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Coming from the perspective of a man that is introducing his wife to firearms, anything I relate will be reduced to 'sample size of one' or YMMV, but I can tell you without hesitation that my degree holding, educated wife has about as much chance of operating an AR in the dark as [use your own imagination - not a good look to get banned on the first day].

How do you explain to a novice how the AR system operates, how to load, charge, clear and reload a weapon when you cannot even discuss the operating parts without pointing at them?

Versus - Pump the pump, pull the thingie, don't point it at yourself.

Just my 0.02.

You load it for them and say" flip the witch and keep pulling the trigger." They are both single to operate 3 actions (safety, pull trigger, pump) is more complex than 2 actions (safety, pull trigger)
 
How so in a self defense context? If your gonna say energy on target I wont deny a shotgun is better but 556 will still do 1200 ft lbs of energy.

Sigh. How often do you hear of a good pump shotgun malfunctioning compared to an AR? And jeez, clearing an AR for a "newb" can be a challenge all in itself. Like I said, you do you. But there's nothing you can say to convince me an AR is a better HD choice for a "first time buyer" than a good pump shotgun.
 
Sigh. How often do you hear of a good pump shotgun malfunctioning compared to an AR? And jeez, clearing an AR for a "newb" can be a challenge all in itself. Like I said, you do you. But there's nothing you can say to convince me an AR is a better HD choice for a "first time buyer" than a good pump shotgun.



Skip to 6:42, they malfunction more than you think
 
AR's malfunction more but whatever. You do you.

I never said they didn't. What I will say is if you have a reliable shotgun and a reliable AR the AR is a better choice. Pump shotguns malfunction too and the saying of "nothing can go wrong with pump shotgun" is a fallacy.

Edit: Better choice for a first time shooter/gun owner
 
I never said they didn't. What I will say is if you have a reliable shotgun and a reliable AR the AR is a better choice. Pump shotguns malfunction too and the saying of "nothing can go wrong with pump shotgun" is a fallacy.

Dude, I never said they don't or can't.

Sigh. :rolleyes:
 
Why is the a thread entitled Best Gun for Home Defense? in the "shotgun discussion"? Seems a little biased.

The best gun for home defense "for me" is an AR, the an Aimpoint Micro and Surefire DF, but my options also include an 870 I've setup the way I like as well as a Glock 19 with an SF X300-U, plus assorted clubs and pointy sticks.
 
Why is the a thread entitled Best Gun for Home Defense? in the "shotgun discussion"? Seems a little biased.

The best gun for home defense "for me" is an AR, the an Aimpoint Micro and Surefire DF, but my options also include an 870 I've setup the way I like as well as a Glock 19 with an SF X300-U, plus assorted clubs and pointy sticks.

I guess the answer is to attach a shotgun under barrel to an ar 15
 
You said an ar wont run if its been put in a closet.

I said an AR oiled and then put away for years could likely malfunction. Oil gums up, and AR's sure don't like sticky bolts. AR's also like to typically run wet yes?

Jeez man, relax.
 
I said an AR oiled and then put away for years could likely malfunction. Oil gums up, and AR's sure don't like sticky bolts. AR's also like to typically run wet yes?

Jeez man, relax.

Id need to see some kind of evidence of that otherwise im gonna have to call bs. The reason people think they need to be run wet is because all the military Ar's/ M4 varients have been beat to crap and mishandled. If its new one thats kept in shape it will run just fine with minimal oil.
 
Id need to see some kind of evidence of that otherwise im gonna have to call bs. The reason people think they need to be run wet is because all the military Ar's/ M4 varients have been beat to crap and mishandled. If its new one thats kept in shape it will run just fine with minimal oil.

OK. AR's are a better HD choice than shotguns for first time buyers.
 
Not to argue but I do want to see how oil will "gum" up a gun, i'm curious

Many lubricants, especially cheaper ones (first time buyer mind you) will collect dust and also break down over time leaving a sticky gummy residue in its place.

Let it go man. I'm sorry I even posted here.
 
How so in a self defense context? If your gonna say energy on target I wont deny a shotgun is better but 556 will still do 1200 ft lbs of energy.

55gr vs 430gr, 22 caliber vs 70 caliber. In the confines of a house, a shotgun removes chunks of meat and deflates heads.

My uncle is a trauma surgeon, and though its his opinion based on anecdotal situations, he says there is nothing more devastating. As an LEO who trains with this stuff and helps train others, the shotgun is easier to teach new shooters to get lethal hits.


Skip to 6:42, they malfunction more than you think

So, those are the clowns you chose to prove your point?
 

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