami, Florida, late 70's or early 80's as I recall, just after I left. Two bank robbers on the FBI's radar armed with full auto weapons and full body armor. Long running shoot out, several LEOs killed as well as the perps, bottom line end result the FBI started issuing bigger guns.

 

[Esam85]

I have a carrier with stand alone plates. Now that im in the civilian world it mainly collects dust.